Need advice please! Just received DAT scores and I don't know what to do!

[Jellloo]

Hi,
I just got my canadian DAT scores in the mail today, and I am wondering if I should re-write the DAT. I will be applying to american dental schools as a US citizen! These are my scores:

Reading Comp: 18
Biology: 23
Chem: 20
Science Total: 22
Academic Avg: 20
Perception: 22
Carving: 16

cGPA: 3.32
science GPA: 3.26

I know that my gpa isn't great. If anyone can tell me which schools I would have a good chance of getting into with these scores, that would be wonderful! Thanks!

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[dentalWorks]

Hi,
I just got my canadian DAT scores in the mail today, and I am wondering if I should re-write the DAT. I will be applying to american dental schools as a US citizen! These are my scores:

Reading Comp: 18
Biology: 23
Chem: 20
Science Total: 22
Academic Avg: 20
Perception: 22
Carving: 16

cGPA: 3.32
science GPA: 3.26

I know that my gpa isn't great. If anyone can tell me which schools I would have a good chance of getting into with these scores, that would be wonderful! Thanks!

Just curious thats all...but....if you are a US citizen, and you are applying to USA Dental schools... why did you take the Canadian version?

 

[Jellloo]

Just curious thats all...but....if you are a US citizen, and you are applying to USA Dental schools... why did you take the Canadian version?

I was thinking about applying to canadian dental schools as well!

 

[321931]

I was thinking about applying to canadian dental schools as well!

Don't canadian dental schools have a cutoff of 3.8 or something? Or is that a myth?

 

[vahleree]

the cutoff is 3.0-3.5/4.0 but the avg gpa of the applicants they accept is ~3.8 at least for Ontario schools.

 

[yangwang]

Hi,
I just got my canadian DAT scores in the mail today, and I am wondering if I should re-write the DAT. I will be applying to american dental schools as a US citizen! These are my scores:

Reading Comp: 18
Biology: 23
Chem: 20
Science Total: 22
Academic Avg: 20
Perception: 22
Carving: 16

cGPA: 3.32
science GPA: 3.26

I know that my gpa isn't great. If anyone can tell me which schools I would have a good chance of getting into with these scores, that would be wonderful! Thanks!

I think you should take the american DAT, you still have 6 months+. And I am not sure if you are trying to set a Guinness world record or something, but 3.32 will not get you in to any Canadian dental school, even if you are an eskimo.

Citizenship will not help you much unless you've been paying your taxes in the state you are from, since that's how you establish reidency.

 

[amalgamgrillz]

the cutoff is 3.0-3.5/4.0 but the avg gpa of the applicants they accept is ~3.8 at least for Ontario schools.

3.97 avg for UofT (and if you're applying from an American university, it should be an equivalent top tier school, otherwise they will have trouble equating your school's GPA with theirs)

~90% average over your top 2 years for UWO.

Every other Canadian school heavily favors in-province. Out-of-province applicants usually have a 4.0 (Especially Alberta, Manitoba, Saskatchewan), and spaces are usually extremely limited (0-5 spots ish, MAYBE). So I don't know if your chances as an international applicant are "strong".

 

[vahleree]

i know the avg. for UofT is high but you don't necessarily need to have 3.97, you CAN get an interview with a lower gpa than that. my sister got an interview at UofT and at Western and was put on the waitlist at both schools with a 3.85

 

[amalgamgrillz]

Hi,
I just got my canadian DAT scores in the mail today, and I am wondering if I should re-write the DAT. I will be applying to american dental schools as a US citizen! These are my scores:

Reading Comp: 18
Biology: 23
Chem: 20
Science Total: 22
Academic Avg: 20
Perception: 22
Carving: 16

cGPA: 3.32
science GPA: 3.26

I know that my gpa isn't great. If anyone can tell me which schools I would have a good chance of getting into with these scores, that would be wonderful! Thanks!

As a non-Canadian citizen, I'm assuming you will be applying to only UofT and UWO. Not to be a downer, but based on your GPA, your chances at UofT are very slim. Canadian dental schools weigh your GPA heavily. The average acceptance at UofT last year was a 3.97. I would even be worried about not getting an interview with just a 3.7. Unlike the states, an obscenely high DAT score won't even save a low GPA. DAT scores are only factored in to see if you make the cut off for an interview (granted your GPA is competitive enough)..once you get that interview, THEN you will be ranked based on the competitiveness of your DAT scores.

At UWO, your top two academic years should be around 89% (90% last year). However, the reading scores at UWO has usually been a 19 cut off. Try calling Trish Ashbury - she's very helpful.

 

[amalgamgrillz]

I think you should take the american DAT, you still have 6 months+. And I am not sure if you are trying to set a Guinness world record or something, but 3.32 will not get you in to any Canadian dental school, even if you are an eskimo.

Citizenship will not help you much unless you've been paying your taxes in the state you are from, since that's how you establish reidency.

Haha, in all seriousness, a 3.32 would be more than enough to get you in if you were Inuit. Aboriginals are highly sought after for post-secondary education..especially professional school.

 

[Jellloo]

Thanks for all the responses guys! Do you think I have a shot at american schools that accept the canadian DAT, like NYU and Boston?

 

[amalgamgrillz]

Thanks for all the responses guys! Do you think I have a shot at american schools that accept the canadian DAT, like NYU and Boston?

Absolutely! with a TS and AA like yours, I'm sure you're in good standing DATwise. Although, many say applications to those schools are pretty hit-or-miss. A lot of people with better stats wont get interviews, and people with worst states will get interviews. So just apply early and cross your fingers that you're lucky enough to have their application read.

I wouldn't bank on just those schools either. Definitely apply everywhere you can.

 

[txlonghorn]

Don't Canadian schools have ridiculous grade inflation? like an 80% is a 4.0? I figure they might factor that in when they look at your grades - 3.0 would be close to a Canadian 4.0. I remember that is how they graded in Australia - 80 was an A.

 

[amalgamgrillz]

Don't Canadian schools have ridiculous grade inflation? like an 80% is a 4.0? I figure they might factor that in when they look at your grades - 3.0 would be close to a Canadian 4.0. I remember that is how they graded in Australia - 80 was an A.

Yes and no. Many Canadian schools have 80=A, however, it's difficult to get that 80, and that's why Canadian schools will not look favorably upon an international student who hasn't graduated from an equivalent top tiered University, which has a similar "level of difficulty".

You can think about it this way: Letter grades are essentially "universal". A's are hard to achieve at any university, so, if it's hard to get an 80 (A) at University X, then University X must obviously grade harder. 80% in Canada is not the same as an 80% in America.

And now we wait for Doc Toothache to rip my comment to shreds.

 

[wantVCUdental]

Don't Canadian schools have ridiculous grade inflation? like an 80% is a 4.0? I figure they might factor that in when they look at your grades - 3.0 would be close to a Canadian 4.0. I remember that is how they graded in Australia - 80 was an A.

i just want to help clear up this misconception, an 80% being an A doesn't necessarily mean it's easier. Just like in respectable engineering schools, it's very difficult to get over even... 60% on midterms, that doesn't mean having A set at 75% in those case means ridiculous grade inflation.

Actually, many of us Canadians view many American schools as having grade inflation. I know the top tier schools such as UCs, Ivys and MIT don't have grade inflation. Because their grading system is all in relative terms where A's are given to top 10-15% of the class, the next 10-20% get B's, then the next 10-15% get C's and so on.

 

[yappy]

Lets be honest guys. Up north there is some serious grade inflation. Plus they have an easier time making it through UG without having to hold down a job. They have alot of soc services that make this possible. I say if they want to play with the big dogs (american DS) come down to UC and try to hang onto your 80% "4.0" first.

 

[amalgamgrillz]

Lets be honest guys. Up north there is some serious grade inflation. Plus they have an easier time making it through UG without having to hold down a job. They have alot of soc services that make this possible. I say if they want to play with the big dogs (american DS) come down to UC and try to hang onto your 80% "4.0" first.

Have you been educated in both USA and Canada to make that kind of comparison? I have, and I can tell you that ALL the Canadians in my Master's program are at the top or near the top of our program. That very well may or may not be correlated with our undergraduate preparation, but I think those statistics say something. There is a reason why Cornell and other Ivy leagues have to boost Canadian GPAs in order to compensate for the difficulty.

 

[vahleree]

Like amalgamgrillz and wantVCUdental wrote getting that 80 IS NOT that easy. For example at UofT the avg. for all 1st and 2nd year courses has to be a 65 which is equivalent to a C, they are a little more lenient for 3rd and 4th yr courses if the class size is smaller but regardless they still don't like it high (unless the class size is less than 30). The professors get in a ridiculous amount of trouble if the avg is higher than normal. So even though an 80 is a 3.7 it is extremely hard to get that 80 seeing as though professors are forced to make the average 65.

 

[wantVCUdental]

Lets be honest guys. Up north there is some serious grade inflation. Plus they have an easier time making it through UG without having to hold down a job. They have alot of soc services that make this possible. I say if they want to play with the big dogs (american DS) come down to UC and try to hang onto your 80% "4.0" first.

there are good DS in the US, several are even better than canadian dental schools. However, few Canadians would choose an American DS over Canadian DS, it's just not logical when education is about 100,000-300,000 cheaper in canada. Almost all Canadian applicants at American DS are rejects in Canada... But US schools still take us despite our so-called "ridiculous grade inflation". Surely, most of us should fail out of american DS right Yappy? Another question is, if we are so substandard, why do American DS accept us?

Anyway, i admit UCLA/UCBerkeley are great schools, other UCs are okay too, but c'mon, we don't rip on your school, why do you rip on ours? And if/when you go to dental school and you have a Canadian classmate, see for yourself the result of "grade-inflation".

 

[TriangleZuikis]

I'm not sure how the Canadian DAT compares to the American one, but your scores are really great! Your gpa is a bit low, but if you show an upward trend and took a full courseload of classes I think you will be fine.





oh and PS:

As far as which schools to apply to ... I say apply to as many as you can. You never know where you will get an interview, GPA and DAT are just a small part of it.

 

[Munchy]

Don't apply to canadian schools. You are just throwing away your money. There is no way in hell you can get in at UofT or at Western with that kind of GPA.

I am just being brutally honest to save you money.

 

[txlonghorn]

Thanks for clearing this up for me. When I saw the stats for people accepted to d school in Canada, I just assumed that it was due to grade inflation. My reasoning was due to taking classes in Australia, which had 80% as being an A. I thought this was easier to achieve in my classes there than an A in my U.S. classes (the school I attended there was supposedly a hard school too). I figured since Canada and Australia celebrate the queen's birthday and have similar grading system, the difficulty would be similar. Lol

 

[shahinc]

No Chance this late in the cycle. Don't make the mistake I did last year and save your money.

For next year, you might have a chance at BU , NYU, Tuft and Midwestern IL.

Best of Luck

 

[doc toothache]

there are good DS in the US, several are even better than canadian dental schools. Almost all Canadian applicants at American DS are rejects in Canada... But US schools still take us despite our so-called "ridiculous grade inflation". Surely, most of us should fail out of american DS right Yappy? Another question is, if we are so substandard, why do American DS accept us?

Nice to know that most US dental schools are mediocre in comparison to our neighbor and now we are informed that all we are getting are "Canadian rejects".

Yes and no. Many Canadian schools have 80=A, however, it's difficult to get that 80, and that's why Canadian schools will not look favorably upon an international student who hasn't graduated from an equivalent top tiered University, which has a similar "level of difficulty". You can think about it this way: Letter grades are essentially "universal". A's are hard to achieve at any university, so, if it's hard to get an 80 (A) at University X, then University X must obviously grade harder. 80% in Canada is not the same as an 80% in America.

And now we wait for Doc Toothache to rip my comment to shreds.

Canadian profs must have an uncanny ability to consistently make tests that are as hard at the 80% in Canada as the 90 in the US or is there a different definition for percentage that you use?

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=619685
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=568870

 

[SSD1]

Like amalgamgrillz and wantVCUdental wrote getting that 80 IS NOT that easy. For example at UofT the avg. for all 1st and 2nd year courses has to be a 65 which is equivalent to a C, they are a little more lenient for 3rd and 4th yr courses if the class size is smaller but regardless they still don't like it high (unless the class size is less than 30). The professors get in a ridiculous amount of trouble if the avg is higher than normal. So even though an 80 is a 3.7 it is extremely hard to get that 80 seeing as though professors are forced to make the average 65.

This is so true!!! At my school, even in our 3rd or 4th year, our average is most of the times lower than 70! I think the highest class average I ever had for my course was 72/73! However, there are programs like Physiology and Pharmacology at my school which only have 20 students each and those students are cream of the cream believe me!! The average needed in first and second year to get into these programs is above 85% So in that case, the course average for 3rd and 4th year courses is around 85/86...
However, I believe most of the schools have such programs...so doesn't matter if you are in Canada or states!!

there are good DS in the US, several are even better than canadian dental schools. However, few Canadians would choose an American DS over Canadian DS, it's just not logical when education is about 100,000-300,000 cheaper in canada. Almost all Canadian applicants at American DS are rejects in Canada... But US schools still take us despite our so-called "ridiculous grade inflation". Surely, most of us should fail out of american DS right Yappy? Another question is, if we are so substandard, why do American DS accept us?

Anyway, i admit UCLA/UCBerkeley are great schools, other UCs are okay too, but c'mon, we don't rip on your school, why do you rip on ours? And if/when you go to dental school and you have a Canadian classmate, see for yourself the result of "grade-inflation".

I do kinda agree with you considering the money difference...but for me, I would rather go to a good school and get good education!!!
Even if I went to my state school, the tuition is $55,000/year and its SO NOT worth it!! UBC is not one of the best dental schools in the country!! So depends on perspectives!! I know I will be taking loans either way, might as well go to a good school...
Well I am not sure how appropriate the word "Canadian Rejects" is! I know a couple of people who went to Canadian schools like UBC etc and some who went NYU, BU and Buffalo...and believe me when I say this, the NYU/BU/Buff grads are way more successful!! Some of the dental schools in Canada are situated in very rich parts of the city where not a lot of the people want to go to the university dental clinic to get work done...so they don't have a lot of patients...atleast that's what the case with my state school, UBC is according to what the students told me!!
So before telling anyone that they went to a US school because they are a Canadian reject, one has to be careful that the person might be more successful down the road and have more hands-on experience than the Canadian Dental school grad!!

And for the people who call this whole scenario in Canada as "grade inflation", how about you come to a good Canadian school like U of T, McGill, Alberta or UBC for a term as a transfer student in your undergrad or even for a visit and you will regret that you said such words!!

 

[amalgamgrillz]

Canadian profs must have an uncanny ability to consistently make tests that are as hard at the 80% in Canada as the 90 in the US or is there a different definition for percentage that you use?

No, the definition of "percentage" is the same, but the actual value of grades differ. Getting 90% of the "easier" questions correct is not as impressive as getting 80% of the more "difficult" questions. In my Canadian courses, I rarely had any freebie memorization questions (i.e. List all the steps of glycolysis with intermediate enzymes and products), like I had on my exam(s) in my American program. I'm not at all saying that every Canadian school is difficult or every American school is easy, but those that utilize a 90=A system tend to have a more lenient grading/testing style.

 

[Dr.Millisevert]

I figured since Canada and Australia celebrate the queen's birthday and have similar grading system, the difficulty would be similar.

FYI all Australian dental schools are also accredited in Canada and visa versa. Why don't you try applying to Australian schools? I know a couple of Canadian Sydney dental grads who are now writing their Canadian dental boards and plan to work back home.

 

[z3u2]

I figured since Canada and Australia celebrate the queen's birthday and have similar grading system, the difficulty would be similar. Lol

LOL
Canada and Australia actually celebrate different Queen's Birthday. One is in May and the other is in June.

 

[Kier]

This is actually true.. people who apply to American schools are rejects from Canadian schools (so am I ). And interestingly enough Canadians are more willing to attend U of T than Harvard.