MS3 deciding specialty-rad/anesthesia/EM

[deleted87051]

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Its also very easy for a rads to pivot into something procedural (pain, breast, it, nir)

Not sure how easy it is for an average DR to pivot to pain or NIR. Even our general IRs don’t do NIR. That’s analogous to saying an average anesthesiologist could easily pivot to pain. It’s a completely different job even though pain is considered a subspecialty of anesthesia.

 

[deleted87051]

Vivek don’t know too much about except he likes tennis. Which I like.
Elon is crazy as we all know. A good article written by his first wife. They met in college.

"I Was a Starter Wife": Inside America's Messiest Divorce

In the middle of her headline-grabbing divorce settlement from Elon Musk, Justine Musk reveals the truth about her marriage.

www.marieclaire.com

Combination of being spoiled brat growing up. And too much money too early.

But all those tech guys are like that

Just saying they’ll try to squeeze “efficiency” out of healthcare workers just like Elon tried with X. I don’t think he’ll care if midlevels are unsupervised. Good enough will be good enough.

 

[odyssey2]

Not sure how easy it is for an average DR to pivot to pain or NIR. Even our general IRs don’t do NIR. That’s analogous to saying an average anesthesiologist could easily pivot to pain. It’s a completely different job even though pain is considered a subspecialty of anesthesia.

It’s a fellowship you can do out of radiology (strangely)

 

[deleted87051]

It’s a fellowship you can do out of radiology (strangely)

I know but I don’t think it would be easy for a practicing DR to “pivot” to pain medicine.

 

[sevo00]

Artificial intelligence has a lot of radiologists worried

Not sure how the future will play out or if it’s a truly real concern.

When will this rumor finally die? I’ve heard of this since college. Literally no radiologists are worried why you making up lies

 

[AKMD_1984]

When will this rumor finally die? I’ve heard of this since college. Literally no radiologists are worried why you making up lies

You’ve heard of AI since college? Lol.
Now that sounds like a big fat lie.

What I wrote above is not a lie rather a concern that AI generated reports and studies will replace preliminary radiologist reads and allow non radiologists to sign off since they are also “MD” if they can show that quality difference is not that significant.

A lot of PMR/ neurology and FP docs that own XRay and CT machines in their shops do this already. So do many ortho.

So do many chiropractors.

Making specialized skills common and reducing the acceptable standard harms not always helps a speciality. Anesthesiology has a CRNA problem for that reason. Its a scope of practice and regulation issue not necessarily “AI will cut down labor issue”

 

[AKMD_1984]

It’s use is already being scrutinized - attorneys and insurance companies already use it to evaluate physician’s documentation and assess algorithms and patterns to deny claims or reduce pay.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Artificial intelligence has a lot of radiologists worried

Not sure how the future will play out or if it’s a truly real concern.

Anybody paying attention knows it will replace radiologists within 5 years, there’s just a lot of coping on here/reddit since so many people do rads. Anybody who actually does radiology is actually less qualified to answer whether it will replace radiologists since they’ve developed internal coping/ego defense mechanisms. It’s the same for writers or artists or truckers on Reddit. Look at their communities, literally none think they’ll be replaced by AI even though they already are

ChatGPT is only 2 years old, and you don’t think with the improvements they’ve already made that it won’t be better at analyzing images in almost 3 times as much time?

 

[AKMD_1984]

Ac

Anybody paying attention knows it will replace radiologists within 5 years, there’s just a lot of coping on here/reddit since so many people do rads.

ChatGPT is only 2 years old, and you don’t think with the improvements they’ve already made that it won’t be better at analyzing images in almost 3 times as much time?

Yeah…it is a concern at minimum.

Except according to sdn amazing posters - only they and “hundreds of radiologists they’ve apparently spoken to” and known about AI “since college” know everything and the rest of us are living under the rock somewhere…

My rads friend that I have known since high school never says “I’m not worried” he just says I’m “cautious” and he says I’m trying to learn how to use AI as much as possible.

 

[hopefulraddaddypls]

Not sure how easy it is for an average DR to pivot to pain or NIR. Even our general IRs don’t do NIR. That’s analogous to saying an average anesthesiologist could easily pivot to pain. It’s a completely different job even though pain is considered a subspecialty of anesthesia.

Yeah youd have to do a fellowship

 

[hopefulraddaddypls]

Anybody paying attention knows it will replace radiologists within 5 years, there’s just a lot of coping on here/reddit since so many people do rads. Anybody who actually does radiology is actually less qualified to answer whether it will replace radiologists since they’ve developed internal coping/ego defense mechanisms. It’s the same for writers or artists or truckers on Reddit. Look at their communities, literally none think they’ll be replaced by AI even though they already are

ChatGPT is only 2 years old, and you don’t think with the improvements they’ve already made that it won’t be better at analyzing images in almost 3 times as much time?

It is interesting how non-radiologists are so certain about radiology and its future rather than those who practice it

 

[Southpaw]

It is interesting how non-radiologists are so certain about radiology and its future rather than those who practice it

I’m anes. Wish I’d done radiology. Seems like a cool field with a bright future.

 

[hopefulraddaddypls]

I’m anes. Wish I’d done radiology. Seems like a cool field with a bright future.

Sometimes I wish I did anes for pain. Thinking of doing msk/neuro then pain. But the takes on rads would be like me saying "only a matter of time until CRNAs completely take over anesthesia" or for our surgical friends who think what they do is complex "how hard can it be to train a nurse to take a gallbladder out?"

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

It is interesting how non-radiologists are so certain about radiology and its future rather than those who practice it

Talking to writers, artists, truckers, even call center people, you would assume they’re never going to be replaced either and we all know that’s not true. It’s a coping mechanism. ChatGPT is only 2 years old and there are better models for imaging.

 

[hopefulraddaddypls]

Talking to writers, artists, truckers, even call center people, you would assume they’re never going to be replaced either and we all know that’s not true. It’s a coping mechanism. ChatGPT is only 2 years old and there are better models for imaging.

Youre right, theres much better AI for imaging and radiology. And the AI used in radiology 10 years ago is worlds better than chatgpt. People have been saying AI will replace radiology for 20+ years now, meanwhile, the field becomes increasingly complex and crucial to the modern practice of medicine. Comparing radiologists to writers, truckers, and call center people tells me you know little to nothing about the field.

 

[AKMD_1984]

It is interesting how non-radiologists are so certain about radiology and its future rather than those who practice it

Relax my friend

It’s radiology

Not marine biology

 

[sevo00]

You’ve heard of AI since college? Lol.
Now that sounds like a big fat lie.

What I wrote above is not a lie rather a concern that AI generated reports and studies will replace preliminary radiologist reads and allow non radiologists to sign off since they are also “MD” if they can show that quality difference is not that significant.

A lot of PMR/ neurology and FP docs that own XRay and CT machines in their shops do this already. So do many ortho.

So do many chiropractors.

Making specialized skills common and reducing the acceptable standard harms not always helps a speciality. Anesthesiology has a CRNA problem for that reason. Its a scope of practice and regulation issue not necessarily “AI will cut down labor issue”

Saying AI going to take over radiology has been going on for years. They have an amazing job market right now where they can make 600k right off the bat working 2 weeks a month. Still have partnerships available making more than a mil. Overblown risk of AI.

 

[Account1]

Talking to writers, artists, truckers, even call center people, you would assume they’re never going to be replaced either and we all know that’s not true. It’s a coping mechanism. ChatGPT is only 2 years old and there are better models for imaging.

Talking to a medical student, you’d assume they know anything about medicine.

Short answer. They don’t, and you don’t. You far underestimate how glacial the pace of change in medicine is in with systemwide technology.

We can’t even get a reliable angiocath supply in most hospitals and you’re pretending that AI is already integrated into hospital systems in a material way. I still copy and paste or hand type things into my preops notes, literally one of the simplest most algorithmic notes in medicine. I still rate the ASA score myself. Where’s the AI changing that?

I’ve got news for you. The fact that CPRS (if you even know what that is) still exists tells you everything you need to know about how quickly AI will catch on in highly technical fields of medicine.

 

[deleted87051]

Sometimes I wish I did anes for pain. Thinking of doing msk/neuro then pain. But the takes on rads would be like me saying "only a matter of time until CRNAs completely take over anesthesia" or for our surgical friends who think what they do is complex "how hard can it be to train a nurse to take a gallbladder out?"

Robot that watched surgery videos performs with skill of human doctor

Breakthrough training system utilizing imitation learning opens 'new frontier' in medical robotics

hub.jhu.edu

 

[deleted87051]

Talking to writers, artists, truckers, even call center people, you would assume they’re never going to be replaced either and we all know that’s not true. It’s a coping mechanism. ChatGPT is only 2 years old and there are better models for imaging.

Nobody wants to talk to a robot at the call center. Truckers and taxi drivers are safe for a good while too.

 

[CopaceticOne]

The fact that CPRS (if you even know what that is) still exists tells you everything you need to know about how quickly AI will catch on in highly technical fields of medicine.

🤣🤣 Painfully true

 

[Account1]

Robot that watched surgery videos performs with skill of human doctor

Breakthrough training system utilizing imitation learning opens 'new frontier' in medical robotics

hub.jhu.edu

My premium automated needle manipulating, tissue (cloth) lifting, and cutting machine has premiered at the 1829 worlds fair in New York City!

After carefully studying the hand movements of expert craftsmen, we’ve determined the exact motions to recreate a perfect cloth stitch!

Sewing machine - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[deleted87051]

My premium automated needle manipulating, tissue (cloth) lifting, and cutting machine has premiered at the 1829 worlds fair in New York City!

After carefully studying the hand movements of expert craftsmen, we’ve determined the exact motions to recreate a perfect cloth stitch!

Sewing machine - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

And still the finest clothes are hand stitched. But medicine is a volume business nowadays.

Surgical stapler

The surgical stapler most likely has a European history. To prevent spillage of bowel contents during abdominal surgery, the Hungarian surgeon Hümer Hültl

academic.oup.com

 

[CopaceticOne]

My premium automated needle manipulating, tissue (cloth) lifting, and cutting machine has premiered at the 1829 worlds fair in New York City!

After carefully studying the hand movements of expert craftsmen, we’ve determined the exact motions to recreate a perfect cloth stitch!

Sewing machine - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

And yet humans still operate industrial sewing machines to this day. The throughput is higher, but there is still a need for the actual humans. I would posit it is because of the deformable nature of the fabric material - for comparison, examine the use of automation in automotive manufacturing.

Just think of how many ways the human body can throw a curveball even to humans.

 

[Account1]

And yet humans still operate industrial sewing machines to this day. The throughput is higher, but there is still a need for the actual humans. I would posit it is because of the deformable nature of the fabric material - for comparison, examine the use of automation in automotive manufacturing.

Just think of how many ways the human body can throw a curveball even to humans.

And we all know there’s a crucial population of perfectly shaped, healthy, elective gallbladder patients that desperately need care from artificial surgeons through 20 million dollar machines that break constantly.

Just what the third world needs. An expensive metal pokey machine that can be stripped for precious metals once it breaks down and the AI Intuitive surgical rep is nowhere in sight.

 

[T-burglar]

Anybody paying attention knows it will replace radiologists within 5 years, there’s just a lot of coping on here/reddit since so many people do rads. Anybody who actually does radiology is actually less qualified to answer whether it will replace radiologists since they’ve developed internal coping/ego defense mechanisms. It’s the same for writers or artists or truckers on Reddit. Look at their communities, literally none think they’ll be replaced by AI even though they already are

ChatGPT is only 2 years old, and you don’t think with the improvements they’ve already made that it won’t be better at analyzing images in almost 3 times as much time?

Shut up idiot

 

[AKMD_1984]

Saying AI going to take over radiology has been going on for years. They have an amazing job market right now where they can make 600k right off the bat working 2 weeks a month. Still have partnerships available making more than a mil. Overblown risk of AI.

Ummm

Again, where did I say that AI “will” take over radiology? Please show me that from what I wrote above.

What is true and it is already happening is more access, and making radiologist-read more “common” by patterns and algorithms recognizing, learning and adaptability.

Is that good for radiology? Or medicine? I don’t know. More access may be good for public but bad for radiology? Who knows.

It certainly will not replace radiologists or any physician and no one knows what will it do. But I do not use extreme language in predicting the future one way or other. That’s foolish.

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Shut up idiot

Lmao

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

Nobody wants to talk to a robot at the call center. Truckers and taxi drivers are safe for a good while too.

I think that is very rare. Most studies have shown they’re much safer than human drivers. They’re actually already starting to hurt Uber drivers in LA/phoenix

 

[sevo00]

Anybody paying attention knows it will replace radiologists within 5 years, there’s just a lot of coping on here/reddit since so many people do rads. Anybody who actually does radiology is actually less qualified to answer whether it will replace radiologists since they’ve developed internal coping/ego defense mechanisms. It’s the same for writers or artists or truckers on Reddit. Look at their communities, literally none think they’ll be replaced by AI even though they already are

ChatGPT is only 2 years old, and you don’t think with the improvements they’ve already made that it won’t be better at analyzing images in almost 3 times as much time?

This the dumbest take I ever read on this site.

 

[A Deep Breath]

Not sure how easy it is for an average DR to pivot to pain or NIR. Even our general IRs don’t do NIR. That’s analogous to saying an average anesthesiologist could easily pivot to pain. It’s a completely different job even though pain is considered a subspecialty of anesthesia.

About 1/3 of the time I learn of a physician practicing pain, they didn't do a pain fellowship. Plenty didn't even train in one of the specialities that's eligible to do a pain fellowship.

Take that with a grain of salt, however, since other pain docs on here don't seem to share my experience. And I think we all agree a fellowship leaves all doors open, is good future-proofing, and is what's best for the patient.

 

[hopefulraddaddypls]

I think that is very rare. Most studies have shown they’re much safer than human drivers. They’re actually already starting to hurt Uber drivers in LA/phoenix

You sound like an internist

 

[deleted87051]

About 1/3 of the time I learn of a physician practicing pain, they didn't do a pain fellowship. Plenty didn't even train in one of the specialities that's eligible to do a pain fellowship.

Take that with a grain of salt, however, since other pain docs on here don't seem to share my experience. And I think we all agree a fellowship leaves all doors open, is good future-proofing, and is what's best for the patient.

Pain is the Wild West. Private offices with zero oversight.

 

[A Deep Breath]

I don’t understand why insurance reimburses everyone, though. I’ll bet they’d put up a fight if I started scoping joints.

 

[deleted87051]

I don’t understand why insurance reimburses everyone, though. I’ll bet they’d put up a fight if I started scoping joints.

The insurance company is not the gate keeper. Medical staff credentialing committees are.

 

[A Deep Breath]

I’ve heard a few pain doctors are doing scopes, as you probably know.

Do they have no issues with reimbursement if performed in their own ASC?