NJMS?

[Blossom27]

Hi, I've recently committed to a 7 year program with NJMS and turned down better and cheaper undergraduate institutions to do so. I've been getting cold feet and wanted to know if NJMS is considered a "good" medical school? I'm afraid the lack of prestige will prevent me from careers in the NIH, CDC, WHO, etc. Would it be better to stick with it or should I just commit somewhere else? I'm nervous about the amount of effort it'll take to apply to medical school, but it would be better to apply from one of the other schools than from the 7 year program I'm currently enrolled in.

This is the residency match list for the 7 year program class of 2015. They seem to be better than that of NJMS as a whole, so I'm getting the feeling that these students could have perhaps gone to better schools? (Assuming it wasn't because they wanted to save money):

EM, Jefferson
Anaesthesiology, Yale
PM & R, Kessler Institute
Pediatric Medicine, NJMS
Otolaryngology (ENT), Einstein
Ophthalmology, Einstein
Internal Medicine, U. Texas
General Surgery, Beth Israel NYC
Internal Medicine, Jefferson
Pediatrics, Einstein-Montefiore
Radiology, Northwestern
Radiology, U.Texas- Southwestern
Neurosurgery, Barrow Institute
Internal Medicine, U. Mass
Pediatric Radiology, Boston U/Brown U
Anaesthesiology, Einstein

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[Blossom27]

And I don't mean to sound snobby at all, I'm well aware that's NJMS is a good school, but it doesn't have a big name attached to it, which scares me a little bit for possibilities. I understand it won't matter if I was going directly into practicing medicine but I'm not sure that that's what I'm going to do.

 

[kb1900]

hi there. i was also an admitted combined program student in high school (not at njms though). i was very immature at the time and definitely benefitted from the traditional process. i wasn't even sure if medicine was right for me at the time, hence why i turned down that route. however, if you're set on medicine, you should absolutely, take the combined program.

there is absolutely no garuntee that you will get into a better school than NJMS at ALL. i had a 98%ile mcat, great GPA, and LORs and originally only managed acceptances (6 of them) at schools of the same caliber as NJMS. Arguably NJMS had the best match list of all of them. I am lucky to have been pulled off the WL at my dream school that happens to be a "big name top 20", but the truth is that that wl could have turned into an eventual rejection (I was also waitlisted at other big name schools).

So long story short, save yourself the headache and take the guaranteed acceptance. You have absolutely no clue the kind of stress you are avoiding. This past year has been absolutely killer for my psyche; my emotional, mental and physical health suffered quite a bit from the stress and im now working hard to bounce back. I have several acquaintances that chose to "apply out" of their combined Bs/Md programs and with the exception of one D-1 athlete, they all ended up at equal or lower programs.

NJMS truly is a great school and I think its matchlist shows that, if you are driven enough, you can match into pretty much whatever specialty you want. On top of that dean Heinrich is one of the best people I got the pleasure of meeting this year.

in the end, the decision is yours and if you want to live without regret, you need to be the only one making the final decision. i dont doubt that you could get into a medical school of a 'higher rank' than NJMS. but the fact of the matter is that nothing is guaranteed in the traditional process except that you're going to go through a great deal of anxiety, stress, and financial burdens.

hope this helps a little bit

 

[Blossom27]

hi there. i was also an admitted combined program student in high school (not at njms though). i was very immature at the time and definitely benefitted from the traditional process. i wasn't even sure if medicine was right for me at the time, hence why i turned down that route. however, if you're set on medicine, you should absolutely, take the combined program.

there is absolutely no garuntee that you will get into a better school than NJMS at ALL. i had a 98%ile mcat, great GPA, and LORs and originally only managed acceptances (6 of them) at schools of the same caliber as NJMS. Arguably NJMS had the best match list of all of them. I am lucky to have been pulled off the WL at my dream school that happens to be a "big name top 20", but the truth is that that wl could have turned into an eventual rejection (I was also waitlisted at other big name schools).

So long story short, save yourself the headache and take the guaranteed acceptance. You have absolutely no clue the kind of stress you are avoiding. This past year has been absolutely killer for my psyche; my emotional, mental and physical health suffered quite a bit from the stress and im now working hard to bounce back. I have several acquaintances that chose to "apply out" of their combined Bs/Md programs and with the exception of one D-1 athlete, they all ended up at equal or lower programs.

NJMS truly is a great school and I think its matchlist shows that, if you are driven enough, you can match into pretty much whatever specialty you want. On top of that dean Heinrich is one of the best people I got the pleasure of meeting this year.

in the end, the decision is yours and if you want to live without regret, you need to be the only one making the final decision. i dont doubt that you could get into a medical school of a 'higher rank' than NJMS. but the fact of the matter is that nothing is guaranteed in the traditional process except that you're going to go through a great deal of anxiety, stress, and financial burdens.

hope this helps a little bit

Thanks so much! So you would say that the stress of reapplying wasn't worth it for you? I understand it's difficult to get into medical schools especially those in the top rankings, but psychologically it's difficult for me to "give up" on that idea right now. (I probably won't be able to do anything but stick with my program anyway though, lol)

 

[NickNaylor]

I'm not going to wade into the discussion of whether or not you should forgo this program. I will simply say that interpreting match lists is a fool's errand. How do you know that's a good or bad match list? What if the person that matched at Yale for anesthesia had Yale has their 7th choice pick on their match list? Is that still a successful match? What if the person that matched in PM&R at the Kessler Institute ranked that first on their list and absolutely wanted to go into PM&R? Is that a successful match? There are very important factors - way beyond that of the name of the institution - that shape the outcome of the match you are completely blinded to, and so I'm guessing that you mistakenly base the quality of the match list based on 1) number of people that went into competitive subspecialties and 2) the number of places that you have heard of before. The most important factors that drive these outcomes has nothing to do with the school itself and everything to do with individual applicants' personal interests and life circumstances. The match list is quite possibly the most useless metric for predicting the quality of a training program you could come up with.

What is it that you actually want to do with your life? Research (that's my guess based on the places you say that you want to work at)? Public health work? Something else? It is infinitely more important that you make the most out of the opportunities available to you than it is that you have a strong academic pedigree. The big-name institutions are helpful in that they have more opportunities available, but going to a place like Harvard does not guarantee that you are going to be successful, and even if you go to a place like that you will still have to take advantage of the opportunities afforded to you. Going to a top 5 medical school does not include in your financial aid award packet a Golden Ticket to life that guarantees your success no matter what.

I am a huge opponent to combined programs for various reasons, but looking at a match list and having cold feet is an absolutely horrible reason to turn down the opportunity to attend a combined program.

 

[Blossom27]

I'm not going to wade into the discussion of whether or not you should forgo this program. I will simply say that interpreting match lists is a fool's errand. How do you know that's a good match list? What if the person that matched at Yale for anesthesia had Yale has their 7th choice pick on their match list? Is that still a successful match? What is the person that matched in PM&R at the Kessler Institute ranked that first on their list? Is that a successful match? These are very important factors that you are completely blinded to, and so I'm guessing that you mistakenly base the quality of the match list based on 1) number of people that went into competitive subspecialties and 2) the number of places that you have heard of before. The most important factors that drive these outcomes has nothing to do with the school itself and everything to do with individual applicants' personal interests and life circumstances. The match list is quite possibly the most useless metric for predicting the quality of a training program you could come up with.

What is it that you actually want to do with your life? Research (that's my guess based on the places you say that you want to work at)? Public health work? Something else? It is infinitely more important that you make the most out of the opportunities available to you than it is that you have a strong academic pedigree. The big-name institutions are helpful in that they have more opportunities available, but going to a place like Harvard does not guarantee that you are going to be successful, and even if you go to a place like that you will still have to take advantage of the opportunities afforded to you. Going to a top 5 medical school does not include with a Golden Ticket to life that guarantees your success no matter what.

I am a huge opponent to combined programs for various reasons, but looking at a match list and having cold feet is an absolutely horrible reason to turn down the opportunity to attend a combined program.

I want to do public health work! I also mentioned the match list as a way of gauging the success of NJMS- not a true measure, I know. I realize that residency is mostly due to your personal achievement, but that's not easily measured right now for me. I also know that different people want different things out of life, but what other information is available to me that would allow me to estimate how that program will prepare me. My cold feet aren't entirely because of the match list, I'll be honest in saying it's because NJMS isn't very prestigious in comparison to other medical schools. I've heard both opinions- that this matters and that it doesn't. The account that makes most sense to me is that it doesn't matter for someone that just wants to practice medicine, but would matter for someone interested in academics or politics.

I'm aware that going to a great medical school isn't a guarantee of being more successful, but my fear (and it's somewhat irrational, I'll admit) is that going to a school like NJMS would close doors for me. I haven't been able to find anything on the internet about doing research while in medical school, which doctors in my family told me is very important in getting a residency that will lead me to the career I want. (I assume that NJMS will have to at least have some research though, because it doesn't make sense to have none at all. But on the website, it doesn't make any mention of students doing research, just professors and residents). I've talked to a lot of people who say residency matters more than med school, but I've been told it's much easier to get a good residency from a better medical school. I'm just afraid of making the wrong choice now and having it affect me throughout my career.

 

[NickNaylor]

I want to do public health work! I also mentioned the match list as a way of gauging the success of NJMS- not a true measure, I know. I realize that residency is mostly due to your personal achievement, but that's not easily measured right now for me. I also know that different people want different things out of life, but what other information is available to me that would allow me to estimate how that program will prepare me. My cold feet aren't entirely because of the match list, I'll be honest in saying it's because NJMS isn't very prestigious in comparison to other medical schools. I've heard both opinions- that this matters and that it doesn't. The account that makes most sense to me is that it doesn't matter for someone that just wants to practice medicine, but would matter for someone interested in academics or politics.

I'm aware that going to a great medical school isn't a guarantee of being more successful, but my fear (and it's somewhat irrational, I'll admit) is that going to a school like NJMS would close doors for me. I haven't been able to find anything on the internet about doing research while in medical school, which doctors in my family told me is very important in getting a residency that will lead me to the career I want. (I assume that NJMS will have to at least have some research though, because it doesn't make sense to have none at all. But on the website, it doesn't make any mention of students doing research, just professors and residents). I've talked to a lot of people who say residency matters more than med school, but I've been told it's much easier to get a good residency from a better medical school. I'm just afraid of making the wrong choice now and having it affect me throughout my career.

Try not to let your anxiety about a difficult decision lead you to rely on objectively bad information - information though it may be. If you want some reassurance, go to any Big Name medical school and look at where some of the faculty in any particular department trained: you will see people from all kinds of different medical schools. You may even see people that trained at international institutions or - gasp! - Caribbean institutions. They are certainly the exception, but the point is that you can make for yourself just about whatever kind of career you want if you are tenacious and ambitious.

One of the reasons I don't like combined programs is that you lock yourself into something when you haven't even begun college yet. There are a lot of implicit assumptions about the person you're going to be in 4 - or in your case, 3 - years that you simply can't assume when making a decision like this. If you're the kind of person that can get accepted to a combined MD program, then you are likely the kind of person that can be very successful in the normal medical admissions process. That being said, it is a bit daunting turning down a sure-fire thing. However, only you can make that choice. Just don't make it based on objectively bad or useless information in an attempt to support whatever decision it is that you actually do want to make. And reading between the lines in your post, it sounds like you don't want to do this combined program for one reason or another.

 

[Blossom27]

Try not to let your anxiety about a difficult decision lead you to rely on objectively bad information - information though it may be. If you want some reassurance, go to any Big Name medical school and look at where some of the faculty in any particular department trained: you will see people from all kinds of different medical schools. You may even see people that trained at international institutions or - gasp! - Caribbean institutions. They are certainly the exception, but the point is that you can make for yourself just about whatever kind of career you want if you are tenacious and ambitious.

One of the reasons I don't like combined programs is that you lock yourself into something when you haven't even begun college yet. There are a lot of implicit assumptions about the person you're going to be in 4 - or in your case, 3 - years that you simply can't assume when making a decision like this. If you're the kind of person that can get accepted to a combined MD program, then you are likely the kind of person that can be very successful in the normal medical admissions process. That being said, it is a bit daunting turning down a sure-fire thing. However, only you can make that choice. Just don't make it based on objectively bad or useless information in an attempt to support whatever decision it is that you actually do want to make. And reading between the lines in your post, it sounds like you don't want to do this combined program for one reason or another.

Thanks for your advice! Yeah, I mostly feel like the prestige issue is unsatisfying for me. I know it's stupid, but it's an ego thing (I also know that if I find myself unable to get into NJMS in four years, I'll be kicking myself for this). I feel a little bit like I've settled without trying, but everyone around me thought it was a better idea because of the security. I feel pretty certain I'll still want to be a doctor, but the issue for me right now is the idea of not being able to get high ranking jobs because of my medical school. If that's not an issue, I'll probably stay in the program because I've already committed to it and my parents prefer it because it would keep me close to home .

 

[NickNaylor]

Thanks for your advice! Yeah, I mostly feel like the prestige issue is unsatisfying for me. I know it's stupid, but it's an ego thing (I also know that if I find myself unable to get into NJMS in four years, I'll be kicking myself for this). I feel a little bit like I've settled without trying, but everyone around me thought it was a better idea because of the security. I feel pretty certain I'll still want to be a doctor, but the issue for me right now is the idea of not being able to get high ranking jobs because of my medical school. If that's not an issue, I'll probably stay in the program because I've already committed to it and my parents prefer it because it would keep me close to home .

But what is a "high ranking job?" What does that mean? I don't know what that means, and again, I'm not convinced that your medical school choice will have any impact on it anyway.

I get the prestige thing. This won't be well-received by most folks here - and I probably would've said the same thing - but if you really think that you'll be unhappy or always having that lingering "what if?..." in the back of your mind by going to NJMS and feeling like you're "settling," I don't think it's unreasonable to turn down the program to see how things might go in the regular process. It is a risky proposition, but if you're worried that you'll be unhappy, then I don't think it's completely unreasonable to try and find alternative opportunities.

Try not to worry too much about things that will be happening 10+ years down the line. Focus on the decision immediately ahead of you and begin moving from there. You're worried about step 59 of the overall arc of your career and you haven't even completed step 1 yet. Try not to get too lost in the weeds by worrying about things that, quite frankly, are pretty much out of your control at this moment in time.

 

[leagueofDravenMD]

Sounds like you are set on going for a school with more prestige, though I do have some words of advice as an incoming M1. the application process and the 4 years preparing for it are stressful. To shoot for a top tier school requires 4 years of consistently good performance. Also, although I may have been more cookie cutter than most, a lot of time may have to be spent on things you may not enjoy just to boost your application. Sounds like the medical profession will be full of stress anyways, but IMO college would have been a better experience without the hassle. With your high goals, you may too frequently ask yourself if there is more to do with your time than doing what you want (greek life, clubs besides premed, non science major, study abroad) to get into a top 20. All I'm saying is, If you pursue the traditional route, prepare to work (somewhat) hard!


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[kb1900]

Thanks so much! So you would say that the stress of reapplying wasn't worth it for you? I understand it's difficult to get into medical schools especially those in the top rankings, but psychologically it's difficult for me to "give up" on that idea right now. (I probably won't be able to do anything but stick with my program anyway though, lol)

You got some really good responses on this thread and I would take them to heart if I were you.

The college admission process even for bs/md programs is so vastly different from medical school apps that I wouldn't even call it "reapplying". It's a whole different ball game. It was certainly worth it for me because I simply wasn't mature enough at the time of high school to put all my eggs in one basket.

That being said, another thing to consider is the years that this process takes. Traditional applicants (those that do not take a gap year) are becoming more and more rare. Likely, if you go the normal route, you are not only losing 1 year, but probably two or even three. On top of that, your college life will likely be vastly different as the poster above said.

All that being said, it seems that you are very driven by prestige even though prestige is largely overrated. You have to decide for yourself whether the risk benefit is worth it for what is a very vague and unclear goal right now (you haven't really described anything that warrants a NEED to go to a top school.)

 

[kb1900]

But what is a "high ranking job?" What does that mean? I don't know what that means, and again, I'm not convinced that your medical school choice will have any impact on it anyway.

I get the prestige thing. This won't be well-received by most folks here - and I probably would've said the same thing - but if you really think that you'll be unhappy or always having that lingering "what if?..." in the back of your mind by going to NJMS and feeling like you're "settling," I don't think it's unreasonable to turn down the program to see how things might go in the regular process. It is a risky proposition, but if you're worried that you'll be unhappy, then I don't think it's completely unreasonable to try and find alternative opportunities.

Try not to worry too much about things that will be happening 10+ years down the line. Focus on the decision immediately ahead of you and begin moving from there. You're worried about step 59 of the overall arc of your career and you haven't even completed step 1 yet. Try not to get too lost in the weeds by worrying about things that, quite frankly, are pretty much out of your control at this moment in time.

This is absolutely spot on.

 

[dinomite00]

Also as an incoming M1 who just chose between NJMS and "higher ranked schools", I think there are other factors like fit, cost, location, proximity to family and friends (or s/o), curriculum, etc. that go into the decision on which school to attend that I could not have even fathomed a year ago, let alone coming into college. From all the advice that I have gotten, prestige only gets you so far and outside of the ~top 10 and MAYBE 20, it really doesn't matter too much after that in the sense that if you are someone who could have gotten into the top 10 or 20 school, you will make the most of your time at any school and excel there and place well regardless. Step 1 has very little to do with the school and everything to do with how you prepare and research will be available to you at NJMS or any other school for that matter regardless. I will be attending NJMS over the 5 other schools i got into that were all higher ranked because it just made the most sense for my situation and I think that not being able to make that choice for yourself is a huge downside of 7 year programs.

I don't blame you for your thought process and that was exactly what I would have said when I was in your stage and would have hated to "settle" for NJMS but I can honestly say that after going through the whole process of applying, getting in to a wide range of places, and being able to weigh the pros and cons of each place and come to the decision of NJMS on my own was a tough but valuable experience and I don't regret my decision one bit.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Just be warned, the difficulty of getting into the NJMS as a college grad is far greater than what you may have faced so far. There is no guarantee you will stand out as well as others at that stage of the game.

But then again maybe you won't want to do medicine, which would all work out.

 

[Sharknad0]

Everyone has covered stuff in a lot of detail but I'm just gonna add my vote to a tally. I say take the program and join it. An MD school is an MD school is an MD school. You won't be suffering through MCAT studying while trying to take classes and being in research labs and volunteering all at the same time. I'm currently a junior and I have senior friends who had (to my knowledge) good stats but no acceptances (be it some average stats, nervousness at interviews, or just plain rejection) and are now figuring what to do in a forced gap year so they can tackle the profession they wish to join again. The joined program is worth it. I'm in UG right now and I've had a close friend transfer to a BS/MD program and he's having the same experiences he did at a big state school. You won't be missing out on much more than you would be in a traditional program, and not having to worry about applying is a RELIEF. Take the BS/MD program and excel.


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[Blossom27]

You got some really good responses on this thread and I would take them to heart if I were you.

The college admission process even for bs/md programs is so vastly different from medical school apps that I wouldn't even call it "reapplying". It's a whole different ball game. It was certainly worth it for me because I simply wasn't mature enough at the time of high school to put all my eggs in one basket.

That being said, another thing to consider is the years that this process takes. Traditional applicants (those that do not take a gap year) are becoming more and more rare. Likely, if you go the normal route, you are not only losing 1 year, but probably two or even three. On top of that, your college life will likely be vastly different as the poster above said.

All that being said, it seems that you are very driven by prestige even though prestige is largely overrated. You have to decide for yourself whether the risk benefit is worth it for what is a very vague and unclear goal right now (you haven't really described anything that warrants a NEED to go to a top school.)

Yeah, I was looking at jobs in the WHO for example. For the position of director-general, each and every candidate attended the top universities in their country. In other such leadership positions in the CDC or NIH, the same seems to hold true (though to a lesser extent- people go to schools that are still among the top, like UNC's med school, but there are some from Case Western, which is still somewhat better than NJMS if I'm correct).
I am afraid of having to take gap year(s), though I was planning on getting an MPH so it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to do that before medical school (assuming I'm able to get in afterwards, which is doubtful).
Thanks everyone for your help!! I'm just a very indecisive person, and this decision has been very stressful for me.

 

[Blossom27]

Also as an incoming M1 who just chose between NJMS and "higher ranked schools", I think there are other factors like fit, cost, location, proximity to family and friends (or s/o), curriculum, etc. that go into the decision on which school to attend that I could not have even fathomed a year ago, let alone coming into college. From all the advice that I have gotten, prestige only gets you so far and outside of the ~top 10 and MAYBE 20, it really doesn't matter too much after that in the sense that if you are someone who could have gotten into the top 10 or 20 school, you will make the most of your time at any school and excel there and place well regardless. Step 1 has very little to do with the school and everything to do with how you prepare and research will be available to you at NJMS or any other school for that matter regardless. I will be attending NJMS over the 5 other schools i got into that were all higher ranked because it just made the most sense for my situation and I think that not being able to make that choice for yourself is a huge downside of 7 year programs.

I don't blame you for your thought process and that was exactly what I would have said when I was in your stage and would have hated to "settle" for NJMS but I can honestly say that after going through the whole process of applying, getting in to a wide range of places, and being able to weigh the pros and cons of each place and come to the decision of NJMS on my own was a tough but valuable experience and I don't regret my decision one bit.

I totally understand what you're saying! My thing about "settling" for NJMS was basically that I haven't even tried the med school admission process and am basically deciding now that NJMS will be the best opportunity for me. I don't think it's a bad school at all I went to NJMS for my interview and liked it fine from what I heard about it and saw, but I really have nothing to compare it to and Newark wasn't where I imagined spending med school. I kind of have the same issue with my undergraduate institution through the program, I always wanted to go to a city school (like NYC, Boston, Philly) and it's a suburb.
I'm just hesitant because this decision is for 7 years into the future and will have implications even beyond that!

 

[Blossom27]

Everyone has covered stuff in a lot of detail but I'm just gonna add my vote to a tally. I say take the program and join it. An MD school is an MD school is an MD school. You won't be suffering through MCAT studying while trying to take classes and being in research labs and volunteering all at the same time. I'm currently a junior and I have senior friends who had (to my knowledge) good stats but no acceptances (be it some average stats, nervousness at interviews, or just plain rejection) and are now figuring what to do in a forced gap year so they can tackle the profession they wish to join again. The joined program is worth it. I'm in UG right now and I've had a close friend transfer to a BS/MD program and he's having the same experiences he did at a big state school. You won't be missing out on much more than you would be in a traditional program, and not having to worry about applying is a RELIEF. Take the BS/MD program and excel.


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The security is definitely the biggest draw to this program, it was actually the only reason why I committed to it. However, I still do have to take the MCAT (and although there's no minimum score officially, people have told me you risk being kicked out of the program if you don't achieve an average score for NJMS) and I have to maintain a 3.5 GPA with no less than a B in science and no less than a C in any class outside. I also have to spend a summer doing research. This doesn't seem THAT much easier than regular pre med requirements to me, aside from extracurricular activities.

 

[DrfluffyMD]

The security is definitely the biggest draw to this program, it was actually the only reason why I committed to it. However, I still do have to take the MCAT (and although there's no minimum score officially, people have told me you risk being kicked out of the program if you don't achieve an average score for NJMS) and I have to maintain a 3.5 GPA with no less than a B in science and no less than a C in any class outside. I also have to spend a summer doing research. This doesn't seem THAT much easier than regular pre med requirements to me, aside from extracurricular activities.

To get into medical school, one needs a consistent picture of excellence and a burst of brilliance with good exam score.

I think human being have the tendency of always thinking things could be better when it could be worse.

You have to balance the level of potential regret. It could be that you arent going to make the director of CDC, versus the regret of not being able to be a physician at all.

At a level above NJMS, getting in have more to do with luck and being able to stand out rather than just good performence. I went to a top 20 school and some of those people are Olympians.

Can you perform consistently for 4-5 years and beat out 99% of premed on MCAT? (Thats what was needed for me to get into a top 20 school).

 

[Goro]

With the exception of CNU, all American MD schools are good schools.

Hi, I've recently committed to a 7 year program with NJMS and turned down better and cheaper undergraduate institutions to do so. I've been getting cold feet and wanted to know if NJMS is considered a "good" medical school? I'm afraid the lack of prestige will prevent me from careers in the NIH, CDC, WHO, etc. Would it be better to stick with it or should I just commit somewhere else? I'm nervous about the amount of effort it'll take to apply to medical school, but it would be better to apply from one of the other schools than from the 7 year program I'm currently enrolled in.

This is the residency match list for the 7 year program class of 2015. They seem to be better than that of NJMS as a whole, so I'm getting the feeling that these students could have perhaps gone to better schools? (Assuming it wasn't because they wanted to save money):

EM, Jefferson
Anaesthesiology, Yale
PM & R, Kessler Institute
Pediatric Medicine, NJMS
Otolaryngology (ENT), Einstein
Ophthalmology, Einstein
Internal Medicine, U. Texas
General Surgery, Beth Israel NYC
Internal Medicine, Jefferson
Pediatrics, Einstein-Montefiore
Radiology, Northwestern
Radiology, U.Texas- Southwestern
Neurosurgery, Barrow Institute
Internal Medicine, U. Mass
Pediatric Radiology, Boston U/Brown U
Anaesthesiology, Einstein

 

[Blossom27]

With the exception of CNU, all American MD schools are good schools.

California Northstate? Christopher Newport?

 

[Blossom27]

To get into medical school, one needs a consistent picture of excellence and a burst of brilliance with good exam score.

I think human being have the tendency of always thinking things could be better when it could be worse.

You have to balance the level of potential regret. It could be that you arent going to make the director of CDC, versus the regret of not being able to be a physician at all.

At a level above NJMS, getting in have more to do with luck and being able to stand out rather than just good performence. I went to a top 20 school and some of those people are Olympians.

Can you perform consistently for 4-5 years and beat out 99% of premed on MCAT? (Thats what was needed for me to get into a top 20 school).

You're right. I don't know that I'll be able to do that, but I've never (to this point in my life) been so overwhelmed with school that something like that was impossible. I know college is harder, but I haven't had any experience to judge for myself to which extent. The same thing is true with the MCAT: I've never done worse than 99th percentile on a standardized test I took. Is that likely to continue in college? No. But there's always that possibility that I feel like I'm giving up on. That's why I'm so hesitant- I know I can't have it both ways, but I don't want to get there in three or four years and realize I could have done better or that I should have taken the guarantee at NJMS (if I didn't).

I think I'll probably end up staying in my program, but I'm just very anxious over the decision. I'm worried because if I end up not sticking to the program, the undergraduate school attached will be the lowest ranking and most expensive that I could have gone to. But I guess I could always keep the guarantee and then apply out at the end if my GPA, MCAT, and feelings all line up in that direction.

 

[kb1900]

You're right. I don't know that I'll be able to do that, but I've never (to this point in my life) been so overwhelmed with school that something like that was impossible. I know college is harder, but I haven't had any experience to judge for myself to which extent. The same thing is true with the MCAT: I've never done worse than 99th percentile on a standardized test I took. Is that likely to continue in college? No. But there's always that possibility that I feel like I'm giving up on. That's why I'm so hesitant- I know I can't have it both ways, but I don't want to get there in three or four years and realize I could have done better or that I should have taken the guarantee at NJMS (if I didn't).

I think I'll probably end up staying in my program, but I'm just very anxious over the decision. I'm worried because if I end up not sticking to the program, the undergraduate school attached will be the lowest ranking and most expensive that I could have gone to. But I guess I could always keep the guarantee and then apply out at the end if my GPA, MCAT, and feelings all line up in that direction.

Isn't it possible to apply out and break your contract? I have a few friends who did this (though they didn't end up anywhere better)

 

[Blossom27]

Isn't it possible to apply out and break your contract? I have a few friends who did this (though they didn't end up anywhere better)

I can break my contract, but that means I will not be able to attend NJMS and will in all likelihood stay in undergrad for another year (unless I take enough credits to actually graduate in 3 years- usually, the first year of NJMS double counts towards the degree)

 

[DrfluffyMD]

You're right. I don't know that I'll be able to do that, but I've never (to this point in my life) been so overwhelmed with school that something like that was impossible. I know college is harder, but I haven't had any experience to judge for myself to which extent. The same thing is true with the MCAT: I've never done worse than 99th percentile on a standardized test I took. Is that likely to continue in college? No. But there's always that possibility that I feel like I'm giving up on. That's why I'm so hesitant- I know I can't have it both ways, but I don't want to get there in three or four years and realize I could have done better or that I should have taken the guarantee at NJMS (if I didn't).

I think I'll probably end up staying in my program, but I'm just very anxious over the decision. I'm worried because if I end up not sticking to the program, the undergraduate school attached will be the lowest ranking and most expensive that I could have gone to. But I guess I could always keep the guarantee and then apply out at the end if my GPA, MCAT, and feelings all line up in that direction.

Ok, so here's the deal. If I were back in your shoes, knowing what I know now, this would be what I do.

What other programs did I get into?

If I get into Harvard, Princeton, Yale, MIT, Stanford, and those undergrads are cheaper than the combined program, I may consider.

If not, I would stick with NJMS.

So here's this weird thing about medicine. The competitiveness doesn't correlate to name.

For example, the difficult of getting into say, Columbia undergrad, is easier than getting into NJMS medical school, which is inturn easier than getting into Ohio State ortho. The harder the specialty is, the harder at the top.

So NJMS med school acceptance is already vastly "prestigous".

I do believe top 3, maybe 5 undergrad can open up doors in life that others can (less about medicine, more about business).

But those are the only places worth declining your current gigs for.

Not Cornell, not NYU, not UC Berkeley, etc. it's not worth it unless it's the very top.

 

[Goro]

California Northstate

 

[Blossom27]

Ok, so here's the deal. If I were back in your shoes, knowing what I know now, this would be what I do.

What other programs did I get into?

If I get into Harvard, Princeton, Yale, MIT, Stanford, and those undergrads are cheaper than the combined program, I may consider.

If not, I would stick with NJMS.

So here's this weird thing about medicine. The competitiveness doesn't correlate to name.

For example, the difficult of getting into say, Columbia undergrad, is easier than getting into NJMS medical school, which is inturn easier than getting into Ohio State ortho. The harder the specialty is, the harder at the top.

So NJMS med school acceptance is already vastly "prestigous".

I do believe top 3, maybe 5 undergrad can open up doors in life that others can (less about medicine, more about business).

But those are the only places worth declining your current gigs for.

Not Cornell, not NYU, not UC Berkeley, etc. it's not worth it unless it's the very top.

Ok, that's very helpful. No, those schools were not the ones I was considering (McGill and Tulane, both of which would be cheaper for my family because of scholarships but are not in that league you mentioned). Thanks so much!

 

[Frogger27]

Ok, that's very helpful. No, those schools were not the ones I was considering (McGill and Tulane, both of which would be cheaper for my family because of scholarships but are not in that league you mentioned). Thanks so much!

I'd take NJMS if that's the case. The chance of following through with 7 year program will mitigate the higher price. If you end up switching out of the program, neither of those schools are Significantly better that it would have a substantial difference in your career

 

[kb1900]

Ok, that's very helpful. No, those schools were not the ones I was considering (McGill and Tulane, both of which would be cheaper for my family because of scholarships but are not in that league you mentioned). Thanks so much!

I'd take NJMS in this case as well. If you somehow manage to publish first author in high impact journals, get a >520 on the MCAT etc etc then you can consider breaking your contract.

McGill and Tulane are not worth it at all. If you were considering Harvard or something then there would be something to talk about

 

[DrfluffyMD]

Glad I may have potentially changed your life. The other schools will not be better. McGill may actually be worse (being Canadian)

 

[Blossom27]

Thanks all, I really appreciate your advice and feel more at ease with my decision now. It really means a lot