Need advice! bad gpa...

[Mck1110]

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I graduated with a bs in plant bio in NC may, 2011. with an overall gpa of 2.784. I fell into pretty bad depression freshmen-junior year, but I didn't want to admit it to my parents for help. I just went on with it thinking it will go away, but that didn't happen and eventually I took a year off after junior year, and went back to school to finish up my underg. degree. Obviously my grades really suffered because of the depression. I really really want to pursue a career in dentistry but with such a low gpa, I am really scared and don't see much hope in getting into any D-schools. Here all my grades for the core classes over the 4 years.

2006 fall
Chem Molecular Sci C
Chem Lab A+
Acad Writing Rsch F (First Year Repeat, didn't count towards my gpa)
Calc A CR
Calc B B-
Intro To Psych B
College Physics I CR
College Physics II CR

2007 spring
Intro Biology I B-
ENG 101 F
Beekeeping B
Social Psychology B+

2007 Fall
Organic Chem I F
Intr Comput & Use B-
Acad Writing Rsch C
Statistic C+

2008 Spring
Intro Biology II B
Astron A
Soc of Family B
toxicology A+

2008 Fall
Org Chem I C+
Animal Diversity D

2009 Spring
quantitative Chem C-
Quant Chem Lab A+
Amer Lit B
Plant Phys C

took a year off

2010 summer
GN311 genetics B

2010 Fall
Environment Ethics A
Plant Biology B+
Spec Top in Botany A+

2011 Spring
entomology 401 A
Marine Biology B
Botany A+

So overall I have a 2.784 GPA, and i don't know exactly my sgpa is but it's probably really really really low. I haven't taken the DAT at the moment, but planning on taking it towards the end of 2011, or beg of 2012. I had to take a year off junior year to deal with my personal issues, sort out my life. I did make good grades throughout senior year but that just wasn't enough to get my gpa to a 3.0. At the moment, I am retaking my quantitative chem class. But since I had already graduated, taking courses as a post-bach can only qualify me to take max of 8 credits per semester, that's only 2 three credit courses. I feel like the process of taking post-bach courses on my own is really slow, and I want to look for something that can atleast allow me to take classes as a full-time. I looked into many post-bach programs, most of them require a min. of 3.0 gpa, which i do not qualify for. So I need advice on what steps I need to take to increase my chances of getting into D-school, doesn't matter how long it will take, I will do whatever it takes to get in. I have some specific questions below...

1. I got my college physics credits from AP exams back in high school, should I still take 8 credits of college physics?
2. what other courses should I re-take?
3. I live in NC, and I want to apply for a potential post-bach progam in NC to enhance my GPA, but with a gpa below 3.0 i don't see anywhere I can apply to, can anyone suggest me with any post-bach programs or 1-yr master programs that I qualify for, to enhance my gpa?
4. My undergrad. degree didn't require me to take a 2nd semester of organic chem, should I still take it on my own?
5. what post-bach courses would you suggest me to take?

Thank you in advance for taking your time to answer my questions, I am really confused and i don't have anyone to point me towards a clear direction.

 

[dentalWorks]

IMO, I wouldn't take the DAT unless you:
(a) have a decent sGPA (above 3.0) and/or....
(b) have a strong science upward trend (usually seen in last 2 years of undergrad, post-bacc, and/or masters)

Even if you score high on the DAT, low sGPA + no upward trend = reciepe for alot of rejections.

Fix that GPA first, then you can worry about when to take the DAT

 

[ChapelHillT]

I have heard that UNCG has some sort of pre-dent/pre-med post bac program that is viewed favorably by the med/dent schools. I have no details on this, but thats what I hear. If you are at UNC, shoot me a PM and I'll give you the names of a few professors to contact who will be able to help you more than the general advice you'll get on here (And even if you're not at UNC I"m sure they'd be willing to help!).

Best of luck to you, and if this is your dream hang in there. I've seen first hand how depression/anxiety can affect a person's studies. If you wipe the slate from here, show a great upward trend for a year or two and score a solid DAT, I'm sure you'll make it. Just persevere!

 

[LilyBrunes]

IMO, I wouldn't take the DAT unless you:
(a) have a decent sGPA (above 3.0) and/or....
(b) have a strong science upward trend (usually seen in last 2 years of undergrad, post-bacc, and/or masters)

Even if you score high on the DAT, low sGPA + no upward trend = reciepe for alot of rejections.

Fix that GPA first, then you can worry about when to take the DAT

Doesn't the last two semesters show an upward trend? Or should it be more than just two semesters?

 

[Seahawk]

Doesn't the last two semesters show an upward trend? Or should it be more than just two semesters?

Those are PART TIME semesters.

 

[hmmmmm]

ask yourself this:

What do you offer the schools over other applicants?

That is what you need to be able to provide.

Did you do anything that would make you stand out among other applicants in your year off?

You say you were depressed and that caused a low freshman gpa, but it doesn't explain the other 3 years of low gpa. Furthermore, the course load is relatively light, unrelated to dentistry, and you still didn't do well. What does that show the adcoms?

 

[Mck1110]

I'll refer to UNC since I am guessing you are interested in there.

You should retake the physics, they don't like AP credits for pre-reqs...(I don't think they even accept them but I'm not 100% on that one)

You have to take a 2nd semester of organic to get into dental school, its a pre-req. I also don't see a 2nd semester of English, human anatomy/vertebrate zoology, and general chem II. (all pre-reqs for UNC)
The course names are weird so I might have just missed something.

UNC requires at least a C in all the pre-req courses.


I see some red flags, besides the obvious, a couple:
1. You have obviously never done any research on dental school, go do it.
2. You semester loads are tiny, they want to see you packing on the classes if nothing else, with the year off that makes it worse.

I'm not an expert on the post-bac/masters stuff, so I will let someone else chime in there.

I feel like starting from scratch in a sense is your best option.

I only listed the core classes. there are other non-core classes that I didn't post since they aren't really important ones

 

[Mck1110]

ask yourself this:

What do you offer the schools over other applicants?

That is what you need to be able to provide.

Did you do anything that would make you stand out among other applicants in your year off?

You say you were depressed and that caused a low freshman gpa, but it doesn't explain the other 3 years of low gpa. Furthermore, the course load is relatively light, unrelated to dentistry, and you still didn't do well. What does that show the adcoms?

the depression was throughout freshmen - junior year.

 

[Mck1110]

Those are PART TIME semesters.

they were not. I was a full time, i only listed the core classes. there are many i left out bc they were electives

 

[PreDent321]

It's good to see that you're determined to do whatever it takes to get into dental school.

But you also have to look at the reality of the situation. I'm just going to call it as it is...

There are 8000 people who apply to dental school each year. The typical dental school class is around 80-100 students meaning about 125-200 acceptances are awarded to fill up this class size. A good chunk of these acceptances at different schools are going to the same person who is applying to multiple schools (and hence the reason for needing to accept more than needed for the class size). Add to this equation state schools who are highly discriminate against OOS, etc.

Among the 8000 applicants, there is a huge number of people who had low GPAs during the first two years and some issues in their lives that contributed to this performance. These applicants also did better in their junior/senior years with an upward trend. Assume everyone has 100+ shadowing hours, solid to good LOEs, some ECs, community service, a nice personal statement, some research experience, and thus, there is not much differentiation among this group of candidates. Some of them have great DAT scores but it doesn't mask the subpar academic performance.

On the other side of the fence, the "clean" applications are candidates who have solid to great GPAs for 4 straight years backed up by solid to great DAT scores. They also have 100+ shadowing hours, nice LOEs and personal statement, research experience, ECs and community service. Thus Adcoms are going to reward these clean applicants more so than the ones who have special reasons (which may be misconstrued as making excuses) of screwing up during their freshman/soph years.

I'm not saying that the former group can't overcome the obstacles to get into dental school but it's a really steep mountain to climb and most won't make it.

Good luck but have a backup plan too.

EDIT: Many dental schools won't allow repeat of core courses (Post-Bac program) if you already have a certain number of credits in them within 3 years upon graduating. It seems like you already took a year of biology, year of gen chem, semester of organic chem. Thus, if you can't repeat these courses, then you can't raise your undergrad GPAs thru a post-bac, and a masters GPA will be calculated separately by AADSAS meaning your undergrad GPAs will still be the same. Your options are to either take upper level science classes at the undergrad level, or enroll in Masters program with the hope that schools will focus more on your masters GPA than college GPA.

 

[youknowthedrill]

I don't live in NC so I don't know about the 2 class limit per semester for those who have graduated. Have you checked the policies of other colleges/universities? You don't have to do a formal post bacc if you can find a school that will let you enroll full time. See if you can schedule a meeting with someone in admissions at the two NC dental schools. They will give you the best advice. You are probably looking at two years of full-time undergrad classes to become competitive. Stay focused and earn A's in everything and you have a chance. Here are a couple of helpful links from ADEA:
Course classification: http://www.adea.org/dental_educatio...ocuments/2011 ADEA AADSAS Course Subjects.pdf
GPA calculations: http://www.adea.org/dental_educatio...tructions/Documents/2011 GPA Calculations.pdf

 

[Jackson-Ave-Dental]

It's good to see that you're determined to do whatever it takes to get into dental school.

But you also have to look at the reality of the situation. I'm just going to call it as it is...

There are 8000 people who apply to dental school each year. The typical dental school class is around 80-100 students meaning about 125-200 acceptances are awarded to fill up this class size. A good chunk of these acceptances at different schools are going to the same person who is applying to multiple schools (and hence the reason for needing to accept more than needed for the class size). Add to this equation state schools who are highly discriminate against OOS, etc.

Among the 8000 applicants, there is a huge number of people who had low GPAs during the first two years and some issues in their lives that contributed to this performance. These applicants also did better in their junior/senior years with an upward trend. Assume everyone has 100+ shadowing hours, solid to good LOEs, some ECs, community service, a nice personal statement, some research experience, and thus, there is not much differentiation among this group of candidates. Some of them have great DAT scores but it doesn't mask the subpar academic performance.

On the other side of the fence, the "clean" applications are candidates who have solid to great GPAs for 4 straight years backed up by solid to great DAT scores. They also have 100+ shadowing hours, nice LOEs and personal statement, research experience, ECs and community service. Thus Adcoms are going to reward these clean applicants more so than the ones who have special reasons (which may be misconstrued as making excuses) of screwing up during their freshman/soph years.

I'm not saying that the former group can't overcome the obstacles to get into dental school but it's a really steep mountain to climb and most won't make it.

Good luck but have a backup plan too.

EDIT: Many dental schools won't allow repeat of core courses (Post-Bac program) if you already have a certain number of credits in them within 3 years upon graduating. It seems like you already took a year of biology, year of gen chem, semester of organic chem. Thus, if you can't repeat these courses, then you can't raise your undergrad GPAs thru a post-bac, and a masters GPA will be calculated separately by AADSAS meaning your undergrad GPAs will still be the same. Your options are to either take upper level science classes at the undergrad level, or enroll in Masters program with the hope that schools will focus more on your masters GPA than college GPA.

Check your numbers dude... there is definitely at least 12-14k applicants. Can't quite remember the exact numbers since I lost my ADEA book 🙁

 

[dentalWorks]

Check your numbers dude... there is definitely at least 12-14k applicants. Can't quite remember the exact numbers since I lost my ADEA book 🙁

yeh.. last 2-3 cycles, approx 13k people applied. Compared to 2006 data, only about 8k applied.

However, I believe the 13k figure has reached its peak (it shouldn't go higher). You gotta remember, many dental schools today are costing in the upwards of 350-450k loans (including living expense and this is WITHOUT compound interest during the 4 years of DS).... Its a scary thought graduating from dental school and being close to 1/2 a mill in debt with a big 6-8% interest rate (depending on if you consolidate or not).... so I am willing to bet, many people will switch to other (cheaper) healthcare fields ~ example medical schools.

My friend and his wife just graduate Wayne state Medical school this past May... Their medical loans COMBINED was only 250k hahahaha