Hi bricktamland, I was hoping you could answer my questions about the Navy GMO. I know I may be thinking too far ahead, as I am 22 y/o, just graduated from college, and currently applying to med school (received only 1 interview so far). The info i'm requesting may perhaps help with potential interview questions such as "Where do you see yourself 10 years from now?" and "How do you plan to pay off your loans?"
Sorry that there are so many questions but if you, or anyone else familiar with the above topics could answer them, i would really appreciate it!
As for my background, I have been reading over the military med forum for a while now, and am interested in obtaining some medical experience in the military. My grandpa and two uncles were in the Navy, and my Dad was in the Air Force, and their experiences have been mostly positive, although they were not involved in military medicine. If my grandpa had not joined the Navy in the Philippines and started a family here in the US, who knows where I would be right now.
Riversoul,
It's wise that you're trying to gather as much info as you can. Signing a contract with the military is a HUGE decision. I have to confess to being one of the many people who didn't do enough research before putting my name on that dotted line. All things considered, I've had a pretty good time as a GMO but I am very ready to move on. Before I ramble on too much, I'll try to answer your specific questions.
Anyways, here are my questions:
1) How did you get your 3 yr GMO? Was it through HPSP? And are there varying years of HPSP, i.e. 2,3, or 4 year HPSP contracts?
Yes I took a 3 year HPSP scholarship. It's probably the better option if your intention is to get out of the military as a GMO. It's a TERRIBLE option if you're considering doing a military residency. You basically get screwed out of an entire year of tuition.
There are different contracts out there. A GMO I worked with had a 2 year contract, but those are less common. The most common are 4 year contracts. Be very careful with a 2 year contact because I believe the minimum payback is 3 years, however intership will count for 1 year in this particular circumstance (it won't for the 3 and 4 year contracts, though). That means if you do a civilian internship, you'll end up owing 3 years active duty for your 2 year contract. It's all super complicated so you really need to understand the small print of each contract.
2) Do you think it would be wise to intentionally go for a 3-4 yr GMO to get more real-world experience, explore the world when you're younger, serve the U.S, and mature more in order to be a better applicant for a civilian residency? Or do you think it's better to avoid the military altogether and just apply for civilian residencies fresh out of medical school? From reading this thread and others, it seems like civilian residencies look favorably on candidates with prior military experience.
Yes and no. First of all, if you think joining the military is going to help you "explore the world," then you've totally bought into their propaganda. If you really feel the need to travel and see the world, then take a year off before medical school and do some backpacking, or join the Peace Corps or something. The military, in my experience, is not a very fruitful way to experience the world.
I got to know a couple tiny patches of barren desert in Iraq really really well for 7 months. I don't know about you, but I don't consider that "exploring the world." It's true that some doctors in the Navy actually spend some time on ships (imagine that!), but even then, do you really think a few brief days at a Port of Call, getting drunk at some touristy bar is a great way to experience new and different cultures? (though it probably is fun) Also, don't believe the lies about the cool overseas clinics, those jobs go to doctors that have been in forever, not to brand new GMOs. As a newbie, you'll end up getting the crappiest billets, especially if you're male and single.
That being said, I do feel proud to say I've served my country (though I'll keep my opinions about this war to myself). Cough, cough, friggin idiot warmonger Bush, cough, cough.
I totally agree that serving time as a GMO has matured me. When I graduated med school, I didn't truly understand what being a doctor was all about. Now, I do. In med school, you're forced to choose a specialty very early in your clinical career, before you thoroughly understand the ins and outs of that specialty. Some people had the benefit of having a mother or father or other family member who was a doctor, and thus had a good idea about what they wanted to do, probably before they even started med school. I wasn't one of those people. Now, having worked as a doctor for 3 years, I am just starting to realize what it is I really like about medicine. Maybe I'm a late bloomer, but I like to weigh all important decisions carefully. Just look at all the people who change specialties. I would much rather be a GMO, with the great hours and government holidays, trying to figure out what I really enjoy, then spending godawful hours slaving away in a residency program that I end up hating and have throw all that work away in order to apply for something else. Plus, you get paid a lot better as a GMO. So for me, as a person who was relatively undecided about a career path, GMO-land was the perfect fit. Best of all, I feel way more confident as a doctor.
It's better to avoid the military altogether if your goal is civilian residency and you know exactly what you want to do. As it's been said countless times before, as a strictly financial decision, it's a poor choice.
If you want to be a strong candidate for a competitive residency, then focus on getting good grades and scoring high on the USMLE tests. GMO experience may be looked upon favorably (I'll find out firsthand soon), but it's not going to be nearly as reliable as good evaluations and high board scores.
3) Also, is the 3-4 yr GMO followed by civilian residency route better than doing a military residency and then paying back HPSP years afterwards? What's the likelihood of doing the former route (which is what I pointed out in question #2 and is what I think you are doing)?
Going the GMO route wasn't really a choice for most of us, that's what we were ordered to do. However, looking at the grim future of Navy medicine, I'm happy to get out while I can. In the future, most GMO billets will be filled by doctors AFTER they graduate residency. It may be hard as a premed to understand this, but the GMO job--with some exceptions--is complete waste and underutilization of a board-certified doctor. In some instances, you'll see things like neonatal intensivists working as GMOs, it's absolutely insane.
4) what specific enjoyable things did you do as a Navy GMO?
Sometimes I have light work days that afford me time to work out, play baskeball, or go running during the day. I also enjoy government holidays (i.e. 4-day Labor Day weekends). To be quite honest, there isn't a whole lot about the job that is super enjoyable, most of the time it's pretty frustrating, so the large amount of time off is probably the best part. But I guess the people I work with--the Corpsmen and other GMOs--make it fun. Occasionally there's an interesting case. But whenever that happens, you have to send the guy to the hospital where all the cool stuff happens--surgeries, thoracentesis, MRI's, etc. As a GMO, you're stuck out in the boonies with a stethescope and a reflex hammer. You can't do anything cool because you simply don't have the facilities to support it. So you end up doing all the boring scut work, like physicals. Doing separation physicals all day long gets old--FAST!
Assuming a med school acceptance & graduation, I would be 27 when I graduate from med school. At that point of my life, I don't see myself being married (although i know things could change in school), nor having kids anytime soon.
I've lived in California for the past 15 years of my life, and haven't really visited other parts of the world (except one trip to the Philippines in 1999). Admittedly, by being in Cali, especially socal, I've been living a pretty sheltered life and want to experience new locales, lifestyles, etc. These are some of the factors that are currently driving me to pursue a stint in the military. There's also a financial factor involved (assuming I pursue and actually obtain a military scholarship), as I don't want to be so massively in debt after med school, especially if I attend a private university and/or OOS. Being a CA resident, this scenario is very likely.
5) I've seen all the "Don't join military medicine for the money" posts, but do you think the financial benefits you've received have been worth it? And do you think FAP is a better alternative?
Don't join military medicine for the money, Don't join military medicine for the money, Don't join military medicine for the money, Don't join military medicine for the money.
Do we have to beat it into your head!?!?!? It will not save you money in the long run. However. . . . it will afford you to have some fun NOW, in the short term. My wife and I got married this year. We had an awesome wedding and there was no way I could have paid for it with a resident's salary. We drive nice cars, we travel, we eat out at nice restaurants. I've started a retirement account. But my civilian buddy from med school is about to graduate from Anesthesiology this year. Sure, he's been living like a student since high school, but he's going to pass me up FAST!! He's looking at $300,000 and up starting. Do the math. If you totally hate deferred gratification, and you don't mind losing out some money later on, then maybe HPSP is for you. I don't know anything about FAP.
6) If you could go back in time, would you do a GMO again?
Yes. Only because I met my wife this way and because living in SoCal has been awesome. Also, as I said before, it provided a break from postgraduate training while I figured out what I really want to do in life. Otherwise, it was a pretty stupid decision.
7) Why NAVY GMO and not AF or Army? Do those other departments even have GMO's?
I only picked the Navy because I figured most Naval bases are going to be near water, and thus I'd be more likely to live in a more enjoyable location (ie San Diego or Camp Pendleton). The AF is supposedly the cushiest of all, but it seems like most of their bases are in undesirable locations (unless you like Fallon, NV).
. I'm currently working with the Marines, and recently extended for an extra year after a 2-year stint with an infantry battalion. I have an FM internship under my belt and I'm planning to continue with FM at a civilian residency. Preferably, I'd like to find an open PGY-2 position at a good program (starting in '08) versus repeating internship (though I'm open to repeating internship if the only open PGY-2 spots are at less-than-desirable programs). I was hoping there might be someone in this community who may have faced a similar dilemma and could provide some recommendations/suggestions. Specifically:
. Though military medicine is decidedly not for me, I have truly had some very good times as a GMO and I don't regret it (I also have my fair share of horror stories
