My dream : Getting into radiology residency as an IMG ( Europe )

[Milkchocolate92]

Hello Everyone, EDIT : Created a new post on Internal Medicine section

I am a 6th year med-student from Europe.
My dream is to live and work as a radiologist in the USA.

I know this has been asked so many times.. I have spent hours reading this kind of thread.
I made a plan to complete my goals and my wish was to have your opinions about it.

Why in the USA?
Mainly for the research opportunities and the lifestyle.

Things are sad in Europe. Socialism-communism dictates our lives especially in France and in Belgium.
Non-working people are legions and government encourages them.. leaving no chance for young students to pursue their working dreams.

Money is not my main interest, as I could easily go to Switzerland ( 5h drive ) or Northern Africa.

Why radiology ?
I am fond of basic science.
Radiology is physics and maths helping the medicine, I find this is one of the most interesting field in Medicine, Oncology as well.

Anyway, this is a well-thought choice as I have been thinking about it since high school.
I have been reading forums (STD, Usmle..) ,boards ( reddit,..) and websites ( ECMFG, elective.us ).

I’ve established a plan to pursue my dream and I would like to have your opinions about it.

Done :

- Finish med school lessons with correct grades : average 14/20 for whole my 6 years

- Get some Rads publications

To achieve :

1) Summer 2015 : Pass TOEFL and get some LORs

2) May 2016 : Finish Medicine and get a place in Radiology Residency.

3) June 2016 or September 2016 : Get a radiology elective, as I have not pass step 1 yet, I have very limited options :
UCSD / Harvard / Yale / UTSW / NYU / Connecticut

4) Summer 2016 : Pass step 1

5) October 2016 : Start Rads residency.

6) Summer 2017 : Pass step 2 CS and CK during the year, getting ECFMG certified.

My big question is what to do next :

A) Finish residency and fellowship ( 5 years) , then try to get a residency position through the match ( 2021 )

B) Finish residency and fellowship here ( 5 years) , then try to get a fellowship position ( which is 2 or 3 years ? ), avoiding me to do a complete residency program again. Problem is the board certification -> I read some rads fellowship program give access to this certification, is it true ?

C) Try the Match as soon as possible ( while I am still in Rads residency ), 2018 for example. If I get matched at this moment, I will not be Radiology accredited home.


I have thought about my favorite locations : Cali ( ofc ) and Florida.
I’d love to work in a sunny country ( Like everyone) , but it is an “ extra “

I know these are extremely competitive, plus administrative stuff ( Cali’s letter )..

Is there any other places with good weather, not far from the sea and IMG friendly ( In this list for instance : http://www.caribbeanmedstudent.com/2014/02/which-states-are-most-img-friendly/ )
Anyway, just being accepted in one single radiology program would be a huge victory for me..


By the way, I am visiting California this September 2015... Should I go introduce myself in an unofficial way to UCSD for example ? ( Informing them before ofc )

Should I mail specific programs before taking the whole process ?

I do have a lot of other questions and I hope will get some answers in this thread ( Should I post in the IMG-section too ? )

I will also try to contact RadRounds and post their advices here.



Best regards to everyone,


Mr. Milkchocolate


PS : If anyone can help me once I'll be in California, I solemnly promise I will bring him the best chocolate and the best beer he will ever taste ! ( this is NOT a corruption attempt )

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[colbgw02]

I don't see any utility in completing a Belgian radiology residency and then a residency in the U.S. as long as the alternative pathway is open. Your best road might be completing a Belgian residency and then getting certified in the U.S. via the alternative pathway by completing 4 years worth of fellowships. You can learn more about this option at theabr.org.

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Thank you for your reply, but 3 years residency belgium + 5 years US or 5 years residency belgium + 4 years fellowship seems nearly the same isn't ?
Is there any differences in the :

A) competitiveness
B) Learning
C) Lifestyle
D) Salary

between the residency and the fellowship program ?

Best regards,

M.

 

[colbgw02]

Differences in competition is the principle benefit of the alternative pathway. Many radiology fellowships do not participate in a match program, and there are quite a few unfilled positions in less popular fellowships every year. It's very easy for a fellowship program director to just hire another fellow as compared to going through the match for residency, and they're often motivated to do so to make their own life easier.

Also, many radiology fellowships, to include excellent ones, don't bother with ACGME accreditation. This also makes it easy for them to simply hire a fellow, but it also has lifestyle implications for the fellow, meaning that they can work you as hard as they care to.

Learning will largely be what you make of it. Obviously as a fellow you will be expected to work on a level equal to that of recently graduated U.S. radiologists, who - in theory at least - are ready for board certification. If the residency of your home country isn't up to standards, then you will struggle.

Salary as a fellow is only marginally better than during residency. I don't think that should be a major contributing factor in your calculus.

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Ok, If I get you right :
I have to finish rad residency in Belgium -> Then postulate to fellowship position, no ECMFG requirement ( Though I am pretty sure of doing step 1/step 2 ck-cs during my belgian residency )
About the lifestyle, I suppose the negative part is to be bound to one hospital for 4yrs, letting them do whatever they want with me.
What will I get at the end of this fellowship ? An official license for practicing radiology in whole US ? What about special state requirements ( Cali's letter ? ) ?
Is a fellowship in a sunny part of the US easier to get than a residency position ?

Best Regards,

M.

 

[colbgw02]

I can't speak to the specifics of ECMFG, as I don't know much about it. However, you will need to become licensed to work in at least one state in the U.S.

The downside of the lifestyle isn't being bound to one hospital for 4 years, because that situation is entirely analogous with a residency program. The difference is that residents are afforded some rights and protections by way of the ACGME. Many, but not all, fellowships are not bound by the ACGME.

If you complete the requirements of the alternate pathway, then you will be board elibible after your 4th year of fellowship. You can then sit for the final certification exam about 15 months later. For a reasonable chance at gainful employment, you will need to be both licensed (regulated by the states) and certified (governed by specialty boards - the ABR in this case).

 

[PlutoBoy]

Try the match as soon as possible. Don't wait to finish medical school. Just sign up for USMLE step 1 now and start working on it. I don't see the need to wait until 2021. You should be able to take step 1 and 2 CK by the end of the year. If you graduate next year it wouldn't be unreasonable to hope to match in 2017. The programs you are interested in are very competitive though.

I believe you don't need to take TOEFL. USMLE Step 2 CS is enough.

Also rads isn't math and physics helping medicine

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Hey,

Thank you all for your answers and your sympathy.

I have now a pretty clear idea of how hard and how long the path is to pursue my dream, I am starting my prep right away

My goal for Oct 2016 is : Toefl done ( Summer 2015 ) / Step 1 done ( Summer 2016 ) / get an elective in rads ( Sept 2016 )

I will update this post with every achievement ( or fail ) I will make.

See you soon !

 

[mdrx242]

Hey MC,
I am doing my radiology residency in Belgium, I am already USMLE certified and going to do my fellowship in the states.
Do not hesitate to contact me if you need any further info or details.
I can give you all the study materials for the USMLE steps as well.

Best of luck

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Hey MC,
I am doing my radiology residency in Belgium, I am already USMLE certified and going to do my fellowship in the states.
Do not hesitate to contact me if you need any further info or details.
I can give you all the study materials for the USMLE steps as well.

Best of luck

Mp

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Hello everyone , little update on my plans :

After a long period of uncertainty, I finally made my choice. I talked to some members by PM and I am going to follow their advices and not starting radiology residency here in Belgium (even if my spot was nearly secured). I will start to whole ECFMG process in few weeks. I kept on doing research in my institution ( 1 pub, 1 abstract in rad journal so far) and passed TOEFL iBT (106). That being said, I lost a lot of time and missed the electives period opportunity (Compulsory radiology clerkship to apply for my home's program).

I am currently trying to strengthen my CV in order to participate to the 2017-2018 Match season.
I'd like to get USCE while studying for step1 as I have now full free time to organize myself.

I've applied to some summer electives. However, I might be ineligible since my expected date of graduation is June 2016 (but my last academic year officially ends in September 2016).

I read many threads about USCE on forums, google,.. and it seems that I have only few options :

Externship : Hands on experience but rarely offered in "Heavyweight" hospitals, LORs less appreciated by Program Directors..
Research experience : I'm currently sending tons of mail. Got an encouraging answer from Hopkins, still waiting for their approval to apply.
Observership : " Better than nothing" option, I do not found any radiology opportunity on google


My ultimate goal is to get into a Radiology program in CA but I both enjoy radiology and oncology field (IM, Radonc). Since my dream is to get in a Cali program, I guess I should focus on finding USCE in these fields (pref for radiology ofc), in California.

May I ask for your help about :

1) Externship/Observership: Does anyone know a meaningful opportunity in Radiology or IM in CA state?
2) Research experience : I am currently digging UCSD,UCLA,UCSF and Stanford website to find a PI that may have interests in my field of research (Body composition by imaging modalities in Oncology). There are a lot of ways to find that "very" PI : Faculty website and interests, NIH Research portfolio, Pubmed, Specialized lab in the institution.. It is time-consuming but I am highly motivated and ready to dig until I find ! Any help would be appreciated Also, should I check other institutions?

Btw, I fixed my "deadline" for passing step1 in November 2016. This forum is going to be my "check before sleep" place and I will keep updating this post with my strategy, study material and finally..results . I'm gonna work my *ss off for the next few months and this forum seems to have a real supporting community. I read so many success stories, thank post from successful applicants.. It's gonna be an exciting (and stressful) journey

Thanks

 

[jfgavina]

Hi milk chocolate, sent you a PM!

 

[Milkchocolate92]

Hi guys ! Could someone help me about an elective requirement I do not understand ? I just had the approval from my faculty to postpone my expected date of graduation in September 2016. Therefore, I am now eligible for summer electives. However, deadlines are passed for a lot of programq and since I do not have step one yet (October 2016), I have very limited options.

I am currently checking nearly every University website. I don't get one of the immunization requirements :

" Tuberculosis Screening and Chest X‐Rays (ONE of the following is required) :
a. Documentation of 2 skin tests (PPD); #1 within 12 months of start date, #2 within 3 months of start date of the 1st month you have applied for. DO NOT SEND IN YOUR APPLICATION WITHOUT THE 2ND PPD. Your application will be considered incomplete and will not be processed.
b. For individuals know to be TB skin test (PPD) positive, documentation of a chest x‐ ray report which rules our active tuberculosis or Tspot within 1 year of your full rotation dates.
c. Documentation of negative QFT or Tspot within 12 months of your full rotation dates; if positive QFT or Tspot, then documentation of a chest x‐ray report which rules our active tuberculosis within 1 year of your full rotation dates.
d. A TSpot or chest x‐ray within 1 year of your full rotation dates is required for ALL students who have a history of childhood BCG vaccination. Please fill out the pertinent information in the left box of the Certificate of Immunization form."

I guess I am in the a) category. However, I don't understand the meaning of "within". Does it stand for "before" ? For instance, I have a previous PPD negative result, which is a few years old. What is correct :
1) to get myself checked in the next few days and then 3 months prior to the start of the elective.
2) to provide my 2 years old proof of negative result and then a second proof of negative results 3 months before the start of the electives.

Thanks


PS : jfgavina -> answering you soon, I am a bit in a hurry for my applications xD

 

[Mad Jack]

Hi guys ! Could someone help me about an elective requirement I do not understand ? I just had the approval from my faculty to postpone my expected date of graduation in September 2016. Therefore, I am now eligible for summer electives. However, deadlines are passed for a lot of programq and since I do not have step one yet (October 2016), I have very limited options.

I am currently checking nearly every University website. I don't get one of the immunization requirements :

" Tuberculosis Screening and Chest X‐Rays (ONE of the following is required) :
a. Documentation of 2 skin tests (PPD); #1 within 12 months of start date, #2 within 3 months of start date of the 1st month you have applied for. DO NOT SEND IN YOUR APPLICATION WITHOUT THE 2ND PPD. Your application will be considered incomplete and will not be processed.
b. For individuals know to be TB skin test (PPD) positive, documentation of a chest x‐ ray report which rules our active tuberculosis or Tspot within 1 year of your full rotation dates.
c. Documentation of negative QFT or Tspot within 12 months of your full rotation dates; if positive QFT or Tspot, then documentation of a chest x‐ray report which rules our active tuberculosis within 1 year of your full rotation dates.
d. A TSpot or chest x‐ray within 1 year of your full rotation dates is required for ALL students who have a history of childhood BCG vaccination. Please fill out the pertinent information in the left box of the Certificate of Immunization form."

I guess I am in the a) category. However, I don't understand the meaning of "within". Does it stand for "before" ? For instance, I have a previous PPD negative result, which is a few years old. What is correct :
1) to get myself checked in the next few days and then 3 months prior to the start of the elective.
2) to provide my 2 years old proof of negative result and then a second proof of negative results 3 months before the start of the electives.

Thanks


PS : jfgavina -> answering you soon, I am a bit in a hurry for my applications xD

You need to have two PPDs, with one having been recorded a maximum of one year from the date of your application. Immunization is one of the biggest issues that will cause you rotational problems, as every place has different requirements. Many require quantitative titers of your immunity status as well. Not having Step 1 is really going to limit your options more than anything though.