Northwestern- past and current students

[kes5573]

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To anyone who is a current student or alum at Northwestern, can you provide pro's/con's of your experience? What are your thoughts on the 90 person class size? Did you like the synthesis project? Did you think it was a very competitive program?

Thanks in advance!

 

[HareBearDPT]

I'd like to know this as well!

 

[tortugasninjas]

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[BruinPT92]

To anyone who is a current student or alum at Northwestern, can you provide pro's/con's of your experience? What are your thoughts on the 90 person class size? Did you like the synthesis project? Did you think it was a very competitive program?

Thanks in advance!

I am not a current student, but I was accepted this cycle and I visited the school last week. I was very worried about the 90+ student class size but from my understanding, they break down those classes into smaller groups of about 8-15 students for one professor. I believe that more of your first year classes will be in lectures with everyone (physio for ex.) but not so much your 2nd year classes. The lecture rooms are long from the front of the room to the back but there are huge screens above every table so everyone can see the same things. Everyone gets an iPad too so you can upload docs or zoom in on something from your own iPad and display it on everyone's TV screen.

The classrooms are very adaptable as well, they have mobile dividers that they can shift to change one big classroom into multiple small groups. The anatomy labs are mostly dissections, with some prosections, and they have 5 students to one cadaver. The Rehab Institute of Chicago is also a big highlight of the school. The RIC has a partnership with NU I think and you can do one of your clinicals here and work with stroke/neuro and prosthetics patients.

The synthesis groups are a HUGE positive for me. It's one thing for a school to say that they offer research for students, but then few students actually pursue it, but at NU, every student has a block of like 3-4 hours on Mondays and/or Wednesdays in which they work with their research group (from spring of 1st year to spring of 2nd year I believe). At another school, you may have classes from 9-5pm and then if you want to help with research, you would probably have to stay after school for an extra couple of hours; this is why I'm assuming that many students at other "big research schools" do not actually help with research. At NU, the students design the research project, they write the proposals, recruit the test subjects, etc-- the advisor(s) mostly coach them through it. At the end of the project, students usually get published for their work. But with this experience, there is also a level of sacrifice.. I visited the students in the week prior to their finals week and I observed a research group of students continuing with their project for this 3-4 hr block. Some of the group had to schedule to come back to the lab during their winter break in order to do a follow-up with the patients.

As I've heard from other programs, I think it takes some students more than others to stop worrying about their grades and tp work more cohesively, but all the students seemed really chill. The city of Chicago is also really dope and NU is right in the heart of the Magnificent Mile. I don't know if you're from Illinois or if you've ever been there but there is sooooo much to do and I had a ton of fun visiting. I could seriously go for a week there on vacation.

 

[HareBearDPT]

I am not a current student, but I was accepted this cycle and I visited the school last week. I was very worried about the 90+ student class size but from my understanding, they break down those classes into smaller groups of about 8-15 students for one professor. I believe that more of your first year classes will be in lectures with everyone (physio for ex.) but not so much your 2nd year classes. The lecture rooms are long from the front of the room to the back but there are huge screens above every table so everyone can see the same things. Everyone gets an iPad too so you can upload docs or zoom in on something from your own iPad and display it on everyone's TV screen.

The classrooms are very adaptable as well, they have mobile dividers that they can shift to change one big classroom into multiple small groups. The anatomy labs are mostly dissections, with some prosections, and they have 5 students to one cadaver. The Rehab Institute of Chicago is also a big highlight of the school. The RIC has a partnership with NU I think and you can do one of your clinicals here and work with stroke/neuro and prosthetics patients.

The synthesis groups are a HUGE positive for me. It's one thing for a school to say that they offer research for students, but then few students actually pursue it, but at NU, every student has a block of like 3-4 hours on Mondays and/or Wednesdays in which they work with their research group (from spring of 1st year to spring of 2nd year I believe). At another school, you may have classes from 9-5pm and then if you want to help with research, you would probably have to stay after school for an extra couple of hours; this is why I'm assuming that many students at other "big research schools" do not actually help with research. At NU, the students design the research project, they write the proposals, recruit the test subjects, etc-- the advisor(s) mostly coach them through it. At the end of the project, students usually get published for their work. But with this experience, there is also a level of sacrifice.. I visited the students in the week prior to their finals week and I observed a research group of students continuing with their project for this 3-4 hr block. Some of the group had to schedule to come back to the lab during their winter break in order to do a follow-up with the patients.

As I've heard from other programs, I think it takes some students more than others to stop worrying about their grades and tp work more cohesively, but all the students seemed really chill. The city of Chicago is also really dope and NU is right in the heart of the Magnificent Mile. I don't know if you're from Illinois or if you've ever been there but there is sooooo much to do and I had a ton of fun visiting. I could seriously go for a week there on vacation.

Thanks for you input! Since you visited the school already, I'm assuming that you're not going to the Open House in January? Are you set on going to Northwestern or are you still waiting on other schools?

 

[deleted699287]

Pretty late reply, but for those who may still find this thread helpful:

I am currently a 2nd year in the program.

Synthesis project: It is honestly an afterthought for myself and many students I know. Certain projects are neat, but going to meetings with your group and doing busy work for your synthesis project are honestly the last things you want to have to do when you are swamped with the rest of PT school. You are not playing a major role in the research. If I could just not participate in a project, I probably would so that I can focus on school. If you are interested in a job where you can also participate in research, then it may give you a competitive advantage. If you don't care about research after school, then it's probably more of a pain than a plus.

Class size: Pretty large, but not really an issue. The program will split you into smaller groups when appropriate.

Competition within: I think you just have to find your group of people. Like most PT schools, there are going to be a decent amount of people a little more crazy about grades and school than others. But there plenty of different people. Even with grade-crazed people and students that will undoubtedly cry after every exam, most students are supportive of one another and we want to see each other succeed.

Inefficient class time: I don't know about other programs, but you are in class A LOT and it's "mandatory." People in my class almost never miss class. You will be in class 8am to 3 or 5pm Monday-Friday. With a likely decent 20-40 minute commute there/back, it wears you down. After the first few months, there are a few days here and there you have a half day. Overall I found it very difficult to find the energy and time to study after class. Every class is 2 hours. You have a lot of classes like psychosoc, clinical practice seminar, professional role development that are just absolutely dreadful.

The faculty: There are mostly really great faculty but also a few awful faculty. Overall the musculoskeletal and kines professors are great. All really approachable and knowledgeable. I wish that we had these guys running the show. Unfortunately, the really great faculty seem to be lower in the pecking order in the faculty hierarchy. I could be dead wrong, but I personally do not feel like the faculty at the top have my back and want me to succeed. Based on how the program is run in general, I do not think that we are set up for success. Particularly Julius "Jules" Dewald at the very head of the program. He is so infatuated with neuroscience that the school is neck deep in it. Leads to my next point:

Northwestern DPT is very neuro-focused: They will tell you on orientation that they are not and throw in some baloney to convince you, but don't buy it. I am in my second year and there is A LOT of neuroscience classes and the classes are very in-depth. I have friends in medical school and we are learning almost identical depth of material. Is that good? If you have all the time in the world to study and learn it all, then that's pretty cool. Unfortunately, time is a constraint, and you will quickly adopt an attitude where you just want to learn what you need in real life. Neuroscience is necessary, but I don't believe it is to this extent. If that's something you want, then good. For me, this is a con.

It's expensive: Don't underestimate the amount and impact of loans. PT's are not making MD salaries. There are some threads on salaries, but I believe you will be likely making 60-65k when you start. And you will have $100k+ in loans with interest that accrues immediately, which may end up being somewhere near $120k (not including undergrad loans). Making $60-75k salary, that is going to take a long time to pay off. Like 10-20 years for many people. Just something to keep in mind. UIC seems solid and it's much more affordable.

Clinical sites: School has partnership with RIC, but that just mainly means you will have some NU grads that work at RIC help for some lab portions for classes. You are not guaranteed a clinical site there. Sites are pretty limited. I have chosen my first three clinical locations up to this point. There are generally 100-105 or so spots with 90-95 students. Most are in Chicago and Chicago suburb area with maybe 20-30% outside of Chicago. Some not so desirable locations. Idk how it is for other schools, but it's like a game of musical chairs. If you have 500 spots and 90-95 people, you will probably be okay. But with 100 spots with 90 people, there's a decent chance you will go somewhere you don't like. You make a wishlist and you should be placed somewhere on your wishlist. Usually a limited amount of acute spots (25 ish) and mostly outpatient. Overall, it's not too bad though. I have been fortunate and have had good selections. If you want, you can maybe ask Northwestern for the current list of clinical site locations.

Type of school work: A lot of studying. Again idk about other schools, but we have to do A LOT of reflections and research papers. A decent amount of random projects thrown in here and there too. This is again really tough when all you want to do is study for a musculoskeletal exam coming up on the knee, but you have to write a 3-5 page paper about your thoughts on disability. Again, this is a nice assignment that has some value, but it's not necessary. And you don't want unnecessary things you have to do when time is limited.

Overall: I think the professors you work with day to day are pretty solid in general (minus the few at the top), but I think it's generally a pretty inefficient program with a lot of wasted in-class time. At this point, my attitude is (along with many classmates): "This program kind of sucks. The magic of the name "Northwestern" wore off really quickly. Whatever let's just suck it up and get through this. Am I going to be prepared for my clinicals and work? Probably. Did I do a lot of unnecessary work? Absolutely."

A lot of negative stuff, but I am just trying to be honest, because people will be constantly trying to sell the program to you. Be weary of drinking the Kool-aid.

 

[Stressedout27]

I AGREE Wholeheartedly with the above post being a former student The only thing I disagree is the class size is a big hindrance different professors telling you different things within the small groups confuse you so much you don't know what to do on an exam if you don't have one of the smaller group professors or teachers grading you! I do believe everything was spot on however I feel that the higher up professors do give off that vibe but some of the nice ones give off that vibe as well. I appreciate @BigBeef giving an HONEST view of their PT school experience vs trying to butter it up for the public!

 

[ROSTedFlakes]

@BigBeef thanks for the honest, in-depth response. I've been accepted to Northwestern this cycle and am going to the open house in January, but I'm kinda skeptical about the program and if it's worth the price tag. Were there any parts of the program/living in that area that you enjoyed (aside from the day-to-day faculty)?

 

[deleted699287]

@BigBeef thanks for the honest, in-depth response. I've been accepted to Northwestern this cycle and am going to the open house in January, but I'm kinda skeptical about the program and if it's worth the price tag. Were there any parts of the program/living in that area that you enjoyed (aside from the day-to-day faculty)?

Thanks for asking. Here are some positives from my point of view. With my previous post and this post, this is just one person's opinion. I try to be fair, but nonetheless take it with a grain of salt.

I am sure this is similar across many programs, but I am thankful for my classmates. I doubt any school is perfect, and your classmates are the community that keep you grounded/sane/somewhat happy. I don't know if that is specific to Northwestern, but it is a testament and shout out that - no matter how bad the program can get - you can survive with good friends.

ANATOMY - I think the anatomy course is run very well. Taught by Kirsten Moisio and she is amazing. It's tough and in-depth, but she lays out the information really well. And she has course notes that are very easy to follow. I am bad at memorizing things, but she helps you to understand. You have lab groups of 4-5 people per body and use a dissector guide. Once your group figures out a system and gets to know one another, it runs pretty smoothly. The anatomy staff are also all very upbeat and keep those loooong labs more manageable. The class size is large though, so it is difficult to get one of them. They are definitely not readily available, but they are helpful when they are with your group.

KINES - I also think this course is run pretty well. Together with anatomy and musculoskeletal disorders, the faculty are good about integrating and connecting these classes so you get a lot of overlap, which is good. Going into year 2, I was forgetting a lot of material about biomechanics and anatomy, which made me nervous. However, they reintroduce a lot of the important overarching concepts - like the arthrokinematics of the knee - over and over again and really drill it into you. I appreciate this type of teaching style that helps to create a sort of learning snowball effect.

MUSCULOSKELETAL - You don't start these courses until year 2, which seems kind of late. Try to avoid outpatient for your first clinical. This class is also pretty difficult, but the faculty are all really helpful. During lab, they are really good about roaming the class. During lab, a faculty will actively stop by your group and ask you if you need help with anything every 5-10 minutes, which is nice. I would say I like all of the faculty involved in this class. The main are Jeff Hartman, Craig Hensley, Doug Conroy, Amee Seitz, Alison Chang, Kirsten Moisio, and a bunch of other clinicians/teachers that come and help - all really great. Really don't have much bad to say about any of them. I actually look forward to these classes, and I wish I had more time to study for these classes.

LIVING IN CHICAGO - I love Chicago. But let's be real. You will not be having huge loads of free time (or the energy) to really enjoy the city regularly. Maybe a restaurant you want to try out here and there. A decent amount of people will go out on Fridays regularly. But day to day you will be in class/commuting/studying/watching Netflix. If you live very close to school, lakeshore drive is nice for running/biking. But the rent in that area is pretty high - people in my class seem to pay $1000-1500 per person. I could be way off, so that's something to check. The amount of traffic and high rent are things to consider. I would advise finding an apartment near one of the CTA lines or express buses somewhere a bit further from school in an area that you like. Check the commute times and anything around 20-25 minutes is reasonable, and it will decrease your rent significantly. Definitely manageable if you look in the right places.

IPAD - This may depend. You are "given" an iPad (paid for by your tuition) and use Notability to download lectures and take notes on (keyboard and/or stylus). This took some getting used to, but I enjoy it. You can download textbooks too. I don't know how realistic this is, but I am sure it will be nice/helpful to have all my school notes organized and consolidated onto an iPad for easier reference.

Let me know if there is a certain part of the program you want to know more about!