Not sure if I can handle gross anatomy

[Amino Acid]

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I almost feel incapable of handling med school because I am incapable of handling gross anatomy. The thought of dissecting a cadaver, someone who lived and breathed like you and me, was less than desirable. First of all my cadaver reminded me of my grandmother, who died this year. Once I actually started dissecting her I felt like I was invading her privacy or that of her friend; I felt like I was mutilating my grandmother. The first two labs left me feeling sick. I kept walking out of the room, trying to compse myself and to keep myself from passing out or vomiting. I actually had to put my head down between my legs as I sat on the floor. Fortunately no one knows why I kept leaving. But the truth of the matter is I'm not sure it will ever get better. I'm not sure I can do this. These feelings are keeping me from really observing and learning. I feel lost already and not sure what to do. Anyone feel like this and be able to get over it? Were you able to finally learn what you needed to? I'm really worried that I won't be able to handle it.

 

[automaton]

yes you are invading and mutilating but they signed up for it. if it bothers you that much then switch to another body. if that doesn't work then i dunno.

 

[theprizefighter]

Amino Acid,

We've all been there and the aspects of anatomy lab you speak of are no fun. In fact, they are a bit disturbing. That said, you have to focus through your discomfort and the best way to do that is to keep going. As for learning anatomy, spend time on other bodies learning the anatomy since there is a ton of normal variation. Meanwhile, try to do something to relax - exercise is one possibility. Good luck

 

[bigdan]

Yeah - I agree with automaton. You've gotta kinda take things in perspective. The person you're dissecting OFFERED to be in that position (no pun intended), so hack away. Out anatomy professor was very frank about things - he said something like "this is a scientific specimen..." which was kinda crass but true.

Either way, it's either your rite of passage (or initiation, I guess) into a select group. Sorry - I hope it gets better for ya.

dc

 

[aparecida]

Do remember that this is what this woman wanted to happen with her body. She signed her name knowing that this is what would be done and accepting that. Yes, you are invading her privacy in a way, and it's very good that you are showing reverence and respect for that. Just remember that if you have the appropriate attitude, then you are learning an amazing amount from her and that that is a great gift she has given you. Good luck with this.

 

[skypilot]

The body is just a container for the soul. Once the soul is gone there is just a container.

And don't forget that you are doing this work in order to help all the other grandmothers and grandfathers out there that will need you once you are finished with your training. 🙂

 

[njbmd]

I almost feel incapable of handling med school because I am incapable of handling gross anatomy. The thought of dissecting a cadaver, someone who lived and breathed like you and me, was less than desirable. First of all my cadaver reminded me of my grandmother, who died this year. Once I actually started dissecting her I felt like I was invading her privacy or that of her friend; I felt like I was mutilating my grandmother. The first two labs left me feeling sick. I kept walking out of the room, trying to compse myself and to keep myself from passing out or vomiting. I actually had to put my head down between my legs as I sat on the floor. Fortunately no one knows why I kept leaving. But the truth of the matter is I'm not sure it will ever get better. I'm not sure I can do this. These feelings are keeping me from really observing and learning. I feel lost already and not sure what to do. Anyone feel like this and be able to get over it? Were you able to finally learn what you needed to? I'm really worried that I won't be able to handle it.

Hi there,
This person gave you a gift so that you could learn thngs that will help your future patients. Rather than thinking of "invading her privacy" think about accepting her gift and making the most of this opportunity. She wanted this and sought this. You have the opportunity of a lifetime. She doesn't need her body anymore than she needs the pots and pans that were left in her kitchen. You can honor this gift by making the most of it.

njbmd 🙂

 

[virilep]

Hi there,
This person gave you a gift so that you could learn thngs that will help your future patients. Rather than thinking of "invading her privacy" think about accepting her gift and making the most of this opportunity. She wanted this and sought this. You have the opportunity of a lifetime. She doesn't need her body anymore than she needs the pots and pans that were left in her kitchen. You can honor this gift by making the most of it.

njbmd 🙂

definately. if it's the thought of your grandmother, i'm sure the professor wouldn't mind switching u up on another cadaver. by going through with this, think about how many grandmothers u might be able to treat 🙂

 

[Amino Acid]

I appreciate all your responses and your understanding. I was afraid I was going to get flamed for feeling this way, which explains why i didn't say anything to my classmates. I know these people signed up to give their bodies to science and I keep trying to tell myself that. I know this is their gift to us so we may gain the knowlege to improve medical intervention and return our gift to others like them. But why can't I dissociate myself from their humainistic attributes. I can't ask to switch cadavers, people will know there's a problem. Perhaps it will get better once I get more accustomed to it all; I certainly hope so. Do you know of others who felt so intimidated and overwhelmed by dissection and got through it ok?

 

[Amino Acid]

The body is just a container for the soul. Once the soul is gone there is just a container.

And don't forget that you are doing this work in order to help all the other grandmothers and grandfathers out there that will need you once you are finished with your training. 🙂

Thank you; that's true and meaningful, maybe I do need to look at it that way.

 

[MadameLULU]

Do you have to go to dissection? I know people who learn exclusively by watching Aclands (A DVD series of the dissections) and studying Rohens, Netters, Moores, or some other anatomy textbook.
If you don't have to go to dissection, I'd strongly encourage purchasing Aclands and spending tons of time reviewing.

I initially felt like you and basically passively stood by while my tankmates dissected. After talking to one of our TAs for an extensive period, I felt better as she said many of the same things that the above posters have noted. Plus, she said most of the people have willed their bodies specifically to our medical school for dissection, which really made me realize they didn't view what we're doing as a violation of thier privacy.

 

[BooMed]

Don't feel like you're the only one, because you aren't. All of the premeds I know are scared s***less of gross anatomy, they just won't admit it to anyone. I mean, people in my physiology class last year could barely handle disecting a fetal pig, how are they going to deal with a person? 😎

Some people are just really good at hiding their discomfort. The first day I went to my job at the hospital I had to walk into a room and practice a procedure on a guy who had just died. I was completely uncool with it, but I just had to pretend that it was okay and try not to throw up on him. For me a big part of working in health care is dealing with death, and confronting my own mortality. Of course that's terrifying.

It's perfectly normal to feel the way you do, and more than likely with time your sensivity will diminish. We're very sheltered from death in our culture and it is very strange to be cutting open a total stranger. But it's okay, also.

I was wondering if a thread like this would show up...

 

[Amy B]

I have not enjoyed gross anatomy at all. I just don't like being in there and touching dead flesh. We actually know the cadaver's name and his wife or girlfriend's name due to his big tattoos.

I have coped over the last year by keeping in my mind that this person is helping me to learn about parts of the body I will more than likely never see unless I become a surgeon. Some how.... time passes and you find yourself done with the class. I have one more 5 week block and then I am done.

Good luck... you can do it.

 

[Blade28]

Strange...I must be cold or something. I never felt anything when I was dissecting cadavers. 🙁

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

Strange...I must be cold or something. I never felt anything when I was dissecting cadavers. 🙁

Yeah, me neither. In fact, I couldn't wait to start diggin. I just reminded myself that society allows us to do this. This is one of the reasons why medicine is such a noble profession. Cutting someone open in any other situation would mean life in jail or capital punishment.

 

[Amy B]

Strange...I must be cold or something. I never felt anything when I was dissecting cadavers. 🙁

I think you are in the majority actually. So you are not cold in the least. There really is only about 10% of my class that is affected. Most people are not.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I think you are in the majority actually. So you are not cold in the least. There really is only about 10% of my class that is affected. Most people are not.

well most people would never admit it.

 

[Blade28]

Now the question is, do I feel anything when I cut into patients now, as a resident?...

 

[Freakingzooming]

it's kinda refreshing for me to know you still feel that way when you're in anatomy.

I hope it does get better but at the same time, you'll continue to associate the body as a person and not a specimen. Having a good anatomy group is key though. I at first was queasy and unsure myself but having good people focused on getting the work done and reminding me I'm learning.

 

[Elysium]

I kinda think that people that gleefully rubbed their hands together with the thought of "hacking" away at a dead body are kinda dinguses. I mean, these people did donate their body to science but I'm quite sure they didn't imagine a bunch of dickhead wannabe surgeons shoving their scapels in and digging away. Good lord. God knows I'm not a "sensitive" type, but I did have a modicum of feeling for my cadaver.

 

[OSUdoc08]

I almost feel incapable of handling med school because I am incapable of handling gross anatomy. The thought of dissecting a cadaver, someone who lived and breathed like you and me, was less than desirable. First of all my cadaver reminded me of my grandmother, who died this year. Once I actually started dissecting her I felt like I was invading her privacy or that of her friend; I felt like I was mutilating my grandmother. The first two labs left me feeling sick. I kept walking out of the room, trying to compse myself and to keep myself from passing out or vomiting. I actually had to put my head down between my legs as I sat on the floor. Fortunately no one knows why I kept leaving. But the truth of the matter is I'm not sure it will ever get better. I'm not sure I can do this. These feelings are keeping me from really observing and learning. I feel lost already and not sure what to do. Anyone feel like this and be able to get over it? Were you able to finally learn what you needed to? I'm really worried that I won't be able to handle it.

Just think of it as a frog. Or an anesthetized patient.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

it's kinda refreshing for me to know you still feel that way when you're in anatomy.

I hope it does get better but at the same time, you'll continue to associate the body as a person and not a specimen. Having a good anatomy group is key though. I at first was queasy and unsure myself but having good people focused on getting the work done and reminding me I'm learning.

i can understand calling a dissected liver or the septum of the heart a specimen, but the day they call the person a specimen i will walk out the door.

 

[WhoisJohnGalt]

i can understand calling a dissected liver or the septum of the heart a specimen, but the day they call the person a specimen i will walk out the door.

Really? Our lab instructors always refer to "the specimen". They can't learn all the cadaver's names...

 

[fantasty]

Our anatomy prof is quite clear that he will donate his body, even after all the cadavers he's seen. I'm not sure how I feel about that, specifically. I mean, I believe most of our donors are local - we have a deeded body ceremony for the family the year after they donate. So, if it stays locally, his long-time colleagues would be the people leading the instruction. I think THAT would freak me out.

As for personal preference, I don't think I would donate my body. Sure, for organ donation, but I still view my body as my "property". So, I would like them to extract the useful parts that might help someone, but then cremate my ass. It's not that I care if people are poking around in there. But, I just don't like the idea of "lingering" around for so long.

As for people being upset in class, we never were told their names and we were given a few discussions upfront about the history of dissection, and respect for the donors. Their faces were covered until the about the 10th week - that was the most emotional day for some.

For me, autopsy was a much more sobering experience. We observe 1-2 in our path class, and I also shadowed a pathologist for a few weeks. As for "invading their privacy", I do think this is the most intimate you could ever be with someone, in a weird way. I mean, you will know physical things about this person that even they never knew about themselves. I'm sure it sounds messed up, but can you imagine what it would be like to be a fly on the wall of your own autopsy?

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Really? Our lab instructors always refer to "the specimen". They can't learn all the cadaver's names...

but they can call it your cadaver or something that sounds more human, not like an inatimate object that never was alive or had any feelings

 

[OSUdoc08]

but they can call it your cadaver or something that sounds more human, not like an inatimate object that never was alive or had any feelings

give me a break

detachment is necessary

do you want him to call your body grandpa?

 

[Psycho Doctor]

give me a break

detachment is necessary

do you want him to call your body grandpa?

no, just call it a cadaver or a body. calling it a cadaver is attachment without making it inatimate or poking fun at it.

 

[stoic]

no, just call it a cadaver or a body. calling it a cadaver is attachment without making it inatimate or poking fun at it.

arguing semantics really has little point here. the cadavar is a specimen. your specimen is a cadaver.

we start gross in a week and a half. and i'm nervous as hell. and i'm not at all afraid to admit it. this experience is really unique.

i've been posting and reading on sdn for over 4 years.

i've read the post as 4 different classes started MS1.

and every year, almost everyone is nervous and scared and even sick on the first day of lab. what we do in gross lab goes against pretty much everything we feel. we're not supposed to be around dead people. we're not suppose to cut people. we think of people as we see them on the outside and ignore the insides.

but every year, the M1's post about how they overcome these feelings. some people become desensitized to it, others are just completely in awe. i think most people are a mix of both. whatever it is, everyone gets through it in one way or another. maybe the most important things i've learned are to plug your nose with vicks vapor rub and to keep your anatomy scrubs far, far away from everything else that you own. and to wear nitrile gloves.

so yea i'm nervous. really. and not just a little. i'm ****ing freaked out. i don't know what it's going to be like to pull the insides out and cut the legs off of the bodies surrounding me. and that's ok. frankly i don' think anyone should be completely comfortable with that. in the end, we'll ALL get through it. it's just one more of the things that make med school something that only those who have been through it can understand.


for those jaydoc's reading this post, who wants to go to downing's after the first lab?

 

[synapse lapse]

i can understand calling a dissected liver or the septum of the heart a specimen, but the day they call the person a specimen i will walk out the door.

well PD, you sir are quite the specimen yourself Haha, anatomy really isn't that big of an emotional deal, though it is the best class I've ever taken.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

arguing semantics really has little point here. the cadavar is a specimen. your specimen is a cadaver.

we start gross in a week and a half. and i'm nervous as hell. and i'm not at all afraid to admit it. this experience is really unique.

i've been posting and reading on sdn for over 4 years.

i've read the post as 4 different classes started MS1.

and every year, almost everyone is nervous and scared and even sick on the first day of lab. what we do in gross lab goes against pretty much everything we feel. we're not supposed to be around dead people. we're not suppose to cut people. we think of people as we see them on the outside and ignore the insides.

but every year, the M1's post about how they overcome these feelings. some people become desensitized to it, others are just completely in awe. i think most people are a mix of both. whatever it is, everyone gets through it in one way or another. maybe the most important things i've learned are to plug your nose with vicks vapor rub and to keep your anatomy scrubs far, far away from everything else that you own. and to wear nitrile gloves.

so yea i'm nervous. really. and not just a little. i'm ****ing freaked out. i don't know what it's going to be like to pull the insides out and cut the legs off of the bodies surrounding me. and that's ok. frankly i don' think anyone should be completely comfortable with that. in the end, we'll ALL get through it. it's just one more of the things that make med school something that only those who have been through it can understand.


for those jaydoc's reading this post, who wants to go to downing's after the first lab?

thanks, stoic, that's a great post and so very true. I wish I had been watching 4 classes on sdn go through med school. it sounds like you have a great attitude and that should take you far.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

well PD, you sir are quite the specimen yourself Haha, anatomy really isn't that big of an emotional deal, though it is the best class I've ever taken.

well thanks, i'll take it as a compliment since i'm sure you meant it in the very best way possible 🙄

and if you read everyone else's posts you'll realize my feelings aren't exactly unique, but it's ok i understand your need to single me out and insult me, and it's ok, i really don't mind. I'll also single you out as being crass, uncompassionate and uncaring...hopefully you won't be the same way to your patients, or you'll choose research instead for the benefit of your patient. 👍

 

[Nittany Lion]

well thanks, i'll take it as a compliment since i'm sure you meant it in the very best way possible 🙄

and if you read everyone else's posts you'll realize my feelings aren't exactly unique, but it's ok i understand your need to single me out and insult me, and it's ok, i really don't mind. I'll also single you out as being crass, uncompassionate and uncaring...hopefully you won't be the same way to your patients, or you'll choose research instead for the benefit of your patient. 👍

Wow... that was a lot more crass than what the person you quoted had said... you can sure dish it out, can't ya?. 👎

I'm going to agree also that anatomy really isn't a huge emotional experience, for me anyway. It is a bit overwhelming in the beginning, but once you're in there several times a week for many weeks in a row, you just get in there, do your thing (in a respectful, mature manner), learn as much as you can, then go home. I know I can't read people's minds, but I don't visibly see any of my classmates freaking out or being very emotional about the whole process either. Doesn't mean they're uncompassionate or uncaring people, though, and I don't think I am an uncaring person. This is a part of medical school that we all knew about before getting in. Society allows medical professionals to do a lot of invasive things to people. Our professors told us that our cadaver is technically our very first "patient"...so our emotions undoubtedly should be invested in it; however, when we get out into the real world, we're not going to be freaking out or losing our cool everytime we witness an invasive procedure or an operation on a live patient. It's just the reality of it.

Now I can surely appreciate and empathize having certain feelings about doing these things, but no need to tell someone they're in the wrong field just because they're not having some huge dramatic emotional breakthrough or storming out of the room the minute the cadaver is called a "specimen". (By the way, if you actually do that, people are going to think you're very weird).

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Wow... that was a lot more crass than what the person you quoted had said... you can sure dish it out, can't ya?. 👎

I'm going to agree also that anatomy really isn't a huge emotional experience, for me anyway. It is a bit overwhelming in the beginning, but once you're in there several times a week for many weeks in a row, you just get in there, do your thing (in a respectful, mature manner), learn as much as you can, then go home. I know I can't read people's minds, but I don't visibly see any of my classmates freaking out or being very emotional about the whole process either. Doesn't mean they're uncompassionate or uncaring people, though, and I don't think I am an uncaring person. This is a part of medical school that we all knew about before getting in. Society allows medical professionals to do a lot of invasive things to people. Our professors told us that our cadaver is technically our very first "patient"...so our emotions undoubtedly should be invested in it; however, when we get out into the real world, we're not going to be freaking out or losing our cool everytime we witness an invasive procedure or an operation on a live patient. It's just the reality of it.

Now I can surely appreciate and empathize having certain feelings about doing these things, but no need to tell someone they're in the wrong field just because they're not having some huge dramatic emotional breakthrough or storming out of the room the minute the cadaver is called a "specimen". (By the way, if you actually do that, people are going to think you're very weird).

well that's b/c you don't know the history involved. On almost every single thread i post on, he singles me out to rip apart and it's totally unsolicited and uncalled for. He also often comes across as rude, malicious and uncaring. I am not the only one to point this out. So don't judge on one post and one response. It's been on-going.

 

[Law2Doc]

Now the question is, do I feel anything when I cut into patients now, as a resident?...

If you are planning to perform the same kind of surgeries on your patients as you did on your cadaver, I think maybe surgury might not be the right specialty for you. 🙄 But some level of detachment is probably necessary as a doctor, whether working with cadavers or patients -- because you will be facing death in both cases on an unfortunately fairly regular basis.

 

[libbyruth]

I almost feel incapable of handling med school because I am incapable of handling gross anatomy. The thought of dissecting a cadaver, someone who lived and breathed like you and me, was less than desirable. First of all my cadaver reminded me of my grandmother, who died this year. Once I actually started dissecting her I felt like I was invading her privacy or that of her friend; I felt like I was mutilating my grandmother. The first two labs left me feeling sick. I kept walking out of the room, trying to compse myself and to keep myself from passing out or vomiting. I actually had to put my head down between my legs as I sat on the floor. Fortunately no one knows why I kept leaving. But the truth of the matter is I'm not sure it will ever get better. I'm not sure I can do this. These feelings are keeping me from really observing and learning. I feel lost already and not sure what to do. Anyone feel like this and be able to get over it? Were you able to finally learn what you needed to? I'm really worried that I won't be able to handle it.

Hi, Amino Acid. The first day of lab, I had a really hard time. I was afraid that I was going to pass out, but I didn't. I thought way too much about the person. We have had lab 4-5 times now and each time gets easier. I have been able to distance myself a little. I found that I can't think about the woman the cadavar once was, because I get too emotional about it. This is what she wanted and it is absolutely the best way to learn about the body. I don't think I would get as much out of watching a movie or looking at a book as I do being able to dissect and touch the cadavar. Now that I can distance myself, I actually like anatomy a little bit. It's cool to see how the body is put together. Give it some time, it will get better.

 

[WhoisJohnGalt]

maybe the most important things i've learned are to plug your nose with vicks vapor rub and to keep your anatomy scrubs far, far away from everything else that you own. and to wear nitrile gloves.

As an MSI four weeks into Gross, you've really got the most important things about anatomy down-- do that, and you'll be fine 🙂

so yea i'm nervous. really. and not just a little. i'm ****ing freaked out. i don't know what it's going to be like to pull the insides out and cut the legs off of the bodies surrounding me. and that's ok. frankly i don' think anyone should be completely comfortable with that. in the end, we'll ALL get through it. it's just one more of the things that make med school something that only those who have been through it can understand.

Relax 🙂 Honestly, I was INSANELY nervous before the first day of anatomy lab (which was also my first day of medical school!)-- as they were cranking our cadaver up out of the tank, I thought my heart was going to burst. Then, we removed her covering, AND... my heart rate went back to normal, and we all instantly focused on the dissection we needed to do. And ever since it hasn't made me nervous (though it DOES gross me out when we're dissecting particularly fatty or particularly dried-blood-heavy structures). I think that's pretty common... the anticipation makes you nervous, but once you're in there, you get so focused on what you came to do that your rational brain takes over any unpleasant emotions you might have. You'll be fine 🙂