NEED ADVICE: Reapply or wait?

[krnstk95]

Hi,
I'm currently trying to get some general advice and opinions. I'm a non-trad (class of '17) applicant to MD programs who recently tried this cycle but got rejected. I was hoping to get some advice about whether I should reapply this immediate next cycle or if this will be a waste of time and resources because I need to take time to improve my application. (I apologize again for the essay)

Past Cycle: I am a CA resident and this was my first time applying. However, I underestimated my graduate degree course load and had to prioritize assignments over my application so could not finish my applications in a timely manner (which I am hoping is the main contributor to my rejections and that I might still have a chance if I apply on time this year). Overall, I got verified and my first secondary requests in the first week of Sept. but submitted them even later around Oct-Dec. (I know....rookie mistake >.<). I applied to 27 or so mainly mid-to low tier schools in Cali, NY, Chi, and some other states.

-Outcome: I got secondary invitations from UCSD and UCR (I hope this is a good sign since they screen) and an interview invite at University of Louisville (I have ties to city)​

- I spoke to Admissions at UofL and they said GPA could have been stronger but it wasn't too bad because they took into account the rigor of my undergrad institution. Recommended that I try to get some science coursework as it's been a while since I've had hard science classes, but otherwise it sounded like I also could have had a stronger interview​

About Me: I have a relatively low GPA (3.4 overeall, 3.1 sci) as a biological sciences major/global health minor at pretty rigorous private university and an okay MCAT score of 509. I got EMT certified but didn't work and have years of hospital volunteering (400+ hours). Decent ECs from college: Research grant and 1 year research, studied PH abroad, worked throughout undergrad, volunteered regularly (clinical and non-clinical), and had leadership positions in student orgs.

-Gap Year 1: I worked as a clinical scribe and ER volunteer for a year after graduation before starting my MPH grad program.​

-Gap Year 2: MPH program at USC (cali)​

I tried hard to finish this program within one year and am trying to decide what to do this coming year since I did not get into med school.​

SO, I am trying to decide if I should reapply this coming cycle (but this time ON TIME) with relatively the same application as last year but with new rec letters from my grad program and maybe to DO schools as well. Meanwhile, I would find a job in public health, possibly take an upper level science course or two at a university, and volunteer.

PRO: I can start paying loans, which I have a lot of.​

CON: The application itself is pretty much unchanged.​

​

Or consider doing an SMP and reapply next year (will need to retake MCAT)

PRO: I can be a stronger applicant and some SMP programs have pipeline so I will probably have a stronger chance. Possibly may not be wasting money on a weaker application.​

CON: Need to retake MCAT, $$$ for the program (I already have a fair amount of loans), I'm getting older​

​

Or I'm open to other options. Please help. I'm open to any kind of advice as I am very sure that I want to pursue medicine no matter what but I just need some help getting there.

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[jordij94]

If you want more accurate constructive criticism, you should post your school list. I think your app looks great and I’d personally reapply this cycle. But I’d also ask for other schools who rejected you for feedback. A fee feedback friendly schools off the top of my head are Loyola, SUNY downstate, Dartmouth, and Miami. Timing looks to be the biggest issue you had this past cycle, but maybe try getting more than one school’s opinion before you decide how to move forward.

 

[lingmed]

I made some similar mistakes with a kind of similar application--I'm an older non-trad (older than you), 513/3.6o/s gpa, applied really late (and broadly) two cycles ago, got one interview at good private oos school, waitlisted, didn't get in. Reapplied even more broadly and on time the next cycle with an improvement to my clinical volunteering hours but largely the same application, got only one interview at a different private oos, and managed to get in.

It's a bit hard to give this advice from my shoes since I managed to get in, but in all of my experience hosting interviewees at my school during my first year, it really does feel to me like reapplicants are evaluated relative to other reapplicants when they reapply, and there are reapplicants who make significant improvements in their applications (like, taking 2-3 cycles to improve) who see huge success when reapplying, and then there are people like you and me, who make marginal improvements and end up giving the schools an easy reason to look at our apps and say "It looks a lot like the app we rejected last year."

You can always roll the dice and you may squeeze through like I did, but I think now that you've made the mistake (like I did) of applying late, you should consider taking enough time between reapplication to look at your app and say confidently that it looks significantly better than it did before. I hosted one person this past year who took two cycles off to reapply and had 12 interview invites by October...that situation is infinitely preferable in my mind to the non-trivial chance that you would reapply and get the exact same result and then be looking at the stress and psychic pain of thinking about a third cycle. I've got quite a few years on you and you've got plenty of time, so I don't think you should let that rush you.

 

[JSReed]

IMO: Don't reapply yet. If you were a 3.9/515 that might make sense---but you're not, and Louisville highlighted that. 3.4 is below the matriculant average by ~1SD, and the 509 mcat (while solid) isn't helping you get over that. Feel like your options are the following:

• Postbacc: DIY, program, whatever. Generally you want to get your cgpa over 3.5 with an upward trend (you might need to provide more numbers). You really need to value getting As over number of units tho, so don't bite off more than you can chew (at 4.0).
• DO: honestly you've got decent enough numbers that you could reapply in June and probably be fine. As long as you're ok without ortho or derm, I'd go this route. Especially if you're trying to keep the global thing--nobody cares about the letters that come after your name.
• SMP: Get your cgpa up first (since that's a lower-hanging fruit), then think about this. As someone who went to a bigger program with a weaker linkage, I'd recommend you go somewhere with strong linkage (my 2 cents).
• New mcat: tenuous road here. When was your old one/is that at risk of expiring? 509 is a decent number for MD and good for DO, so unless you have evidence (practice tests) that you can do 3+ points better, this is going to be low ROI.
• Get a job: I'd put this at the bottom of the barrel. Taking a couple of classes on the side isn't going to address your app weaknesses. While this is probably the best avenue for personal growth, not going to get you to med school any time fast (Number 1 factor for admissions is numbers). If you can find a way to blend this with a postbacc (aka you could work full/part time and still get to ~3.6 in 18 months), then maybe its worthwhile.

Speaking from experience, with a GH-focused MPH from california, you're going to be hard-pressed to find employment in that field in LA (UCLA has some stuff, IMC is currently toxic). So if you end up getting and moving for a job, that's going to cost you another couple of months. If it were me, I'd focus during the summer/fall on figuring out where you will be/getting employment that's not super insane hours, starting a postbacc from Jan 2020 to Jan or June 2021 (depending on mcat expiry), reapplying to start in 2022. Its a long road, but honestly with the way admissions is going I think you'll find it rough as a CA applicant wit ha 3.4.

 

[krnstk95]

If you want more accurate constructive criticism, you should post your school list. I think your app looks great and I’d personally reapply this cycle. But I’d also ask for other schools who rejected you for feedback. A fee feedback friendly schools off the top of my head are Loyola, SUNY downstate, Dartmouth, and Miami. Timing looks to be the biggest issue you had this past cycle, but maybe try getting more than one school’s opinion before you decide how to move forward.

Sorry for the late reply but thanks for the input!

 

[krnstk95]

I made some similar mistakes with a kind of similar application--I'm an older non-trad (older than you), 513/3.6o/s gpa, applied really late (and broadly) two cycles ago, got one interview at good private oos school, waitlisted, didn't get in. Reapplied even more broadly and on time the next cycle with an improvement to my clinical volunteering hours but largely the same application, got only one interview at a different private oos, and managed to get in.

It's a bit hard to give this advice from my shoes since I managed to get in, but in all of my experience hosting interviewees at my school during my first year, it really does feel to me like reapplicants are evaluated relative to other reapplicants when they reapply, and there are reapplicants who make significant improvements in their applications (like, taking 2-3 cycles to improve) who see huge success when reapplying, and then there are people like you and me, who make marginal improvements and end up giving the schools an easy reason to look at our apps and say "It looks a lot like the app we rejected last year."

You can always roll the dice and you may squeeze through like I did, but I think now that you've made the mistake (like I did) of applying late, you should consider taking enough time between reapplication to look at your app and say confidently that it looks significantly better than it did before. I hosted one person this past year who took two cycles off to reapply and had 12 interview invites by October...that situation is infinitely preferable in my mind to the non-trivial chance that you would reapply and get the exact same result and then be looking at the stress and psychic pain of thinking about a third cycle. I've got quite a few years on you and you've got plenty of time, so I don't think you should let that rush you.

Sorry for replying so late but thank you so much for sharing your experience and feedback! I really appreciate it and it really helps!

 

[krnstk95]

IMO: Don't reapply yet. If you were a 3.9/515 that might make sense---but you're not, and Louisville highlighted that. 3.4 is below the matriculant average by ~1SD, and the 509 mcat (while solid) isn't helping you get over that. Feel like your options are the following:

• Postbacc: DIY, program, whatever. Generally you want to get your cgpa over 3.5 with an upward trend (you might need to provide more numbers). You really need to value getting As over number of units tho, so don't bite off more than you can chew (at 4.0).
• DO: honestly you've got decent enough numbers that you could reapply in June and probably be fine. As long as you're ok without ortho or derm, I'd go this route. Especially if you're trying to keep the global thing--nobody cares about the letters that come after your name.
• SMP: Get your cgpa up first (since that's a lower-hanging fruit), then think about this. As someone who went to a bigger program with a weaker linkage, I'd recommend you go somewhere with strong linkage (my 2 cents).
• New mcat: tenuous road here. When was your old one/is that at risk of expiring? 509 is a decent number for MD and good for DO, so unless you have evidence (practice tests) that you can do 3+ points better, this is going to be low ROI.
• Get a job: I'd put this at the bottom of the barrel. Taking a couple of classes on the side isn't going to address your app weaknesses. While this is probably the best avenue for personal growth, not going to get you to med school any time fast (Number 1 factor for admissions is numbers). If you can find a way to blend this with a postbacc (aka you could work full/part time and still get to ~3.6 in 18 months), then maybe its worthwhile.

Speaking from experience, with a GH-focused MPH from california, you're going to be hard-pressed to find employment in that field in LA (UCLA has some stuff, IMC is currently toxic). So if you end up getting and moving for a job, that's going to cost you another couple of months. If it were me, I'd focus during the summer/fall on figuring out where you will be/getting employment that's not super insane hours, starting a postbacc from Jan 2020 to Jan or June 2021 (depending on mcat expiry), reapplying to start in 2022. Its a long road, but honestly with the way admissions is going I think you'll find it rough as a CA applicant wit ha 3.4.

Sorry it's late but I just wanted to say thank you so much for the great feedback! Your response was really detailed and very helpful. I appreciate it a lot!

 

[duckdoc20]

At the very least I would apply to Louisville even if you decide not to apply anywhere else. Worst case you are out a couple hundred dollars, best case you get into medical school. I think you are pretty likely to get an ii from them again and past that it is up to you to seal the deal. Best of luck!

 

[Moose97]

If you want more accurate constructive criticism, you should post your school list. I think your app looks great and I’d personally reapply this cycle. But I’d also ask for other schools who rejected you for feedback. A fee feedback friendly schools off the top of my head are Loyola, SUNY downstate, Dartmouth, and Miami. Timing looks to be the biggest issue you had this past cycle, but maybe try getting more than one school’s opinion before you decide how to move forward.

To get feedback, is it best to call admissions or send an email?

 

[lalalaaaaaa]

Reapply to DO programs and select low tier MD programs. You're already in a bunch of debt so spending 50k on a SMP seems rough when you'll be paying 200k for med school on top of everything. Your GPA is going to make MD a challenge anyways.

Make sure in this gap year that you are improving your app through new shadowing, some new course work, volunteer, and have a little fun in there too (reapplying sucks so take some time for yourself!). Can you get a 1 year research position, or a public health position in LA, with your MPH?

Good luck!