PhD/PsyD NAPPP vs. ABPP vs. APA

[Healthinfo104]

I tried to search online but got pretty vague answers.

What are the differences between these 3 psychological bodies? And why are there three instead of just one?

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[WisNeuro]

Never heard of NAPP. APA and ABPP work together, but do different things.

 

[WisNeuro]

I was curious about NAPP. I used their "find a psychologist" tool to see who near me (I live in a medium sized metro area with a decent saturation of psychologists) and it couldn't find anyone within 20 miles of me registered with them. Apparently no one else has heard of NAPP either.

 

[Healthinfo104]

Never heard of NAPP. APA and ABPP work together, but do different things.

NAPPP I meant to type

 

[PsyDr]

This is all my opinion:

Apa is pretty much the seminal professional society for psychologists. Creates practice guidelines, publishes the majority of psychology journals, lobbies, accredits programs, has some limited educational programs themself, etc.

Asppb is an entity that organizes various state licensing boards. They create and administer the standard licensing test for psychologists. This has created some benefit in that all psychologists have to demonstrate a minimum of knowledge about a set of knowledge. In recent years they have created a "credential bank", and a standard application for licensure in many states.

The national register is a professional organization that creates a credential bank. Older than the asppb credential bank, and has a historical reason for existing. Can help with licensure in some states.

Abpp is a well respected board certification entity which creates standards for subspecialities. They test and board individuals in these specialities. There is a mild relationship between abpp and apa. Still a lot of politics.

Abpn/abpdn are another set of boards which does the same as abpp for neuropsych, with different standards. There is some political nonsense in how abpp and abpn don't get along. Like they literally locked one of the biggest names in neuropsych out of the meeting to create educational standards. Yes, these are adults. Every few years abpp and abpn get together to talk about merging and then they argue like 2nd graders discussing whose dad could beat up whose dad.

Abmp is a board certification entity for medical psychologists. They have aggressively resisted merging with abpp. Lot of history and politics here.

Napp is a political entity that aggressively advocates for various political things for psychologists. Some credential banking. IMO, their enthusiasm often creates some problems in the political realm where caution is often a good idea.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Napp is a political entity that aggressively advocates for various political things for psychologists. Some credential banking. IMO, their enthusiasm often creates some problems in the political realm where caution is often a good idea.

It's been a number of years, but I recall they focused less of enduring high standards and more on a race to the bottom for all. They advocate for the field, but not necessarily for things that we want as a field.

 

[Healthinfo104]

This is all my opinion:

Apa is pretty much the seminal professional society for psychologists. Creates practice guidelines, publishes the majority of psychology journals, lobbies, accredits programs, has some limited educational programs themself, etc.

Asppb is an entity that organizes various state licensing boards. They create and administer the standard licensing test for psychologists. This has created some benefit in that all psychologists have to demonstrate a minimum of knowledge about a set of knowledge. In recent years they have created a "credential bank", and a standard application for licensure in many states.

The national register is a professional organization that creates a credential bank. Older than the asppb credential bank, and has a historical reason for existing. Can help with licensure in some states.

Abpp is a well respected board certification entity which creates standards for subspecialities. They test and board individuals in these specialities. There is a mild relationship between abpp and apa. Still a lot of politics.

Abpn/abpdn are another set of boards which does the same as abpp for neuropsych, with different standards. There is some political nonsense in how abpp and abpn don't get along. Like they literally locked one of the biggest names in neuropsych out of the meeting to create educational standards. Yes, these are adults. Every few years abpp and abpn get together to talk about merging and then they argue like 2nd graders discussing whose dad could beat up whose dad.

Abmp is a board certification entity for medical psychologists. They have aggressively resisted merging with abpp. Lot of history and politics here.

Napp is a political entity that aggressively advocates for various political things for psychologists. Some credential banking. IMO, their enthusiasm often creates some problems in the political realm where caution is often a good idea.

Oh I see, but the ABMP isn't a recognized specialty correct? Since they are a free standing organization not affiliated with other psychological bodies, but they don't really count right? Same with the ABPN?

 

[PsyDr]

It's been a number of years, but I recall they focused less of enduring high standards and more on a race to the bottom for all. They advocate for the field, but not necessarily for things that we want as a field.

I wouldn't fully agree with your characterization. The issue of quality in the field is somewhat interesting to me.

If the issue is actually about quality, as means to protect society then ALL psychologists should have to regularly be retested for both licensure and boards along the exact same standards to include education, internship, and fellowship. Grandfathering should not exist at all, because this is about safety. The usual response which discusses the lack of practicality pretty much confirms that the argument isn't about safety though.

If quality is being used as a proxy to restrict supply side characteristics, then the field is putting themselves out of business. Number of graduates should be based upon incidence of psychiatric illness, number of pts a psychologists can actually treat, lifespan of a psychologist's career, percent with psychiatric disorder with insurance or the ability to pay cash that will choose psychological services, etc. In the mean time Midlevels are happy to fill the gap while we argue about who is the best psychologist.

Between those poles, I see a need for some reasonable advocate.

 

[PsyDr]

Oh I see, but the ABMP isn't a recognized specialty correct? Since they are a free standing organization not affiliated with other psychological bodies, but they don't really count right? Same with the ABPN?

Both ABCN and ABPN "count".


To be clear: ABPP is a completely separate, free standing psychological body. So is ABPN. Both organizations are affiliated with division 40 of the APA. ABPP is not part of the APA. Many very big names in neuropsych are boarded in abpn, so I think it would be difficult to say that the method by which Ralph Reitan, Cecil Reynolds, etc got their boarding doesn't count. Both boards are recognized by states and courts. The big difference is the Houston Conference Guidelines, which were not created until like 2004. Many senior ABPPers did not have training that met HCGs, which begs the questions: "do they believe this training model is necessary. And if so, are the senior members admitting that their own training is inadequate?". The significant difference is that ABPP was created in the VA system because a wise person realized that there was a pay step for providers who were board certified. As a result ABPP is recognized in the VA, whereas ABPN, which was created outside the system, is not.

ABMP is a bit of a different story, but you are missing some ideas. The practice of medical psychology is recognized by certain states, the DEA, and the APA. The APA has some suggestions moving to requirements for educational standards for MP, just like APA approved clinical programs. The APA also have a standardized test for medical psychology, passing of which is required by all states before one can practice as an MP. The states get to set the ultimate requirements for the practice of medical psychology. It's a recognized specialty by state law, federal law, etc. But the practice of medical psychology is not recognized in the VA.

The difference is that, aside from a few states, any psychologist can practice neuropsychology with really no extra training. Boarding is one method to demonstrate to patients and other clinicians that one has the extra training. However, boarding has basically no legal standing outside a few states. In medical psychology, demonstrating compliance with training and educational standards is required before one can practice.

 

[Healthinfo104]

Both ABCN and ABPN "count".


To be clear: ABPP is a completely separate, free standing psychological body. So is ABPN. Both organizations are affiliated with division 40 of the APA. ABPP is not part of the APA. Many very big names in neuropsych are boarded in abpn, so I think it would be difficult to say that the method by which Ralph Reitan, Cecil Reynolds, etc got their boarding doesn't count. Both boards are recognized by states and courts. The big difference is the Houston Conference Guidelines, which were not created until like 2004. Many senior ABPPers did not have training that met HCGs, which begs the questions: "do they believe this training model is necessary. And if so, are the senior members admitting that their own training is inadequate?". The significant difference is that ABPP was created in the VA system because a wise person realized that there was a pay step for providers who were board certified. As a result ABPP is recognized in the VA, whereas ABPN, which was created outside the system, is not.

ABMP is a bit of a different story, but you are missing some ideas. The practice of medical psychology is recognized by certain states, the DEA, and the APA. The APA has some suggestions moving to requirements for educational standards for MP, just like APA approved clinical programs. The APA also have a standardized test for medical psychology, passing of which is required by all states before one can practice as an MP. The states get to set the ultimate requirements for the practice of medical psychology. It's a recognized specialty by state law, federal law, etc. But the practice of medical psychology is not recognized in the VA.

The difference is that, aside from a few states, any psychologist can practice neuropsychology with really no extra training. Boarding is one method to demonstrate to patients and other clinicians that one has the extra training. However, boarding has basically no legal standing outside a few states. In medical psychology, demonstrating compliance with training and educational standards is required before one can practice.

I see what you are saying, but like you said the ABPN and the ABPP are affiliated with division 40, the ABMP is not affiliated with any division.

And from what I read, the APA is pushing for the advancement of Psychopharmacology with is for Rx privileges... Medical psychology is something that incorporates psychopharmacology but is much broader and doesn't just equate to Rx privileges. Psychooharmacology is just a proficiency but not a specialty. Medical psychology doesn't just mean psychologists licensed to prescribe, it s a whole specialty that isn't recognized by other psychology boards.

 

[PsyDr]

I see what you are saying, but like you said the ABPN and the ABPP are affiliated with division 40, the ABMP is not affiliated with any division.

And from what I read, the APA is pushing for the advancement of Psychopharmacology with is for Rx privileges... Medical psychology is something that incorporates psychopharmacology but is much broader and doesn't just equate to Rx privileges. Psychooharmacology is just a proficiency but not a specialty. Medical psychology doesn't just mean psychologists licensed to prescribe, it s a whole specialty that isn't recognized by other psychology boards.

That is incorrect. I would really encourage you to read more before you post questions on the many forums here. I know others have pointed this out to you. Without the requisite basis, a meaningful discussion isn't really possible.

Medical psychology = RxP. It's a specialty.

 

[Healthinfo104]

That is incorrect. I would really encourage you to read more before you post questions on the many forums here. I know others have pointed this out to you. Without the requisite basis, a meaningful discussion isn't really possible.

Medical psychology = RxP. It's a specialty.

Look on the APA, psychopharmacology is listed as a proficiency not a specialty.

Look on the ABMP... they clearly state that medical psychology is not just simply about rxp... it's much more broad than that... to them, rxp is just another tool in the shed if more states pass it.

 

[PsyDr]

Look on the APA, psychopharmacology is listed as a proficiency not a specialty.

Look on the ABMP... they clearly state that medical psychology is not just simply about rxp... it's much more broad than that... to them, rxp is just another tool in the shed if more states pass it.

Must be nice to know more about someone else's profession and colleagues. Don't know why you are asking if you already know .

 

[Healthinfo104]

Must be nice to know more about someone else's profession and colleagues. Don't know why you are asking if you already know .

Whst I am asking is who approves of these specialities, and how does medical psychology claim to be a specialty if they have no affliction to other psychological boards that recognize other specialties?

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

My understanding is that "medical psychologist" was originally used to describe RXP-trained and licensed prescribing psychologists in Louisiana. The legislators (and licensing board) wanted a title/description to specifically describe those psychologists who completed the additional training and could prescribe.

At some point the term was used by others outside of Louisiana to mean something different. I'm not supportive of their description nor desire to make it a speciality. There is confusion because the term was first used for a very specific situation, but now some people want it to include all sorts of other things.

 

[Healthinfo104]

My understanding is that "medical psychologist" was originally used to describe RXP-trained and licensed prescribing psychologists in Louisiana. The legislators (and licensing board) wanted a title/description to specifically describe those psychologists who completed the additional training and could prescribe.

At some point the term was used by others outside of Louisiana to mean something different. I'm not supportive of their description nor desire to make it a speciality. There is confusion because the term was first used for a very specific situation, but now some people want it to include all sorts of other things.

Why aren't you supportive of the specialty?