MSTP vs MD

[Res-J]

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So it should be pretty clear to everyone that MSTP programs and MD programs look for different things in your application. Is one "harder" than the other to get into? I know this depends on the applicant so I gave my numerical stats earlier but on top of that I have great research experience as well as clinical, a few EC's but very little volunteering.

Basically, based on pure numbers I would say that its harder for me to get into MSTP. On the other hand, I would think my credentials would be better suited for an MSTP over MD. How should I split up my applications? If you read this, thank you!

 

[Neuronix]

The acceptances vs. applicants ratios for MSTP in general are better than the ratios for MD in general. This may create the illusion that MSTPs are easier to enter than MD-only programs. However, the average accepted stats for MSTPs are much higher at most schools than for MD programs. Regardless, it is somewhat easier to predict the sucess of MD/PhD applicants because it is more of a numbers/research experience game than MD applications.

My advice to you is that if you are sure you want to do MD/PhD, just apply MD/PhD at all the schools you are interested in. Most schools will kick you back to the MD committee if you are not accepted by the MD/PhD program. Two schools (Hopkins and UChicago) will not consider your application MD-only with a MD/PhD rejection (unless there is a special circumstance) and certain other schools are rumored to rarely do it (Penn for example). Otherwise, you should be alright to be evaluated for both programs.

Could you post your stats again? I cannot find them (yeah, I didn't look very hard either), and I would feel more comfortable giving you advice about applications if I knew your exact GPA/MCAT/Research Experience.

 

[Simon]

Actually, in my experience, Hopkins does kick you back into the MD pool if you don't get MD/PhD. When I got the rejection e-mail that I wouldn't get an interview for the MD/PhD, one of the things it said was that they were ready to give me an MD-only interview if I am interested in the MD-only or MD ---> MD/PhD route.

 

[Neuronix]

Interesting. From what I've heard there was only 3 who got that offer. You must be one of the 3. Makes me wonder why the MD-only committee didn't like me, but whatever, screw em.

 

[CaNEM]

Originally posted by Neuronix
Interesting. From what I've heard there was only 3 who got that offer. You must be one of the 3. Makes me wonder why the MD-only committee didn't like me, but whatever, screw em.

Neuronix, you are right in that Hopkins unfortunately only gives this opportunity to a few people. The three people you are talking about, however, only count those that were rejected post-interview during the first decision date. On that day, a couple acceptances were made, three people were rejected but asked if they wanted MD only consideration, and the rest were rejected without being given this opportunity. Note that since then there has been a second decision date, and there will be one more, in which a few additional people might be given the opportunity. I am not sure how many pre-interview rejects they offer this too, but that number is small as well.

I disagree with this policy, but I think the reason they do it is this: Although the full MD committee plays no part in MSTP admissions, Dr. Weiss, the Assoc Dean of admissions is also an MD/PhD committee member. He's basically the one who judges whether or not an applicant is strong for the MD portion. If the committee feels an applicant is not strong enough for the PhD, but Dean Weiss feels he or she might be an great MD candidate, an exception is made in the usual policy, and that candidate is given a chance for MD admission.

 

[tBw]

originally posted Res-S
Basically, based on pure numbers I would say that its harder for me to get into MSTP. On the other hand, I would think my credentials would be better suited for an MSTP over MD

you're right that there are pretty different criteria applied to each applicant pool. I have had several interviews where people have asked me either (a) why didn't you apply MD/PhD and pointed out that I would have been a much more "sure thing" if I had or (b) at interview two different schools have actually asked me if I would consider changing my app right there and then to MD/PhD...

going md/phd gets round residency requirements of course too. However (my point), is that although some people might find it advantageous and some people might find MD/PhD tougher, at the end of the day you should decide which fits your career and go that path (if remotely possible...) ...if you really think you want the MSTP and you have the numbers+research I'm not sure I would even include straight MD apps...but thats just me.

 

[Res-J]

My stats changed a bit from last time:
3.61/39/1.5 years research with 2 publications

 

[Neuronix]

Originally posted by Res-J
My stats changed a bit from last time:
3.61/39/1.5 years research with 2 publications

You got plenty of numbers. You should be good to get into at least a top 20 MSTP if you have some ECs, LORs, and can interview well.

 

[brandonite]

Originally posted by Neuronix
You got plenty of numbers. You should be good to get into at least a top 20 MSTP if you have some ECs, LORs, and can interview well.

I'd agree. This is always something of a crapshoot, but you said above you have a strong background in research, so I think you are well set. Good luck...

 

[khan]

If you get waitlisted on MD what are the chances to ge into MSTP? Are these things independet?

 

[Neuronix]

khan, it depends on the school. There are four kinds:

1) At Baylor or UMich for example, MD and MSTP admissions are separate, so you could theoretically be accepted for MSTP and not MD on the same time frame or different, independant time frames.

2) On the other hand, most schools will consider you first to the MSTP, and then if you are rejected or waitlisted to the MSTP, they will consider you for the MD. This is why most schools do MD interviews when you come to visit the MSTP.

3) There are also a bunch of schools that consider you for the MSTP and really do not consider you afterwards to the MD program. Certain schools come right out and say they will not give you MD consideration if rejected/waitlisted by the MSTP (UChicago), and certain schools are suspected of it. There is always some debate about this, and for a couple reasons I suspect that certain big name schools are less likely to consider you MD if you are passed by on the MSTP side.

4) There are a few oddball schools like UCSF and URochester who consider you first to the MD program and you must be accepted MD first before MSTP consideration.

Hope that clears it up.

PS: Hey brandonite, could we get a MSTP Forum FAQ? I'd be happy to write it. We could make it sticky at the top of the forum thread list and something like this response would go right into it.

 

[brandonite]

Originally posted by Neuronix
PS: Hey brandonite, could we get a MSTP Forum FAQ? I'd be happy to write it. We could make it sticky at the top of the forum thread list and something like this response would go right into it. [/B]

I'll look into it. Give me some time to look into it.

If any of you have any questions/concerns about the board, PM me or email me. I try to check here daily, but during exams...

 

[Res-J]

Thanks for all the input everyone. What did you mean by "top-20" MSTP? You mean top 20 med school with a program? I thought MSTP's weren't ranked.

 

[Neuronix]

Originally posted by Res-J
What did you mean by "top-20" MSTP? You mean top 20 med school with a program?

Yep, that's what I mean. To be fair though, I should amend that to top 25. Schools like CWRU and Northwestern have quality MSTPs and they are tied for #22.