Not excited about my Match results

[Dr. Scribe]

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No

So one doesn't have a better chance at matching into one's home program? Or, this practice just isn't done for other reasons?

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

So one doesn't have a better chance at matching into one's home program? Or, this practice just isn't done for other reasons?

I think the no was in response to you asking if it was #1 for safety reasons. The way the match works, you rank by your preference and it won't hurt you. A lot of people rank home #1 simply because they like it the most, are comfortable there, may have family, etc.

 

[Wordead]

1. You should be smart enough to realize that mentioning your match into a surgical sub would automatically lose sympathy from most of SDN
2. What you're feeling is normal. I matched at I think my #3 and was profoundly upset for a week. Though I wasnt silly enough to complain about it out loud. But I empathize with what you're feeling. It'll work out. In the end you're in your specialty of choice and for a limited duration of time.

 

[Dr. Scribe]

I think the no was in response to you asking if it was #1 for safety reasons. The way the match works, you rank by your preference and it won't hurt you. A lot of people rank home #1 simply because they like it the most, are comfortable there, may have family, etc.

Oh okay, I see. Thanks!

So, in theory, one could rank Top tier programs first and (as long as they ranked some more reasonable programs somewhere in their list) could still match?

 

[DrMcLovin]

Oh okay, I see. Thanks!

So, in theory, one could rank Top tier programs first and (as long as they ranked some more reasonable programs somewhere in their list) could still match?

This video explains how the match algorithm works:

 

[Psai]

I will never understand how people have so much trouble understanding the match. It seems pretty straightforward although it was genius to think it up.

 

[Dr. Scribe]

I will never understand how people have so much trouble understanding the match. It seems pretty straightforward although it was genius to think it up.

A lot of people probably haven't had it explained to them before....

 

[Dr. Scribe]

This video explains how the match algorithm works:

Very informative video, thanks! One question that wasn't addressed in the video: can one only rank a program that he/she interviewed at? What is stopping one from ranking an obscene number of programs to prevent having to go through SOAP?

 

[sunshinefl]

Very informative video, thanks! One question that wasn't addressed in the video: can one only rank a program that he/she interviewed at? What is stopping one from ranking an obscene number of programs to prevent having to go through SOAP?

I'm pretty sure you can rank any program you want, interview or not. But it won't help you, because without an interview, the program won't know of you in order to put you on their rank order list.

 

[Newyawk]

I was also curious about that - is it generally easier to match to your home program (even if your home program is MGH, etc.)?
why is that the case?/not the case?

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

Very informative video, thanks! One question that wasn't addressed in the video: can one only rank a program that he/she interviewed at? What is stopping one from ranking an obscene number of programs to prevent having to go through SOAP?

You can rank any program you want (after a certain number you start paying more, I think), but you have to be ranked by a program to possibly match, and if a program didn't interview you they're not gonna rank you (unless there was some miraculous typo).

 

[Chillbo Baggins]

I was also curious about that - is it generally easier to match to your home program (even if your home program is MGH, etc.)?
why is that the case?/not the case?

It depends. Often it behooves a program to take people from their own school, plus they're more likely to be a known commodity if they've been involved in the department for several years, vs a month for a rotator or day for an interviewee. The super competitive programs might be a bit of a different story.

 

[Stagg737]

Shouldn't that processing be made before making a list 'so far down'? I mean if one can anticipate getting so upset about it before hand, wouldnt it help to recognize that and not rank it at all?

When deciding not to rank a program you have to ask "Would I rather risk not matching at all than match into that program?" If you felt so negatively about a program that you'd rather not match than do residency there, then you shouldn't rank it. Otherwise you should rank everywhere you interview. Go look in the residency sub-forums and you'll see many people who either turned down interviews or decided not to rank programs who ended up having to SOAP or not matching at all. Everyone I've seen said not interview/ranking those programs was the biggest mistake they've made.

I'll be honest, if I had hit a certain number of interviews I was considering not ranking my last choice because I had some real concerns about the program. If I'd matched there I would have been disappointed, but at the end of the day I would have rather matched somewhere I didn't like and still be able to become a psychiatrist than not match at all. There's nothing wrong with being disappointed about dropping far down your ROL, the lack of perspective some people display is what I (and I think most people) find annoying though.

 

[treebeardette]

Do most people rank their home institution's program #1 for safety reasons? I have yet to begin med school but would love some tips on how to match successfully.

Sorry for the thread hijacking, OP. Congrats on matching into your field of choice!

That's not how the match algorithm works. Always rank according to preference.
How the NRMP Match Works

It's always a good idea to apply to and rank your home program.

 

[Chelsea FC]

That's not how the match algorithm works. Always rank according to preference.
How the NRMP Match Works

It's always a good idea to apply to and rank your home program.

When I ask my mentor if our program like to keep their own students he just said we rank the best applicants regardless of where they went to medical school. So if that's the case is a home program more beneficial in the sense of getting stronger letters and advocates to make calls for you and not necessarily that they will rank you highly. Looking at to schools like mayo and Havard most of their students end up in their programs. I wonder why most schools don't do this.

 

[Redpancreas]

Not directly related to the thread, but contrary to some opinion, I just wanted to emphasize the importance of ranking ALL your programs, even in fields such as Internal Medicine/Family Medicine. I sometimes heard things on the trail like “this place asked me XYZ I so didn’t rank them” or some advice people tend to dole out is “if you really wouldn’t be happy about a program, don’t rank them”.

Many times this doesn’t come back to bite applicants who say this because it’s usually the stronger and more confident ones who like to throw these phrases around, but the fact is you would much rather match at your 16th or 20th choice than go into the SOAP. If you’re applying to an uncompetitive field like FM/IM field, the places available in the SOAP are literally the worst of the worst and even if that one university program seems much worse than the others, I highly recommend you still rank them. If you’re applying to gen surg/em which are a bit more competitive overall, you better be ranking all your programs (even if they’re above 20) because there are literally a single digit number of those categorical EM/Surgery positions in SOAP. While it’s true that Prelim Surgery is always available, I’ve seen some brutal cases of people being strung along for multiple years without being converted to a categorical.

I’ve seen some truly miserable results come from the SOAP including Ortho —> Prelim Surgery, ENT —> Community Categorical IM, etc and both these people had at least 12 programs ranked. Of course there are exceptions like new family situations that arise that trump any and all career prospects, but I’m just saying it’s a good idea to rank all the programs that you initially respected enough to attend an interview for. I know a rare instance of someone who applied IM who went unmatched and let me tell you the places she got offers from in SOAP were a hell of a lot worse than her 13th choice.

The only benefit to not ranking a place you would be pretty disappointed at (but still have a job) would be the short lived relief on Monday-Thursday of Match Week knowing you’re headed to a place you want to be at when they send out the matched email on Monday.

 

[DokterMom]

There's one other facet to consider that may not have been explained clearly. The general practice is:

• Students apply to many residency programs hoping for many interview invitations. They then decide to attend XX number of interviews being constrained by the number of offers, available interview dates and funds, and influenced by the number of interviews they perceive to be necessary to have a near-certainty of matching (Let's say that's 12). When deciding which interviews to attend, applicants frequently choose the programs they suspect they would most like to attend, figuring that 12 interviews (any 12) provides that near-certainty they are looking for. However, if those 12 are all 'top' programs, those top programs are likely to have their pick of residents and be far more competitive than a mix of top, mid- and lower-tier programs.

• Programs then rank the interviewees according to how much they want them, which is some combination of likeability or fit, qualifications and demonstrated interest. The easiest way to incorporate 'fit' into the equation is with some kind of score or 'tier' - something along the lines of 5 for "really like" down to 0 for "did not like - do not rank". Then they'll work in order of most important quality down to least. Something along the lines of: "of those applicants we gave the highest-tier 'fit' ratings to, let's line them up in descending order of qualification tiers (to a point), then move to second-highest 'fit' in descending qualifications order, etc." Fit and qualifications are normally the two most important criteria, so a successful applicant will need to fall into/near the top tiers in both areas to successfully match at the most competitive residency programs.

What I'm getting at is that even a "like" instead of a "really like" or a "very good" instead of an "outstanding" qualifications tier can torpedo your shot at a tippy-top residency when it would be more than enough to get you ranked well at an upper mid-tier program. The ultimate point here is that instead of selecting the 12 (or 18 or 20+) 'best' programs to interview at, that applicants should intentionally include some 'safety' interviews into the mix as well.

 

[slurpy15]

The Match is a rough way for adults to figure out where they have to work/play for the next few years. I'm not saying it's the worst system, but now that so many folks are applying to more programs people are ending up in places they never envisioned. A decade ago people applied to 10-20 programs, interviewed at 10-15 and ranked the same. I guess there are more US seniors now so people apply to 80 programs, and it's much more possible that applicants will end up somewhere they had never desired or envisioned, and I think this is unfortunate for both programs and applicants, especially in more competitive specialties.

I don't know what the answer is, or why exactly people have to apply to more programs now, but I think this is really becoming problematic, and I feel for today's applicants.

 

[Dr. Scribe]

Lowly MS0 here who is about to matriculate, but I think the consensus is: Apply to many programs, attend all of your interviews, and rank every program you'd prefer to attend over SOAP

 

[Oso]

Lowly MS0 here who is about to matriculate, but I think the consensus is: Apply to many programs, attend all of your interviews, and rank every program you'd prefer to attend over SOAP

Well, apply to enough programs (actual # depends on your specialty and your competitiveness). Attend enough interviews (perfectly fine to cancel a few interviews if you have enough reasonable ones scheduled). Rank enough programs (if you're competitive for IM and interviewed at 16 places and hated one, it's ok to only rank 15).

This is why it's hard to make generalizations about this stuff. A lot of it really depends on your individual application. The key is to be smart and to work with an advisor who's been doing this for a long time and to actually listen to their advice. I think a lot of people run into problems when they have a poor understanding of their own competitiveness and don't want to listen to advice from people who actually know ****.

 

[Habilitate23]

Hey DocDoc,
no advice or anything, just sorry it turned out not like you wanted even though you worked really hard and aced med school and had really high expectations. I hope everything works out for the best!

 

[PeninsulaDude]

stay strong