need advice salvaging career

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I have my MD degree (took 7 years), but never applied into residency. Here's what happened in med school:

I did well in my first year- mostly A's and B's. Did decide to take an extra year to graduate so i could go at a more relaxed pace during preclinical and because I had a history of migraines. Taking an extra year was generally accepted at my school (lots of people took this path).

Sometime in my second year of school, I began to feel fatigued. I also started having increasing problems with my balance. My reflexes were brisker. First neurologist I saw was not affiliated with my school. She worked me up for MS (no spinal tap), lupus, and almost every zebra one could possibly think of. All tests came back negative and she told me she didn't think I was "faking things", but that it might take 7 years to get a diagnosis- perhaps someday my ANA would turn positive.

Fatigue progressed, as did migraines. Saw another neurologist, this time an attending from my school. He accused me of faking my reflexes, screamed at me that I was just depressed, and wrote these things in my chart, unbeknownst to me. After this, many of my primary doctors at the student health center started treating me like a psych case. I was placed on antidepressants, which made me feel really goofy and spacy. I went in frequently with what felt like a lot of thyroid symptoms. my TSH was checked and I was reassured my gland was okay.

Prior to clinical years, got another neurology opinion from an outside doctor. He thought I had depression or chronic fatigue syndrome. By this time, I was growing increasingly scared about clinical rotations and my stamina. I felt really really tired, like I might slip into a coma- but I never did. My legs felt weak, like my muscles had been replaced with jelly. Increasing problems with balance.

Passed step 1 on first try but did below average

Clinical years:
OB/GYN: passed- did at outside facility
IM: had a really hard time (this was before the 80 hour limits), especially with call, which triggered severe migraines. I was laughed at on wards, screamed at for trying to call in sick and so I dropped out after 3 weeks and took the rest of the rotation off to rest
FP: passed- did at outside facility
Surgery: failed. Did 4 weeks of burns, which was mostly ICU patients when i hadn't really learned the floor patients yet. Also, I did not know my way around the hospital yet. Learning my way around was really difficult because I had to always fight to keep my balance and not fall down. Going into the surgeries was painful because I was asked to hold up the patients' limbs, while trying to keep my balance and answer a wide range of non-burn surgical pimp questions that I hadn't yet studied for. I had increasing trouble running up stairs with the team and would get the most excruciating migraines if I pushed myself too hard physically. I did get good evaluations on the second half of surgery, but my school asked me to repeat the whole rotation since I tanked the shelf. I was absolutely exhausted and felt like I could easily slip into a coma.

I took some time off and got some more second opinions from my school's neurology headache clinic:
First I saw a pain fellow. He worked me up for some things, but when the tests came back negative, he decided that I was not sick except for migraines. I was reassuredmy thyroid was okay when my TSH came back normal. He put me on propranolol. He ignored my complaints of arm and leg jerks and wrote in my chart that everything I said should be treated as "hearsay", as I was a medical student and likely overly influenced by reading things in my textbooks. Student health center docs really treated me like I had psychosomatic compliants after that. I had no idea what was written in my chart.
Next i saw a neurology attending from the headache clinic (fellow left, so I was transferred to attending). He essentially agreed with fellow and wrote in my chart that I needed therapy and couldn't handle the stress of medical school, etc etc.

I felt sicker than ever, with increased headaches and fatigue so profound in retrospect I probably should have been using a motorized wheelchair. Just getting out of my car required thrusting my body into the car door to open it.

Second attempt at surgery: failed again- I could tell I was being watched very closely by the team. In fact one of the resident's I worked with was the same one from my first attempt. She screamed at me for being slow, etc... was very abusive. I went to the student health center a lot with complaints of dry skin, constipation, hair loss (I had lost about half my hair), etc. Reassured my thyroid was okay.

The student progress committee asked why I was having difficulties. I repeated what the neurologists had told me. So they asked me to see one of their psychiatrists. I was to see the psychiatrist, take time off, finish up all of my other rotations and then come back and do surgery.

In the mean time, I went back to the first neurologist who urged me to see the campus disability office and get a letter stating that I was to take elevators instead of stairs, etc etc Neurologist also repeated zebra labs and MRI and this time did a spinal tap, which was negative. She said I had "something akin to MS, but not MS"- she did not know, but believed I was sick/ neurologically ill.

Peds: Got good evaluations but missed the shelf by one point. Had to go back to student progress committee, who almost kicked me out. One dean, a pediatric neurologist, told me I should consider leaving med school, as "no residency program would want you with your track record anyways". I tried to explain that I had been worked up for MS, but they were more interested in talking to the psychiatry attending they had asked me to see. Another dean, the associate dean, kept calling me "different". It was well known that he led meetings every two months with the course instructors to discuss the problem students. I have no proof, but I really feel like they were talking about me like I was a basket case.

Psych: passed but felt very very uncomfortable because all the attendings knew I had seen their colleague and had "issues". One attending asked me how much antidepressant I was on, etc. I felt talked about behind my back, and like they were doing continual psych evals on me. In the mean time, I still had issues with fatigue, and my balance was so bad I had trouble sitting upright on chairs with wheels, etc

IM: did well
Surgery: had to pull out of first site because they kept referring to the fact that I had failed before and I felt highly scrutinized. No mention had been made about my disability letter (in fact, the instructor in charge of the surgery course was completely unaware that I had a letter- it apparently was not being brought up at the course instructor meetings), etc- only that I had failed and was a problem student. After this switch I did okay. I did well on the first service and average on the second one where I was being very closely watched by the surgery course instructor. I can understand why they wanted to watch me more closely, but the net effect was that it made me lose my balance more, etc

4th year:
started using cane for balance.
Honored in several electives, but was reprimanded for going too slow in IM.
Pulled aside by dean, who was concerned I would not pass the clincal part of step 2. He also called me "different" again.
I did pass step 2 and with no accomodation other than using my cane.

I graduated in good standing, but never applied into match, In fact, I didn't even get a dean's letter until a year later and it said that I would not finish school unless I overcame my "issues". I had never collected letters of reccomendation, as I felt completely mislabeled and discouraged, and thoroughly talked about by my attendings.

I applied into an MPH program instead and towards the end of this I finally got diagnosed by one of my neurology attendings, who is an incredibly kind soul.

As it turns out, I have Hashimoto's Encephalopathy. It's a rare complication of the thyroiditis, and ultrasound of my gland showed it to be full of tiny nodules. Most people who have HE are euthyroid. It can cause severe migraines, ataxia, fatigue, myoclonus, coma, plus a host of other symptoms. As I was going through school, case reports of my illness were collecting in the medical literature, and other schools were even discussing it in grand rounds.

It's treated with steroids and is often reversible if caught early.
After I found out my diagnosis, I went back through my chart (which was 4 inches thick) to see how many times I had come in complaining of thyroid symptoms (quite often) and that's when I saw all the comments made by my instructors. I was devastated.

Some time (and 3 steroid treatments) has passed and I'm doing better. My balance is much improved, as is the fatigue. I still have migraines, but they are improved.

My question is: if I someday feel strong enough to pursue residency (most likely in neuro), how do I explain all of the above?
I understand that doctors need to be in tip-top shape, and need to be competent so they can do right by their patients, and it's the school's duty to make sure that they graduate good students. But at the same time, I feel let down. I went back to my school's own doctors over and over, begging for a diagnosis and they treated me like I was nuttier than a jar of skippy. And then this was passed around to my course instructors, I'm sure.

Is this situation salvageable? If so, how?

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I'm sorry to hear about your illness and the problems it caused during your medical education. At this point, it might be hard to undo the damage that has been done; even if the negative evaluations are hidden from prospective residency programs, you will still have to explain the length of your medical education. I think that in all likelihood you will have to disclose at least some personal health information to programs so that they can understand what happened to you.

Based on your story though, I wonder if some of your problems might run a little deeper. You mentioned that you failed a couple of your clinical rotations, mostly based on your shelf exam scores rather than on clinical evaluations. These exams are objective and incapable of discrimination. Certainly, poor health can make studying difficult, but I think you will need to address your test scores, especially your USMLE scores (which the residency programs will see).

I think the best advice would be to contact your med school dean's office, even if it has been a while. They can at least give you a sense of what sort of dean's letter they might write and sort of chances you might have at obtaining a residency. It would be important to get letters of recommendation and I would suggest soliciting them now. The longer you wait, the less likely they are to remember you. At a certain point, you will have to swallow your pride and discuss these things with people you feel may have harmed you. I have had students remediate on my team, all of whom have passed. Most residents and attendings want their students to succeed even if they have to repeat a portion of their rotation. The students who do the best are the ones that put on a positive face and try to win over their enemies.

One last point: the fact that your diagnosis proved medical rather than psychiatric is almost besides the point. Medicine is physically and psychologically demanding. When I started a my residency program, I signed a form stating that I was physically capable of doing the job. If a student/resident/attending becomes disabled it is important to take adaquate time off to recover and get treatment. Patient can be harmed if their doctors fail to take care of themselves or if they practice medicine incapacitated by illness. Some students may not be able to return to work at all (for example, if someone was diagnosed with schizophrenia during medical school). Trying to soldier through your illness undoubtedly made things worse.

I hope things work out for you.
 
OP, it may be very very hard to get a residency after 7 years in med school.
You can pursue a career in nonclinical medicine with your MD + MPH, so that might be an option.

I agree with the above post. Residency is very physically demanding and the programs won't be able to make all the accommodations that were made for you during medical school. If you are feeling a lot better now, you might be up to it, but really you have to by physically capable of taking care of patients. The internal medicine prelim year that is required for neurology residencies is physically demanding - I know because I have done it. Neurology PGY2 is kind of like being an intern again, except in a different area, so neuro residency overall isn't super-cushy.

I don't see doing poorly in the surgical rotation as being a big obstacle to doing residency in something like IM or neurology, but the pattern of low shelf and USMLE scores, combined with the problems on the surgical clerkship and the taking a lot of extra time to finish school is going to be an obstacle.

If you do want to do a residency, you need to collect some LOR's ASAP, and also take and pass Step 2, if you haven't already.
 
Sorry to hear about your situation. Since no one has mentioned it, one of the things you should consider is consulting a lawyer to see if you were treated properly. Your career has been damaged, probably permanently, because of late diagnosis/misdiagnosis and unsupporting school. Image is crucial in medicine and any deviation from the norm makes you a pariah. It's both a strength and weakness in medicine.

I have no doubt that at your school some people shiver whenever your name gets mentioned. They know they wronged you in so many ways.
 
Sorry to hear about your situation. Since no one has mentioned it, one of the things you should consider is consulting a lawyer to see if you were treated properly. Your career has been damaged, probably permanently, because of late diagnosis/misdiagnosis and unsupporting school. Image is crucial in medicine and any deviation from the norm makes you a pariah. It's both a strength and weakness in medicine.

I have no doubt that at your school some people shiver whenever your name gets mentioned. They know they wronged you in so many ways.
What a wonderfully compassionate response! I agree that legal consultation may have provide you with guidance regarding how to proceed. I understand your desire to pursue a career in Neuro in (presumably) an effort to give back, but I fear that the emotional component of this matter must be addressed before placing yourself in a vulnerable situation with a patient who is also vulnerable. Maybe after the legal and psychological issues are resolved, you may find yourself better prepared to make these difficult decisions. Best of luck!
 
What a wonderfully compassionate response! I agree that legal consultation may have provide you with guidance regarding how to proceed.

If I spent $200k and 7 years of my life to pursue a goal but only to be jacked by my school, I would not be very happy. This is not some innocent game. We're talking about someone's career which can easily become permanently damaged by misperception in medicine. People have committed suicide over this.

Schools are not blameless. They're very political places. Here's a recent case:

Expelled dental student awarded $1.7 million in lawsuit against 'U'


If you don't understand how people can get angry if you screw up their careers, just wait until your first lawsuit. At the heart of nearly all malpractice lawsuits, it's about how your actions derailed their careers through death or injury.
 
This is an incredibly difficult situation. I think that you would have difficulty obtaining a position in a standard manner. You would likely want to have a discussion with your school about your final diagnosis; perhaps then you would get a more understanding dean's letter (note: if you plan to take legal action, then I would talk to a lawyer before talking to the school). Your best bet, then, would be to scout out a receptive program (use any contact you have) and try to do a year of research there. Becomming a known entity may allow you to overcome looking bad on paper. If you haven't taken it yet, doing well on step II would be very helpful.

All of that being said, if you have not improved significantly with treatment, you may have a very difficult time with residency. You need to be fair to yourself and your patients: if you are not physically able to keep up (by no fault of your own), seeking a non-patient-care occupation related to your degrees may be the best option.
 
I am going to give you more honest advice.

Firstly, I read your story with a simultaneous mix of compassion and dislike. While I know having a chronic illness is a difficult experience, the way you told your story was so defensive, so self-exculpatory, without admitting the slightest shred of truth to any negative aspersions as to your conduct that I really came away from it not believing you.

I'm not saying you're lying, not at all. But I am saying that that's the way your story made me feel. None of us have impeccable performances. We can all be constructively critiqued, and we make mistakes on the wards. You seem unable to admit that you were at least partially to blame (not your illness, you) and as a result I was less sympathetic to what you were trying to argue.

So my first bit of advice: think long and hard about how fair those repeatedly negative evaluations were. Think about your deficiencies and how to improve them.

My second bit of advice: program directors will look at your record and see both repeated failures, low Steps, and poor evaluations as to your ability to put in the hours on the wards. The questions that will naturally arise in their minds are two-fold: 1) Can Finished handle clinical medicine intellectually, and 2) Can Finished pull her share of the weight on the wards?

As to the first, I would study for and take Step 3. I would read, read, read journals at night, get a research job , go to conferences, ask smart questions, and so forth. The first unfortunately is hard to disprove except when someone is working with you directly, sees you on rounds, watches you analyze new patients, etc.

As to the second: this might be the most difficult one to overcome, by far. Medicine is not an equal-opportunity profession in the sense that handicaps are respected (either physical/cognitive disabilities, or pregnancy, or chronic illness). You simply have to be able to work 25 days a month, for 4+ years, at 60-80 hours a week, and if you can't, then there is no space with you. We can debate the justice of this but I think you need to be pragmatic and simply acknowledge that it is so.

The optimal solution would be to take clerkships on the wards, do quite well, and match into a preliminary medicine position. If you do well in internship then neurology programs might take a look at you. Getting a medicine prelim position with your credentials might be very tough, which is why-- brace yourself for the pain-- I think you should try for a preliminary surgery position. I know how unappealing that might sound. But they're basically desperate for warm bodies, and as a US allopathic grad (if that is indeed where your "MD" is from), hopefully in a recent year (is it?), some programs will definitely take you. If you can handle prelim surgery, you can certainly handle IM internship and neurology-- I think so, and I believe most program directors would agree. I think if you truly want to get back into clinical medicine, that might be your path.

That being said, start getting your house in order now. Start studying for Step 3, reading journals, and contacting your home school's dean's office to get a transcript and Dean's Letter ready. Start thinking about letters of recommendation. Research the regulations at various US hospitals to see if they permit already-graduated students to take clerkships with them, or if you can do an FMG-style observership only. If you get all of this done, you might be ready to apply for a preliminary internship in the 2010 match cycle.

And lastly, I would echo Abram Hoffer-- are you drawn to neurology simply because of your illness experience? That might not be enough to sustain you throughout the training, and you might find clinical detachment difficult with your patients.
 
blonddocteur's advice is actually pretty good, although I doubt the OP would do well in a surgical internship given his/her performance on the surgical clerkship and would probably hate it as well. He/she might be able to get a prelim medicine year, though, depending on whether the graduating med school is supportive vs. not. If the Dean's letter is terrible, the OP is hosed, I think.

I also share blond doc's observation that the OP seems to be taking NO responsibility for his/her own actions in this.
 
I am going to give you more honest advice.

Firstly, I read your story with a simultaneous mix of compassion and dislike. While I know having a chronic illness is a difficult experience, the way you told your story was so defensive, so self-exculpatory, without admitting the slightest shred of truth to any negative aspersions as to your conduct that I really came away from it not believing you.

I'm not saying you're lying, not at all. But I am saying that that's the way your story made me feel. None of us have impeccable performances. We can all be constructively critiqued, and we make mistakes on the wards. You seem unable to admit that you were at least partially to blame (not your illness, you) and as a result I was less sympathetic to what you were trying to argue.

So my first bit of advice: think long and hard about how fair those repeatedly negative evaluations were. Think about your deficiencies and how to improve them.

Not to pile on, but I agree; you need to separate physical illness from the other aspects of your struggles in medical school and accept some responsibility.
 
Thanks for the helpful advice.

Dragonfly, Blondedocteur, and southernIM are right. I am unfortunately taking little to no responsibility for what happened. One reason for this is because at the time, it was simply not possible, through sheer effort to correct my deficits, which were that I was slow, clumsy, and awkward. These deficits could not be corrected until I had a proper diagnosis and treatment, stopped the antidepressants, and started steroids and thyroid medication. I am a different person now that I have been accurately diagnosed and treated and my brain is no longer inflamed. Without treatment, I would not have even thought about applying into residency.

I have a hard time understanding how a medical teaching facility took 7 years to diagnose an autoimmune disease. The doctor who diagnosed this noted that I had dry skin, hoarseness, and other thyroid symptoms. She also noted that I had no psychiatric symptoms. Also noted were what she described as "obvious" long tract signs, and brisk reflexes with crossed adductors. These things were noted by the first neurologist I saw as well. I'm having a hard time understanding how every attending i saw inbetween could have written this off as stress, depression, or a psychosomatic condition.

Another reason why I have trouble taking responsibility for this is because my school was cited by the LCME for medical student abuse, and two attendings have disclosed to me that this has been a long-standing problem at my school. In addition, the dean is no longer the dean, as he had harassed other students.
 
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Thanks for the helpful advice.

Dragonfly, Blondedocteur, and southernIM are right. I am unfortunately taking little to no responsibility for what happened. One reason for this is because at the time, it was simply not possible, through sheer effort to correct my deficits, which were that I was slow, clumsy, and awkward. These deficits could not be corrected until I had a proper diagnosis and treatment, stopped the antidepressants, and started steroids and thyroid medication. I am a different person now that I have been accurately diagnosed and treated and my brain is no longer inflamed. Without treatment, I would not have even thought about applying into residency.

I have a hard time understanding how a medical teaching facility took 7 years to diagnose an autoimmune disease. The doctor who diagnosed this noted that I had dry skin, hoarseness, and other thyroid symptoms. She also noted that I had no psychiatric symptoms. Also noted were what she described as "obvious" long tract signs, and brisk reflexes with crossed adductors. These things were noted by the first neurologist I saw as well. I'm having a hard time understanding how every attending i saw inbetween could have written this off as stress, depression, or a psychosomatic condition.

Another reason why I have trouble taking responsibility for this is because my school was cited by the LCME for medical student abuse, and two attendings have disclosed to me that this has been a long-standing problem at my school. In addition, the dean is no longer the dean, as he had harassed other students.

I'm really sorry about all you've been through. I think your main mistake was trying to "tough through" things rather than getting a leave of absence and consulting more neurologists and endocrinologists to get the definitive diagnosis. Unfortunately, things cannot be undone.

I think getting any residency at this point is going to be very difficult. Particularly, I think you are unnecessarily driving yourself into neurology, even though the field may not appeal to you for other reasons and it is not unlike IM in many respects. From just a few weeks on a neuro rotation, I have seen too frequently the tendency of neurologists (and IM docs, too) to be lazy about difficult diagnoses without obvious physical signs and trash all those patients into the psychiatric/psychosomatic pile. Case in point: I saw a patient with muscle pain and difficulty walking who was characterized by one attending as psychosomatic. Another attending, who was better acquainted with the case, knew the patient's history and his family history as well (his father had something similar) and she suspected a channelopathy.

The comments above from more senior medical students and residents such as blonddocteur, dragonfly, southernIM, etc. convince me that people farther along in this career pathway are taking a somewhat more critical (perhaps justified?) position. That would probably carry over into the opinions of attendings and residents who evaluate you both in the application process and when you are in your residency.

At any rate, I would consider becoming instead a consultant or working in some other capacity with a company/foundation, rather than going through residency.

Also, consult a lawyer to determine what can be done about misdiagnoses and any labeling by medical school faculty/officials that may have occurred. I'm not saying a lawsuit is necessary, but a reputation that has been all but destroyed by the misattribution of physical symptoms of neurologic illness to psychiatric problems and personality defects (i.e. "different"), needs to be rehabilitated.
 
Also, consult a lawyer to determine what can be done about misdiagnoses and any labeling by medical school faculty/officials that may have occurred. I'm not saying a lawsuit is necessary, but a reputation that has been all but destroyed by the misattribution of physical symptoms of neurologic illness to psychiatric problems and personality defects (i.e. "different"), needs to be rehabilitated.

I don't totally disagree with this, except that I doubt using the "nuclear option" of threatening legal action is likely to be productive for the OP. If the OP had been denied his/her degree, then he/she wouldn't have much to lose. As is, the OP will likely need letters of recommendation from the med school to get ANY decent job, so being adversarial with them is unlikely to be beneficial, unless he/she was somehow able to win a large cash settlement. It wouldn't hurt to get legal advice, though it sounds like the medical condition he/she was dx'ed with has only been described in case reports and is very very rare and so I'm not sure he/she can argue that the med school could or should have known the diagnosis and treated him accordingly.

The OP with the MD and MPH degrees would be an excellent candidate for some private sector and/or government jobs. Also, the American Heart Association and other organizations have MD's who work for them, and I'm sure other nonprofit and charitable organizations do as well. I think it would be much easier to go this route than try to get a residency at this point, but I think if he/she starts with trying to set up a meeting with the student dean and/or new med school dean, and sends ahead a medical summary from his/her current physician, that might be the place to start. The OP can find out where the OP stands in terms of getting a decent Dean's letter, and if it goes well the OP could then meet with the school's career office and see if they have help/suggestions. The OP doubtless had a miserable experience in med school, but now that the dust has settled, he/she is finished with the degree and hopefully closer to being well, he/she needs to forge ahead. There are actually a bunch of specialties that hardly any med students think of doing (medical genetics, preventive medicine, physical med/rehab) and that tend to have better hours than things like surgery or even IM/neuro. They still will be demanding but likely less physically stressful than some of the typical residencies.
 
I agree with BlondeDocteur. If it all possible, you might want to consider doing some sort of IMG-style observership or clerkship. You say that you're a new person now that you have been properly diagnosed, but a reasonable residency director may want to see proof. All they see is your clinical performance; they would have to take your word that you're better. I think when when you apply, you'll need to take a more conciliatory tone. Blaming academia/medicine for failing to make a proper diagnosis will not likely go over well. A lot of people must complete medical school with concominant illness, stress, etc. Consider all of the people who get through medical school with children or sick parents for example. We may be sympathetic, but ultimately, everyone is expected to keep up with their peers. Again, good luck.
 
Thanks for all your help. There's definitely a lot to consider here. The reason I had wanted to do neuro was because ironically, it's one of the few things I honored in (path and radiology electives were the others). The attendings who had misdiagnosed me were no longer in the picture, so I never saw them on my rotation. Also, at my school, neurology was an elective at the time, and so none of the attendings had been to the third year course instructor meetings where I was discussed. I actually got very very strong comments from this department, and the attending who finally diagnosed me told me I have a real aptitude for it (the chief resident also tried to convince me to go into neuro). On the day she told me I had the encephalopathy, she was careful to point out that it did not mean that I was encephalopathic, and she even offered to write me a letter of recommendation for residency. I haven't taken her up on it, though because I wasn't sure my career was salvageable... and it probably isn't.

I'm not sure I'm comfortable going to see a lawyer, although my first neurologist has suggested it many times, as have some classmates who are familiar with the former dean. I'm not a lawsuit kind of person, but perhaps a lawyer would help me clear my name without a suit. By this, I'm not saying I expect them to make me out to be a better student than I was (that's unethical), but I would like the comments implying that I had emotional problems stricken from my record and perhaps a statement indicating that I went through school undiagnosed and the problem is now resolved. Also, the dean once called up my neurologist to ask if I was "actually sick" and then he wrote comments in my student records that I had no diagnosis but had a "very different personality", whatever that meant. I'd like this addressed as well.

Thanks for all the suggestions for alternative careers. I have been thinking about these as well, plus many others. I am not hell-bent on practicing and so I wouldn't be devastated if it's not in the cards for me. I believe that everything happens for a reason. I guess it remains to be determined if this experience was supposed to steer me away from residency (more likely), or whether I was supposed to learn some lessons to take with me into residency (less likely). In any event, i would not apply into residency if I didn't know I could be competent, compassionate, and kind. Practicing is a privilege, and if any of these three elements are missing in the doctor, the patient suffers.
 
I actually got very very strong comments from this department, and the attending who finally diagnosed me told me I have a real aptitude for it (the chief resident also tried to convince me to go into neuro). ...and she even offered to write me a letter of recommendation for residency

------
This sounds very promising. I think you are right about your Dean's letter - if you cannot get the adverse comments (I mean the ones about "emotional issues" etc.) stricken from the dean's list, you are probably hosed, unless your home neurology program wants to take you. On the plus side, I doubt many nonclinical/nonresidency jobs would even know what a "medical school dean's letter" is so those comments likely wouldn't keep your from getting other types of jobs...they might ask for your transcript and would see the bad surgery grades, but you still are an MD and if you were doing some kind of public health job they likely won't care a lot about your surgery grade if they think you can do the job.
 
I am going to give you more honest advice.

Firstly, I read your story with a simultaneous mix of compassion and dislike. While I know having a chronic illness is a difficult experience, the way you told your story was so defensive, so self-exculpatory, without admitting the slightest shred of truth to any negative aspersions as to your conduct that I really came away from it not believing you.

I'm not saying you're lying, not at all. But I am saying that that's the way your story made me feel. None of us have impeccable performances. We can all be constructively critiqued, and we make mistakes on the wards. You seem unable to admit that you were at least partially to blame (not your illness, you) and as a result I was less sympathetic to what you were trying to argue.

So my first bit of advice: think long and hard about how fair those repeatedly negative evaluations were. Think about your deficiencies and how to improve them.

My second bit of advice: program directors will look at your record and see both repeated failures, low Steps, and poor evaluations as to your ability to put in the hours on the wards. The questions that will naturally arise in their minds are two-fold: 1) Can Finished handle clinical medicine intellectually, and 2) Can Finished pull her share of the weight on the wards?

As to the first, I would study for and take Step 3. I would read, read, read journals at night, get a research job , go to conferences, ask smart questions, and so forth. The first unfortunately is hard to disprove except when someone is working with you directly, sees you on rounds, watches you analyze new patients, etc.

As to the second: this might be the most difficult one to overcome, by far. Medicine is not an equal-opportunity profession in the sense that handicaps are respected (either physical/cognitive disabilities, or pregnancy, or chronic illness). You simply have to be able to work 25 days a month, for 4+ years, at 60-80 hours a week, and if you can't, then there is no space with you. We can debate the justice of this but I think you need to be pragmatic and simply acknowledge that it is so.

The optimal solution would be to take clerkships on the wards, do quite well, and match into a preliminary medicine position. If you do well in internship then neurology programs might take a look at you. Getting a medicine prelim position with your credentials might be very tough, which is why-- brace yourself for the pain-- I think you should try for a preliminary surgery position. I know how unappealing that might sound. But they're basically desperate for warm bodies, and as a US allopathic grad (if that is indeed where your "MD" is from), hopefully in a recent year (is it?), some programs will definitely take you. If you can handle prelim surgery, you can certainly handle IM internship and neurology-- I think so, and I believe most program directors would agree. I think if you truly want to get back into clinical medicine, that might be your path.

That being said, start getting your house in order now. Start studying for Step 3, reading journals, and contacting your home school's dean's office to get a transcript and Dean's Letter ready. Start thinking about letters of recommendation. Research the regulations at various US hospitals to see if they permit already-graduated students to take clerkships with them, or if you can do an FMG-style observership only. If you get all of this done, you might be ready to apply for a preliminary internship in the 2010 match cycle.

And lastly, I would echo Abram Hoffer-- are you drawn to neurology simply because of your illness experience? That might not be enough to sustain you throughout the training, and you might find clinical detachment difficult with your patients.


finshed
I completely empathize with you and your story. Let me tell you from someone who is several years out from residency and practicing now. THERE IS A PROGRAM FOR YOU. Someone will buy your story and empathize with as I have. YOu graduated from medical school. period. WHo cares what your evaluations say. It might not get you into HARvard but it will get you somewhere. SOme FP program or somethhing.. So dont give up.

i completely can believe how people treated you. Medicine is a toxic environment to the nth degree. You have to watch your back CONSTANTLY. You cant give anyone ammunition against you because they will use it. And you with your illness, gave them ammunition.


anyway congrats doctor. keep plugging way id like to hear a success story in the future
 
I agree that there is hope for you to enter a possibly less demanding field--PM&R perhaps, or (even though your experience with us has been less than stellar) psych. (OTOH--if your stamina is improving, I wouldn't exclude IM, Peds, or FP.) If you take away from this the real understanding of how frustrating it is to be chronically ill in this system, you will be a true gift to your patients.

The one time I saw a Hashimoto's encephalopathy in residency it was as a psych consult from neurology, who swore up and down that there was "NOTHING medically wrong with this lady". She later came back in heart failure... :(
 
Thanks for all your help. There's definitely a lot to consider here. The reason I had wanted to do neuro was because ironically, it's one of the few things I honored in (path and radiology electives were the others). The attendings who had misdiagnosed me were no longer in the picture, so I never saw them on my rotation. Also, at my school, neurology was an elective at the time, and so none of the attendings had been to the third year course instructor meetings where I was discussed. I actually got very very strong comments from this department, and the attending who finally diagnosed me told me I have a real aptitude for it (the chief resident also tried to convince me to go into neuro). On the day she told me I had the encephalopathy, she was careful to point out that it did not mean that I was encephalopathic, and she even offered to write me a letter of recommendation for residency. I haven't taken her up on it, though because I wasn't sure my career was salvageable... and it probably isn't.

I'm not sure I'm comfortable going to see a lawyer, although my first neurologist has suggested it many times, as have some classmates who are familiar with the former dean. I'm not a lawsuit kind of person, but perhaps a lawyer would help me clear my name without a suit. By this, I'm not saying I expect them to make me out to be a better student than I was (that's unethical), but I would like the comments implying that I had emotional problems stricken from my record and perhaps a statement indicating that I went through school undiagnosed and the problem is now resolved. Also, the dean once called up my neurologist to ask if I was "actually sick" and then he wrote comments in my student records that I had no diagnosis but had a "very different personality", whatever that meant. I'd like this addressed as well.

Thanks for all the suggestions for alternative careers. I have been thinking about these as well, plus many others. I am not hell-bent on practicing and so I wouldn't be devastated if it's not in the cards for me. I believe that everything happens for a reason. I guess it remains to be determined if this experience was supposed to steer me away from residency (more likely), or whether I was supposed to learn some lessons to take with me into residency (less likely). In any event, i would not apply into residency if I didn't know I could be competent, compassionate, and kind. Practicing is a privilege, and if any of these three elements are missing in the doctor, the patient suffers.

I'm not the litigious type either. I just think you need to know where you stand legally on all these issues. I don't view going to the law as anything but a last resort - getting a large cash settlement in damages. Otherwise, involving the legal system to get comments changed in letters, and the like, would in my view be pretty unproductive. It might work, but then again, what residency would want someone who had previously sued their "employer" (the school, in a way). That, to me, would be a far bigger flag than the struggle through med school itself.

I'm wondering if there might be a mechanism to do clinical work that will give you letters of recommendation. Also, taking step 3 and doing well is a possibility (although it sounds like it would be hard for someone without an intern year). In other words, doing as many things as you can that convince the PDs that you have what it takes intellectually and practically to complete the residency successfully - I worry that they won't take you at your word that you're doing better and may even doubt your previous illness.
 
PD's are going to be very nervous taking you into their program:

1. You didn't do well in medical school, and it's impossible to disentangle what's due to the encephalopathy and what's due to your performance.

2. Although you're diagnosed ad treated now, from your description it doesn't sound like you're really back to your old self, and you may never completely recover. It's unclear whether you could handle the workload.

3. If you do'n't disclose your story to PD's, you'll never get a spot (i.e. you could simply say that you had a "personal health issue" that is now resolved, but that will not fly for all of these problems). If you do disclose your problem, and someone takes you, the ADA will definitely attach here -- they will be legally required to make "reasonable accomodations" for your disability. That will scare many programs, as it's unclear what accomodations you might need.

4. It's unclear if your migraines are part of this, or not. If not, they sound rather debilitating and MIGHT make completing a residency difficult if they cause you to miss work on a regular basis.

So, you're at a fork in the road -- try for clinical medicine (requiring a residency) or move in another direction. Some suggestions:

1. You should absolutely, positively, no questions asked, without delay, review your legal options with a lawyer. The statue of limitations is short, and (Note: NOT A LAWYER, REGARD NEXT STATEMENT WITH SCEPTICISM) I believe the clock starts running as soon as you discover the "malpractice". Hence, if you've been treated for awhile, the clock is already running and the SoL may only be 3 years. Even if you ultimately decide not to file a suit, you should explore your options before it's too late.

2. If you want to continue to travel down the clinical path, what you really need, as others have mentioned is new clinical experience now that your illness has been treated. But as a graduated medical student you will find that difficult -- since it will be impossible to get licensed and you can't be treated like a medical student any more.

So, I have a crazy idea. Hold onto your hat.

Perhaps your prior medical school would be willing to give you 12-24 months of additional clinical training. Basically, you get to do 3rd and 4th year over again. This would give you tremendous clinical experience, and allow your dean;s letter to get rewritten.

Why would they do this? I can think of two reasons:

1. You go to them and ask nicely. There's a new Dean. Perhaps they feel bad. They realize that they really wronged you. They want to give you another chance.

2. You get a lawyer, and sue them. You agree that in exchange for dropping the suit, you get to do 3rd and 4th year over again. Or, you actually sue them for the right to do 3rd and 4th year over again. Lawyer will know best how to do this.

By the way, you of course get all this for free.

If you do this, either by mechanism #1 or #2, you are likely to lose any ability to sue them in the future. If they are not incredibly dumb, they will offer you additional clinical training in return for some sort of "I release you from all wrongdoing" type of statement. You might be able to sue them for millions, so be sure of what you want to do.

Will you get a fair shake the next time around? I have no idea. Hopefully, many people who were ivolved in your previous evals are gone. Perhaps you could write into your "contract" with them that you get to be evaluated by new people.

If you do poorly, you might have nothing -- but you would know that you tried. If you absolutely will not sue them for money, then you really have little to lose.
 
your story is very tragic.

Although this is not a forum for medical advice, I am especially concerned about your diagnosis from an academic stand point. Hashimoto's thyroiditis or SREAT ( steroid-responsive encephalopathy with positive anti-TPO antibodies) is a condition whose very existence is controversial. Basically its a term used for cognitive and CNS dysfunction present in the setting of anti-TPO antibodies with CLINICAL HYPOTHYROIDISM. I am reading that the TSH in your case was normal. Anti-TPO antibodies can be present in up to 10 percent of normal population- hence they are not very specific and in the absence of biochemical or clinical hypothyroidism we dont diagnose SREAT at my home institution. Moreover some endo guys at my residency program think that Hashi encephalopathy is the cognitive slowing we see with profound hypothyroidism and nothing special that she be treated with steroids. You will find good reviews on this controversy on pubmed.

The gland you are describing ( multinodular goter) is not pathognomic of Hashi as well.


I would talk to a few reputed endocrinologists and neurologists before approaching a lawyer. Its true that there are many immune-mediated neurologic conditions we dont understand and they tend to getter with steroids. But approaching the school administration with a lwayer without knowing complete facts on the condition you have been diagnosed with could backfire.

Good luck..
 
Thanks again for all the thoughtful advice. It is very kind.
In response to the above post about HE/SREAT, the neurologist who diagnosed me is convinced that this is what i have. During my workup with her, which led to the diagnosis, I had also gone to one of the top neurometabolic clinics in the country, and while they hadn't even considered HE or checked thyroid antibodies, when I returned after my diagnosis, they agreed with it (and hopefully are looking for it now in their patients).
When the diagnosing neurologist (who is very respected in her field) told me to go home and google HE, and I looked at the symptom list, I knew it was my diagnosis. I had many of the symptoms listed, just never the coma, psychosis, or seizures. I am convinced that the arm and leg jerks I had previously were myoclonus, and so is my neurologist.
Initially, I too was concerned that thyroid antibodies are common, is this a real diagnosis, etc. The neurologist said it would be highly unlikely that both my TPO and thryoglobulin antibodies would be so highly elevated and then I also have all these neuro symptoms.
I found a paper on HE (by Chaudhuri et al in 2003) which looked at 18 patients with HE. The two most common symptoms listed were "central fatigue" and severe migraine, which I think does describe my two most troubling symptoms. They also listed the HLA subtype associated with it, which I have (non-specific, I know). I also had some subtle focal deficits that seemed to come and go, ataxia, and somnolence (which is why I never studied for my boards and was lucky I passed both steps on the first try). These symptoms are also listed in the paper.
There were many times that I would have difficulty with grammar and word-finding. This seemed to come and go and may represent the transient aphasia associated with the disease. Drop off in school performance and cognitive decline/dementia is another symptom.
I'm being followed by an endocrinologist, who confirmed the thyroiditis based on antibodies and the hypoechoic micronodules on ultrasound. She is leaving the encephalopathy diagnosis and treatment up to the neurologist, as she has never heard of HE.
I'm not sure about my thyroid status. My TSH was always normal, yet I did have constipation, dry skin, hair loss, documented compression neuropathies, cold intolerance, hoarseness, elevated cholesterol and triglycerides for a time, puffy eyelids and face, and menorrhagia... not to mention the fatigue and mental slowing (which could be due to the HE). My former primary doctors at the student health center, and to some extent the endocrinologist are not attributing these things to hypothyroidism (because of normal lab values). Yet, they have all cleared up on the levoxyl and cytomel and so I have a hard time believing they are a coincidence.
From what i have read, you can be either euthyroid or hypothyroid with the HE, but most patients are euthyroid. The HE symptoms are not considered to be from hypothyroidism, although to me it seems like there is a lot of symptom overlap (fatigue and cognitive decline). I sometimes wonder whether HE might be from "brain hypothyroidism". I saw a little blip about brain hypothyroidism in my baby Cecil's medicine textbook, and they indicated that the patients benefit from T3 treatment, which I did. Other hypotheses include that it may be a form of vasculitis (I do have livido reticularis, and some prominent blood vessels on my eyelids that clear up on steroids); or that there may be antibodies to metabolic enzymes such as enolase or to the astrocytes in the cerebellum. Some brain biopsies have shown perivascular lymphocyte infiltration. I have some focal changes on MRI, which the neuroradiologists have called "perivascular changes seen in migraine or hypertension". I wonder if perhaps these are the infiltrates, but will never know.
There's a team up in Washington state who are investigating the link between chronic severe migraine and "thyroid antibody disease", which they think may be a more milder form of the traditional HE.

In any event, this experience turned what i thought was a bread and butter disease (Hashimoto's thyroiditis) into something completely alien and sinister. For years, i had this nagging suspicion that there was something wrong with my thyroid gland, but when all the hormones kept coming back normal, I would drop the thought and dismiss it as silly. It never occurred to me that one could check antibodies or do an ultrasound.
 
Although this is not a forum for medical advice, I am especially concerned about your diagnosis from an academic stand point. Hashimoto's thyroiditis or SREAT ( steroid-responsive encephalopathy with positive anti-TPO antibodies) is a condition whose very existence is controversial. Basically its a term used for cognitive and CNS dysfunction present in the setting of anti-TPO antibodies with CLINICAL HYPOTHYROIDISM. I am reading that the TSH in your case was normal. Anti-TPO antibodies can be present in up to 10 percent of normal population- hence they are not very specific and in the absence of biochemical or clinical hypothyroidism we dont diagnose SREAT at my home institution. Moreover some endo guys at my residency program think that Hashi encephalopathy is the cognitive slowing we see with profound hypothyroidism and nothing special that she be treated with steroids. You will find good reviews on this controversy on pubmed.

The gland you are describing ( multinodular goter) is not pathognomic of Hashi as well.


I would talk to a few reputed endocrinologists and neurologists before approaching a lawyer. Its true that there are many immune-mediated neurologic conditions we dont understand and they tend to getter with steroids. But approaching the school administration with a lwayer without knowing complete facts on the condition you have been diagnosed with could backfire.

Good luck..

Good point...this is another potential pothole...if a residency director is familiar with this controversy it could be problematic.
 
APD's idea of trying to negotiate with your med school to let you redo 3rd year, +/- 4th year, is actually a really good suggestion I think. If you go to them with a doctor's statement, labs, etc. and tell them this is what happened to you, but you are now ready to let bygones be bygones if they give you another shot to show what you can do, then you might have a shot. Especially if you didn't have to pay more tuition, this might be workable. It would be a way to show program directors that you can function in a clinical environment, which is what you really need to prove. Whether program directors believe the medical dx vs. not, they need to KNOW that you can do the work as an intern, otherwise nobody will touch you with a 10 foot pole.
 
Yikes!

Excellent advice (thank you!), but I'm not so sure I can afford to work for no income at this point in my life, unfortunately. I had to apply into my state's high risk insurance pool and pay almost $600/month in health insurance, plus a $500 deductible.

After reading the thread about getting kicked out of residency, i am beginning to wonder if it's worth pursuing at all. I'd surely come in with a huge target on my forehead, even if I could do the extra rotations you are suggesting.

As for the controversy about the HE: while there's some not so good papers written on it, there's also some great ones that came out of places like Mayo, UCSF, and UCLA. The question isn't whether HE/SREAT exists or is a "real" disease, it's about the underlying pathophysiology: whether the disease is "caused" by the antibodies or thyroiditis, or whether is it merely associated with it somehow. It's looking more and more like the latter scenario is the case and so the term SREAT (steroid responsive encephalopathy associated with autoimmune thyroiditis) is more accepted than HE. Though one or two papers have suggested that thyroid antibodies directly attack the brain, more are suggesting other mechanisms.

Given the prevalence of the thyroiditis, I suspect that as more doctors become familiar with HE/SREAT, more and more patients will get diagnosed. Eventually, this will result in the overdiagnosis of the condition (as mentioned above, up to 10% of the population can have thyroid antibodies) and so there may be a pull to find more specific tests for it. The alpha-enolase antibody test may be one of these, as it is more specific to the encephalopathy versus the thyroiditis. Right now, it's only available in research labs, mostly in Japan. Other tests used to help confirm HE versus just the thyroiditis might be EEG, which shows slowing an/or triphasic phenomenon (similar to that seen in CJD).

Thanks again for all the sage advice.
 
Having been terminated from a residency, I advise you to not pursue a residency unless it's the only option. You see, some program might take you, anyway, just to seal your career closed. (Program directors really are a big fraternity, and I'm not the first one to say that on SDN.) That is, they'd take you and then document that you don't work well in some way, and then terminate you. At that point, you'd have no recourse. You know enough about the medical community at this point to know that there doesn't have to be anything objectively wrong to get you terminated.

When I graduated from medical school, we were encouraged to buy a disability plan. It was rather affordable, around $100-$200 per year, and upon diagnosis which would be career terminating, it would pay off student loans and in addition, pay out $250k. Did you buy this plan?
 
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Having been terminated from a residency, I advise you to not pursue a residency unless it's the only option. You see, some program might take you, anyway, just to seal your career closed. (Program directors really are a big fraternity, and I'm not the first one to say that on SDN.) That is, they'd take you and then document that you don't work well in some way, and then terminate you. At that point, you'd have no recourse. You know enough about the medical community at this point to know that there doesn't have to be anything objectively wrong to get you terminated.

When I graduated from medical school, we were encouraged to buy a disability plan. It was rather affordable, around $100-$200 per year, and upon diagnosis which would be career terminating, it would pay off student loans and in addition, pay out $250k. Did you buy this plan?
This is a smart idea. Does anyone have any recommendations in terms of insurance agencies?
 
Unfortunately, I did not buy any disability insurance, and I still get offers in the mail every week, ironically.

I would encourage anyone in med school or residency or who is done with residency and practicing to get the insurance! I had absolutely NO IDEA I'd ever get sick like this- it sort of crept up on me. I used to go on 8-12 mile hikes and snow-shoeing trips no problem. A few months before I first felt the fatigue, I had gone on a 30 mile, 6 day backpacking trip in the Sierras, and I was planning on going on another one into the Grand Canyon and back up. I used to lift weights, too- and then eventually it reached the point where I couldn't even lift the bars without any weights on them. I don't mean to sound snotty, but i did really well in undergrad too and earned almost straight A's in my chemistry degree.

So, no matter how smart or invincible you feel, please consider the insurance and learn from my many mistakes. Though the chances of actually needing insurance are small, the price of not having it is huge!
 
Having been terminated from a residency, I advise you to not pursue a residency unless it's the only option. You see, some program might take you, anyway, just to seal your career closed. (Program directors really are a big fraternity, and I'm not the first one to say that on SDN.) That is, they'd take you and then document that you don't work well in some way, and then terminate you. At that point, you'd have no recourse. You know enough about the medical community at this point to know that there doesn't have to be anything objectively wrong to get you terminated.

When I graduated from medical school, we were encouraged to buy a disability plan. It was rather affordable, around $100-$200 per year, and upon diagnosis which would be career terminating, it would pay off student loans and in addition, pay out $250k. Did you buy this plan?
Good Lord! Are you seriously saying that, after being terminated from one residency program, another would accept you deliberately with the intention of immediately firing you so as to ruin your career? I know medicine is cut-throat, but I honestly can't imagine anyone being that cruel and spiteful, especially towards a vulnerable applicant they don't even know and hadn't wronged them - even if all program directors have skull-and-bones type secret societies where they plot their dastardly deeds, which I doubt. That just seems so far-fetched. Have you seen this happen, first-hand?
 
Good Lord! Are you seriously saying that, after being terminated from one residency program, another would accept you deliberately with the intention of immediately firing you so as to ruin your career? I know medicine is cut-throat, but I honestly can't imagine anyone being that cruel and spiteful, especially towards a vulnerable applicant they don't even know and hadn't wronged them - even if all program directors have skull-and-bones type secret societies where they plot their dastardly deeds, which I doubt. That just seems so far-fetched. Have you seen this happen, first-hand?

It seems like the psych program only wanted someone with 12 months of intern year completed, which is required to start as a PGY2. They likely decided that it would be easier to bring in another person than try to figure out a way for this person to remediate the 11th/12th months of intern year @the new program. It seems like the first program was more of a problem, in that they failed the intern at the last minute and perhaps they also phoned the new psych PD and said something bad about the applicant too...difficult situation.
 
I'm not directing this comment to the OP at all.

But if you look at things from the other side, I think it's good that warnings about a potentially awful resident (define that as you will) can be made. It's very easy for an applicant to buff up an application, and a program often has an incentive to get rid of a troublesome, underperforming, or unstable resident. The fact that they make these sorts of calls is either a) extraordinarily malicious, or b) simply to give a fellow program director a heads up. (The latter is self-interested too of course, since no one wants to burn bridges).

Again, I'm not directing this to the OP at all, but we hear the 'wronged party's' version of events so often that we rarely consider how justified some of those terminations, or career-ending evaluations, might be. Isn't it better to know that some people can indeed be 'weeded out' of residency, rather than that subpar doctors are licensed and loosed on the world?
 
I agree with Blondedocteur, it is reasonable and justified to not allow a resident or student to continue on and get licensed if they are simply not good enough or not qualified, especially if they can harm the patient.

On the other hand, I'm not certain that the people making those decisions are always 100% qualified to do so themselves. One example of this that I saw was with my own doctors. The neurologist out in the community that I first went to (and the only one who took my complaints seriously throughout medical school) used to be a resident under the attending who had accused me of faking my reflexes (and yelled at me). Apparently, the attending had a history of behavior like this and he used to throw things and scream at the neurologist out in the community when she was a resident. He disliked women doctors.
In my opinion, the neurologist out in the community is a far better physician than the attendings who used to evaluate her. Her exam was three times as thorough, she picked up subtle findings, never wrote anything off as purely psychosomatic, admitted that she did not know what my diagnosis was, did a thorough work-up, was always professional, referred me out to the neurometabolic clinic, and even offered me IV steroids at one point (which I was too afraid to take at the time).
The attendings, who had been in the superior position of evaluating her, were not so great, and left me sicker than I already was. I spent years on the wrong medications and I blamed myself daily- if not hourly- for my symptoms. While under the "care" of the attendings, every time I dropped a fork or lost my balance, I would think about how there was something seriously mentally/emotionally wrong with me, that i had "issues", and needed therapy for this. They did quite a bit of damage.
Yet, they were in the position of training and evaluating residents.
 
Just because someone is in a position of power and able to evaluate others does not mean that person is perfect, or even necessarily highly qualified. Just because someone is in academic practice, that does not mean the person is more qualified as a physician. There are a lot of good docs in academic practice, but there are also a lot of skilled docs in the private world, and they may have more pressures (as well as more opportunities) to hone their clinical skills, since their livelihood depends entirely on clinical practice (not research, administration or supervising others).
 
Those who can't, teach.

I'm a terminated resident. One of the faculty members suggested to me that I might be considered to have a brain disorder such as Asperger's. Of course, we had a psychologist attached to our faculty who observed me as well. So I went to the psychologist and told him about this, and he laughed and laughed about how he wishes that people with a little psychologic knowledge would just keep quiet. By the way, Asperger's would be a nice little way out, I could activate the insurance policy I mentioned above.

Once upon a time I listened to faculty discuss a certain person. One faculty member decided that this person had to have a disease because of avoiding answering a question. Serendipitously, I met this person and learned a bit. Without revealing what I was doing, I asked something about the same question, and I learned that there is a reason why this person dodged it.

Really, I'm not impressed with any of the resident faculty I've met so far. I remember graduate school, where faculty and teaching assistants spent a lot of time worrying about the way they were teaching, so I learned a lot about teaching, and it seems that many rules are broken. The few faculty who have stuck up for me have no integrity, for they state that they must tow the company line with regards to recommendations.

One of the simplest rules which is broken is giving the student the benefit of the doubt, and testing the teacher's own assumptions. My graduate school faculty would pride themselves on how much they would learn from their students each day, while these residency faculty find it cause for embarrassment! As for the faculty member above, dodging a question is not evidence of disease. The probing aspect of the question should be considered. The faculty member should drop the premise that every person encountered is going to want to obsequiously reveal everything. The error is in the assumptions which were never tested. I was quite happy to learn that this person ended up better off. Needless to say, the residency is replete with sycophants.

I think part of the problem with medicine is that physicians have a very coddled place in the world. Most of them come from elitist backgrounds and have never been tested in the real world. The advantage to this is that they act with more aequinimitas, the disadvantage is that they have less compassion and introspection borne of humility, so although they are very balanced in their decisions, they continue to live with a poor set of assumptions in misplaced confidence.

In summary, BlondeDoctor, you're wrong, and residency faculty, at least in my experience in my tiny part of the world, do a poor job selecting, teaching, and evaluating residents, and should not be tasked with this job without receiving better training. Furthermore, the ACGME systematically abdicates its responsibility to residents in preference for the established faculty...
 
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I agree with everything you said-- or at least, I can grant it theoretical credence. I don't want to paint with too broad a brush.

But I fail to see how your point that teaching faculty are often very poor teachers and evaluators somehow disproves my point. I still maintain it's a good thing that poor residents can, and are, weeded out. Does it mean that 100% of terminated residents were terminated justly? No. Does it mean that 100% of poor, unfit residents are indeed terminated? No. But it's still a good thing that the possibility exists.
 
One thing not mentioned, money.

(1) The states, the entities that fund the public medical schools, they put large amounts of money into every physician educated. If you think tuition was high, try to pay the entire deal yourself. Likely everybody here going to state schools paid much less than 1/4 the cost. So to salvage their investment, the schools often are willing to do a bit extra.

And note that the funding of residencies carry significant federal mandate as long as you can finish in the normally alloted time.

Tying in with #2, that often residencies do not fill up, and extra capacity essentially is free.

So the states and the schools can, for a less than complete investment, support a resident.
 
You're right, BlondeDocteur, that it should work that way.

Please excuse my bitter attitude.
 
One problem I see in residency education is that we (house staff and attendings) really receive little if any instruction in HOW to teach. I think it just gets pushed out because of all the medical info that has to be learned.
Nobody would set someone loose to teach even in a high school or middle school with no training...at least not usually. I mean, it's insanity. But yet we keep doing this in medicine (and/or force people to teach/attend who really have no interest in teaching) and think we are going to get a good result. And we only promote people based on research and the $ they bill. It's insanity, really, from the standpoint of education/teaching.
 
One problem I see in residency education is that we (house staff and attendings) really receive little if any instruction in HOW to teach. I think it just gets pushed out because of all the medical info that has to be learned.
Nobody would set someone loose to teach even in a high school or middle school with no training...at least not usually. I mean, it's insanity. But yet we keep doing this in medicine (and/or force people to teach/attend who really have no interest in teaching) and think we are going to get a good result. And we only promote people based on research and the $ they bill. It's insanity, really, from the standpoint of education/teaching.

I think you're right, and I think that academic medicine as a whole is starting to realize this. At our institution, there are seminars several times a year where one goes over topics of teaching in a clinical setting. I find them helpful, although I wish they were held more often and I had time to go to all of them.
 
I have a hard time understanding how a medical teaching facility took 7 years to diagnose an autoimmune disease.

I'm coming kind of late into this discussion and don't have any practical advice, but I do think you need to separate the 2 issues you brought up:

1. Misdiagnosis by the doctors you saw.

and 2. The percieved mistreatment you received from the directors/deans during your rotations.

Your clerkship directors, dean, etc are not responsible that you were misdiagnosed. It seems that you got a lot of chances from your medical school.
Just because some of the doctors you saw were teaching faculty does not make the medical school responsible.
If you go back to your medical school for letters or repeat rotations, go humbly.

If you think that malpractice was committed by some of your treating physicians, it's your right to take legal action against them and that's a separate issue.
 
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1) Yes, hire a lawyer. The idea to repeat 3rd and 4th is great.

2) Get a job. Any job. one that gets you a letter of recommendation from someone in a science or medical field.

3) Start writing a book about this.
 
Thank you to all the above posters for the advice, especially the advice to go humbly and have a conciliatory tone, etc. I definitely need to work on this, but it does seem to get better as more time passes.

Thanks also to marsupial for the encouragement with the book idea. One of my former attendings (who also had a tough time at my medical school) had also suggested this idea (when I was a student, prior to the diagnosis) as a way to move forward from medical school. It really helped her, and she even shared her book with me. It was never published, just a way to purge out bad (and unproductive) memories.
 
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Good Lord! Are you seriously saying that, after being terminated from one residency program, another would accept you deliberately with the intention of immediately firing you so as to ruin your career? I know medicine is cut-throat, but I honestly can't imagine anyone being that cruel and spiteful, especially towards a vulnerable applicant they don't even know and hadn't wronged them - even if all program directors have skull-and-bones type secret societies where they plot their dastardly deeds, which I doubt. That just seems so far-fetched. Have you seen this happen, first-hand?
"I find your lack of faith disturbing, General. Do not underestimate the power of the dark side."

I was told that in a certain state, the program directors get together to be taught how to screw residents that they don't like. This was told to me by a chief who went on to be an assistant pd at their institution and has since moved on to private practice to get away from what she described as the toxic environment. Do I think they'd actually hire someone with the intent of firing? No. The risks are too high and why borrow trouble? But I would not for a minute underestimate the badness potential of a malignant program. The fact that APD is on here giving good advice give me hope that things are changing for teh better.

Apd's advice is excellent. I'd take it.
 
Send me a note if you're interested in pursing any types of non-clinical medical opportunities. Residency may not be the appropriate route and you may have better options if you start preparing now. Best of luck to you.
 
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