PhD/PsyD MSW to Doctoral Degree

[Claudum]

I am currently an undergraduate student in social work. My ultimate goal is to work with immigrant and refugee youth. Because many jobs in the area require a MSW, I am planning to straight into my graduate degree in social work with a special emphasis in refugee and immigrant issues. I am pursuing social work because of a graduate focuses in refugees and immigrants and its versatility, unlike (in my opinion) degrees in counseling or psychology. However, I could also see myself wanting to go further than a master's degree, simply because I love learning and am maybe interested in being a professor. However, from what I've seen, a Ph.D or Psy.D in counseling psychology would provide the expertise that I am looking for in immigrant mental health and multicultural psychology. A doctoral degree in psychology also would allow me to expand on clinical practice, while a DSW (from what I've seen) is designed specifically for people who want to be professors. So, in light of my interests in clinical practice and refugees/immigrants, would a MSW to a doctorate in counseling psychology make sense? Thank you for your insight!

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[R. Matey]

It can be done, but you will essentially be starting over as a B.A./B.S. level admit since the helping professions are becoming more siloed from one another. Keep in mind also that a Psy.D. in counseling psychology is (a) quite rare, (b) unfunded, and (c) will likely not help you achieve a faculty position. If you're set on becoming a social worker, then why not a Ph.D. in social welfare/social work if what you want is to teach? Your current faculty would likely be able to guide you on this path.

 

[summerbabe]

However, from what I've seen, a Ph.D or Psy.D in counseling psychology would provide the expertise that I am looking for in immigrant mental health and multicultural psychology.

Skills learned in a PhD would certainly be applicable but I think very few licensed psychologists are working exclusively or even primarily with immigrants/refugees. There are therapists (both with MS and PhDs) who may get a decent amount of referrals for therapy for things like trauma and adjustment but you’ll likely be doing plenty of other things as well.

My ultimate goal is to work with immigrant and refugee youth.

The big question is what you want ‘work’ to look like and identifying which tasks would only be possible with a PhD in psychology. For example, if you get a lot of satisfaction from connecting people to services, a PhD in psychology would actually move you further from doing that kind of day to day work. Specialization comes with benefits but also costs.

One piece of great advice I received was to pay attention to people’s titles and their educational and work backgrounds. As you continue your studies and hopefully continue to gain volunteer/field experiences, make sure to also take time to network and seek out mentoring from people who do work that you think you may want for your career. You might be surprised as how willing people are to answer questions, share their background, and even stay in touch as you make these decisions.

would a MSW to a doctorate in counseling psychology make sense?

If you do decide on this path, just know that you’ll still need to find a way to get psychology research experience and meet psych pre-reqs as your MSW degree and any clinical experience won’t be seen as adequate prep since it’s in a different discipline. Good luck!

 

[Justanothergrad]

It can be done, but you will essentially be starting over as a B.A./B.S. level admit since the helping professions are becoming more siloed from one another. Keep in mind also that a Psy.D. in counseling psychology is (a) quite rare, (b) unfunded, and (c) will likely not help you achieve a faculty position. If you're set on becoming a social worker, then why not a Ph.D. in social welfare/social work if what you want is to teach? Your current faculty would likely be able to guide you on this path.

This.

 

[Claudum]

It can be done, but you will essentially be starting over as a B.A./B.S. level admit since the helping professions are becoming more siloed from one another. Keep in mind also that a Psy.D. in counseling psychology is (a) quite rare, (b) unfunded, and (c) will likely not help you achieve a faculty position. If you're set on becoming a social worker, then why not a Ph.D. in social welfare/social work if what you want is to teach? Your current faculty would likely be able to guide you on this path.

I am not necessarily set on being a social worker, actually. At one point, I was planning on being a school counselor who specialized in immigrants and refugees. Then, I realized that social work programs had special emphases in refugees and immigrants, and that I could learn more about my chosen field within my degree. Additionally, with a BSW, I can be doing what I want - LCSW/LPC/LP therapy - within a shorter time and lots of practical clinical experience as part of my schooling. However, knowing myself, there will be a point in my time as a therapist that I will want to learn more in the area of multicultural psychology and trauma. I'm not sure yet if I'll want to teach or simply work in an environment that requires a more advanced degree in the area. From what I've seen, counseling psychology departments have the experts in this field rather than DSW programs.

 

[R. Matey]

I am not necessarily set on being a social worker, actually. At one point, I was planning on being a school counselor who specialized in immigrants and refugees. Then, I realized that social work programs had special emphases in refugees and immigrants, and that I could learn more about my chosen field within my degree. Additionally, with a BSW, I can be doing what I want - LCSW/LPC/LP therapy - within a shorter time and lots of practical clinical experience as part of my schooling. However, knowing myself, there will be a point in my time as a therapist that I will want to learn more in the area of multicultural psychology and trauma. I'm not sure yet if I'll want to teach or simply work in an environment that requires a more advanced degree in the area. From what I've seen, counseling psychology departments have the experts in this field rather than DSW programs.

I was referencing a Ph.D. in social welfare/social work not necessarily a DSW program. My understanding of the distinction is the DSW is more applied than the Ph.D. I'm also not sure the BSW prepares you to be a licensed psychotherapist in any state, but you certainly can obtain a caseworker position with your credentials depending on where you are. I actually interviewed for a position that directed a program of BA level folks working directly with immigrant and refugees in a major met back when I was a master's level clinician.

While it is certainly true that counseling psychology programs focus on multicultural and contextual factors, doctoral programs in counseling and social work do as well. I'm not discouraging you from pursuing counseling psychology if that is what you what, but bear in mind that in order to be competitive for a counseling psychology doctoral program, you will need to follow much of what @summerbabe recommended above. That includes obtaining adequate pre-reqs for a doctoral program in psychology and gaining some research experience in an area of interest to counseling psychologists.

 

[summerbabe]

However, knowing myself, there will be a point in my time as a therapist that I will want to learn more in the area of multicultural psychology and trauma. I'm not sure yet if I'll want to teach or simply work in an environment that requires a more advanced degree in the area.

I would encourage you to identity every possible avenue of accomplishing this goal, including non-degree oriented continuing education like attending workshops or seeking out consultation/supervision, along with PhD studies.

Broadly speaking, the only thing clinically that a psychologist would be able to do that a MS therapist couldn’t is use objective assessment measures while diagnosing, which probably isn’t as relevant for this population as in other types of clinical work.

For anybody who has a really specific focus for a PhD, admissions could get even harder. In your case, you’d probably only be able to fully satisfy this goal in a program located in an area with large refugee/immigrant populations and professors who actively research/work in these areas. That’s gonna eliminate a large majority of PhD programs from the get-go.

Additionally, become really familiar with every major psychologist competency. For example, even if you have zero interest in cognitive assessment, you’ll still need to gain basic competency in administering and interpreting IQ tests and cognitive screeners in grad school. And you’ll need to make the case for pursuing psychologist training during admissions as most programs want to see overall interest and commitment to all areas of this field and not just within a specialty.

 

[Mama Bear]

Investigate programs at institutions located in the border states. Some may have a focus with immigrant populations or may have faculty conducting research with these populations.