Need advice on situation

[KBSama]

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Yeah I have. She wants and sees a future with me.

 

[hoihaie]

Yeah I have. She wants and sees a future with me.

no i mean this situation with your mom. what does your girlfriend think?

what does your dad say to all of this?

 

[KBSama]

We've been together around 4 years now. It's not puppy love. My girlfriend is sad over not being able to come over my house etc.

My dad doesn't want me to date one woman as he said "there will be tons of opportunities in medical school" and wants me to date other women before getting married.

 

[DokterMom]

Apologizing, yes.

Asking your mom to respect you as an adult? that would probably end badly. In my experience, respect in is earned, especially in case of asian parents. Telling your mom to respect your girlfriend will come off as the girlfriend is more important that the mom and the mom's authority being challenged.

His parents still views him as a child, and until that stops (which will take several years, and most likely only when he has an actual job/career), telling his parents to behave civilly and open-mindedly will backfire in the worst way possible.

Just to clarify, I believe I suggested he ask his mom to "respect his choice of girlfriend" -- but perhaps "accept" would be the better word. And perhaps even "accept" him as an adult, or "recognize" that he is an adult instead of "respect" - since that word is, admittedly, a loaded one in many Asian cultures.

But the message he needs to send is an important one: "Mom, I appreciate everything you did for me when I was a child. I love and respect you very much and I want to maintain a close relationship with you as an adult. I hope you are proud of the adult person you've raised me to become. While I appreciate your guidance and respect your wisdom, as an adult, I need to make my own decisions instead of unquestioningly following instructions. I do realize that some of my decisions will be wrong, and I understand how hard it will be for you to watch me make those mistakes. But I ask you to be patient with me and help me take this new step forward. Know that I will always respect your opinion and value your advice - even when I decide not to follow it."

 

[dpmd]

Just to clarify, I believe I suggested he ask his mom to "respect his choice of girlfriend" -- but perhaps "accept" would be the better word. And perhaps even "accept" him as an adult, or "recognize" that he is an adult instead of "respect" - since that word is, admittedly, a loaded one in many Asian cultures.

But the message he needs to send is an important one: "Mom, I appreciate everything you did for me when I was a child. I love and respect you very much and I want to maintain a close relationship with you as an adult. I hope you are proud of the adult person you've raised me to become. While I appreciate your guidance and respect your wisdom, as an adult, I need to make my own decisions instead of unquestioningly following instructions. I do realize that some of my decisions will be wrong, and I understand how hard it will be for you to watch me make those mistakes. But I ask you to be patient with me and help me take this new step forward. Know that I will always respect your opinion and value your advice - even when I decide not to follow it."

And this would be an excellent way to deal with many parents, but the read i am getting for this ethnicity is that even that would not be welcome.

 

[DokterMom]

And this would be an excellent way to deal with many parents, but the read i am getting for this ethnicity is that even that would not be welcome.

Unwelcome - probably. But I strongly suspect that his parents also want him to succeed.

And the mainstream American perception is that a grown man who obeys his parents is weak. (This is one reason why Asians, despite having stronger educational credentials, are underrepresented in the upper levels of management in American companies.)

However, there is room in mainstream American culture for a man to respect his parents and his culture and to value their wisdom, so long as the ultimate decisions he makes are his own. But it must be made clear that in America, respect is not the same thing as obedience.

If his parents insist on obedience and the OP complies, it will be at the expense of the son's success and peer respect.

OP, can you ask your parents to act as your respected advisors?

 

[1nnocuous]

Do the most American thing and lie to your parents.

 

[KBSama]

They will be mad if I asked them to be my respected advisors. The way they see it is they spent money and time on me for 25 years so in return I have to obey their command. If I were to refuse they will say: "get out".

 

[hoihaie]

Just to clarify, I believe I suggested he ask his mom to "respect his choice of girlfriend" -- but perhaps "accept" would be the better word. And perhaps even "accept" him as an adult, or "recognize" that he is an adult instead of "respect" - since that word is, admittedly, a loaded one in many Asian cultures.

But the message he needs to send is an important one: "Mom, I appreciate everything you did for me when I was a child. I love and respect you very much and I want to maintain a close relationship with you as an adult. I hope you are proud of the adult person you've raised me to become. While I appreciate your guidance and respect your wisdom, as an adult, I need to make my own decisions instead of unquestioningly following instructions. I do realize that some of my decisions will be wrong, and I understand how hard it will be for you to watch me make those mistakes. But I ask you to be patient with me and help me take this new step forward. Know that I will always respect your opinion and value your advice - even when I decide not to follow it."

Yeah, I understand what you mean and I agree that parents ultimately need to do so, but directly asking them to accept, respect, or even recognize him as an adult and his choices are his to make, is easier said than done in Asian culture. He definitely needs to send that message to his mom, but needs to do so in a way which the mom comes to this recognition herself instead of being told that.

@KBSama - some of my thoughts:
Ultimately your goal is to reconcile the rift between your parents and girlfriend (regardless of how onesided it is). To do so, you need to address the concerns your parents have of your gf. It seems like your dad's opinion is more wanting you to have more dating experience before marrying someone and not directly against your current gf.

Perhaps a smart thing to do to deal with your parents and maintain your relationship with your GF is to 1) take things slower with your GF for the near future till you go to med school (at least just for show to your parents ). What I mean by taking things slow is, mention her less in front of them, don't actively try to convince your parents that your gf is THE one. Let them come to see that themselves. Don't hang out with her in their presence or actively announce you are doing so.

In order for this to work, however, your GF needs to be on board, and you need to have her come up with this idea herself. Therefore you guys need to talk it out and she needs to come up with an indea similar to this. If this isnt an idea she suggested herself, your girlfriend might start feeling alienated by you and your relationship will more likely take a turn for the worse.

In the meantime, you should start acting like a good asian son, make your parents proud, take care of your dad, let them see that you're not trying to disobey them. Start getting a job with lots of responsibilities (make sure they know its for the sake of the job experience and not to earn money for yourself to spend on the GF) so that they can start seeing you in a different light. And most importantly, any good changes they notice about you for which they praise you about, you should hint that it was to the credit of your GF. Let them see that she is a good influence on you.

 

[hoihaie]

They will be mad if I asked them to be my respected advisors. The way they see it is they spent money and time on me for 25 years so in return I have to obey their command. If I were to refuse they will say: "get out".

unfortunately, this is precisely the problem haha...

in asian culture, many parents think respect and obedience is the same thing. regardless of whether they are in a different culture now.

they want absolute respect and obedience from their kids regardless of whether they are right or wrong. asking parents to do anything that would change that is asking a cat to bark

 

[MrLogan13]

Unwelcome - probably. But I strongly suspect that his parents also want him to succeed.

And the mainstream American perception is that a grown man who obeys his parents is weak. (This is one reason why Asians, despite having stronger educational credentials, are underrepresented in the upper levels of management in American companies.)

However, there is room in mainstream American culture for a man to respect his parents and his culture and to value their wisdom, so long as the ultimate decisions he makes are his own. But it must be made clear that in America, respect is not the same thing as obedience.

If his parents insist on obedience and the OP complies, it will be at the expense of the son's success and peer respect.

OP, can you ask your parents to act as your respected advisors?

While I agree with you, and this would work with more Westernized parents, this simply won't fly with traditional Asian parents. It would be insulting and worse, would not allow them to save face.

The OP could so as you say, but it would destroy his relationship with his parents. Yes, disowning or shunning takes a toll on parents and child, but understand: traditional Asian parents will not hesitate to do it, and then they'll also go around and say what an awful, stupid, disrespectful person their child became to all relatives and family friends.

Ultimately, the choice is his, and he will have to deal with the repercussions of that choice no matter how he chooses.

 

[MrLogan13]

Apologizing, yes.

Asking your mom to respect you as an adult? that would probably end badly. In my experience, respect in is earned, especially in case of asian parents. Telling your mom to respect your girlfriend will come off as the girlfriend is more important that the mom and the mom's authority being challenged.

His parents still views him as a child, and until that stops (which will take several years, and most likely only when he has an actual job/career), telling his parents to behave civilly and open-mindedly will backfire in the worst way possible.

I find that this is something that people who are unfamiliar with Asian culture don't really understand.

 

[DokterMom]

They will be mad if I asked them to be my respected advisors. The way they see it is they spent money and time on me for 25 years so in return I have to obey their command. If I were to refuse they will say: "get out".

If you truly believe that, then you have a very difficult decision to make...

in asian culture, many parents think respect and obedience is the same thing. regardless of whether they are in a different culture now. they want absolute respect and obedience from their kids regardless of whether they are right or wrong. asking parents to do anything that would change that is asking a cat to bark

I've seen that firsthand, and would have to agree that this seems to be true... I'm wondering if that may even stem from a linguistic problem, where the root culture has one word for the combined concept of 'respect & obedience' and we split it into two and clearly distinguish between them.

Yeah, I understand what you mean and I agree that parents ultimately need to do so, but directly asking them to accept, respect, or even recognize him as an adult and his choices are his to make, is easier said than done in Asian culture. He definitely needs to send that message to his mom, but needs to do so in a way which the mom comes to this recognition herself instead of being told that.

@KBSama - some of my thoughts:
Ultimately your goal is to reconcile the rift between your parents and girlfriend (regardless of how onesided it is). To do so, you need to address the concerns your parents have of your gf. It seems like your dad's opinion is more wanting you to have more dating experience before marrying someone and not directly against your current gf.

Perhaps a smart thing to do to deal with your parents and maintain your relationship with your GF is to 1) take things slower with your GF for the near future till you go to med school (at least just for show to your parents ). What I mean by taking things slow is, mention her less in front of them, don't actively try to convince your parents that your gf is THE one. Let them come to see that themselves. Don't hang out with her in their presence or actively announce you are doing so.

In order for this to work, however, your GF needs to be on board, and you need to have her come up with this idea herself. Therefore you guys need to talk it out and she needs to come up with an indea similar to this. If this isnt an idea she suggested herself, your girlfriend might start feeling alienated by you and your relationship will more likely take a turn for the worse.

In the meantime, you should start acting like a good asian son, make your parents proud, take care of your dad, let them see that you're not trying to disobey them. Start getting a job with lots of responsibilities (make sure they know its for the sake of the job experience and not to earn money for yourself to spend on the GF) so that they can start seeing you in a different light. And most importantly, any good changes they notice about you for which they praise you about, you should hint that it was to the credit of your GF. Let them see that she is a good influence on you.

Sounds very manipulative. But also not a bad idea...

 

[hoihaie]

If you truly believe that, then you have a very difficult decision to make...



I've seen that firsthand, and would have to agree that this seems to be true... I'm wondering if that may even stem from a linguistic problem, where the root culture has one word for the combined concept of 'respect & obedience' and we split it into two and clearly distinguish between them.



Sounds very manipulative. But also not a bad idea...

it is definitely not a linguistic problem. In chinese, for example, respect and obedience have clear separate words and definition. there are probably more than a dozen terms for both of these concepts. I think it stems more from the thousands of years of imperial history where respect and obedience to authority comes hand in hand.

it does seem manipulative i agree haha..., but if the GF is someone OP wants to marry, she should, in theory, be helping him to become a better person regardless (and vise versa of course).

 

[KBSama]

I have no clue what to do. There is no way I can see her without them not knowing. They want to know where I am at at all times. The only way I could see that happening is if I lie and say I am with my other friends.

I also want to buy a car but my mom said go ahead but if you do, don't get me involved with anything to do with it. So I would have to pay insurance/gas/repairs all on my own even when I'm in medical school. She said she would pay for all that if I stopped seeing her... I only have around 11k and wouldn't have enough for it in the long run.