Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
CBS News said:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/03/26/ap/politics/main4894650.shtml
Does Obama feel that physicians aren't working enough?
-
CycleTrack and SDN are teaming up to make medical school admissions more transparent and accessible! Read the announcement to learn how we’re supporting the future of CycleTrack’s free application-tracking tools .
Obama on nurses, physicians
Started by nebrfan
Get help with your application
Use all the free resources available to you from SDN: articles, guides, expert advising, forums discussions, and school research.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/03/26/ap/politics/main4894650.shtml
Does Obama feel that physicians aren't working enough?
i was watching it live from the internet. At the time, I was thinking to hmyself I cant believe he is buying into the whole nursing "victim bull***" " he was answering a question from a nurse who asked him basically if nurses were going to be at the roundtable concerning healthcare. obama also said when sasha was 3 months she had meningitis and the nurses were there.. i didnt see any doctors. and when malia was born our ob gynnie was there for like 15 mins and thats it while the nurses were there the whole time.. wow.. does he think doctors have to stay there the whole time. they dont have other patients to deal with. I was kind of annoyed at that... i still think he is doing a decent job
What he doesn't understand is that the patient to doctor ratio (for a senior IM resident) is 24 to 1. Nurse to patient 7 or 8 to 1. ICU nurses are 2-3 patients to 1.
I missed the telecast, but did he really say is was only nurses there when his daughter got the tap? Because last time I checked, nurses didn't do LP's.
I missed the telecast, but did he really say is was only nurses there when his daughter got the tap? Because last time I checked, nurses didn't do LP's.
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
his daughter had meningitis he said. thats serious business. what does he think the nurses treated her?
There is a lot of humor to be appreciated here. Poor little union nurses with their 2+ years of training, making $50/hour for holding hands and taking orders at a max of 36 hours per week with bonus and overtime for anything beyond that. And they have such high patient-to-nurse ratios! Let's rely on a lawyer to dictate health care policy because we haven't already been down this road.
As an executive officer, perhaps Obama should familiarize himself with how leadership, management, and oversight work. Maybe Obama should also go fight as a soldier in this war he's overseeing since, you know, those soldiers are working hard while he's galavanting around riding in planes and joking around on late-night talk shows.
I think it's about time for a physician strike. If we're to believe Obama, this shouldn't be a problem.
As an executive officer, perhaps Obama should familiarize himself with how leadership, management, and oversight work. Maybe Obama should also go fight as a soldier in this war he's overseeing since, you know, those soldiers are working hard while he's galavanting around riding in planes and joking around on late-night talk shows.
I think it's about time for a physician strike. If we're to believe Obama, this shouldn't be a problem.
Nurses are the backbone eh? Perhaps he'd like to see what happens if nurses were picking the antibiotics to fight off the meningitis...........
*sigh*
The nurse healed her by the power of touch. The meanie doctor, however, was only there for a short while and the majority of that was spent inflicting pain by stabbing her in the back with a needle. The doctor clearly doesn't care about this child since he/she was more focused on making her cry than healing her.
EDIT: Also, while doctor was not physically present in little Obama's room, he/she was probably in the doc's lounge relaxing and trading online.
I agree with a prior post. Wow 😱
For a person who is intelligent, charasmatic, and so forth, well, he just made an very ignorant statement.
I do wonder, what will his little friend on CNN think of this??
For a person who is intelligent, charasmatic, and so forth, well, he just made an very ignorant statement.
I do wonder, what will his little friend on CNN think of this??
in all fairness to obama I think he knows there is a HUGE HUGE shortage of nurses and in order for them not to leave he has to KISS their asses big time. Nurses are like that. they are women they have to constantly be affirmed. SO i think its just rhetoric.. He said, "I LOVE NURSES" L. but what he doesnt understand is that nurses are very well paid. for the level of education they have and the years invested. the average doctor has about 5-6 x the level of education. about 1000 times the dedication and you cant quantify the level of difficulty over the nursng profession that the road to becoming a doctor is. not to mention the indedtedness financial and personal. and the average doctor makes about about 30 percent more in absolute values. But in relative value I would bet doctors salary and nursing salary are about the same. I can guarantee you in about 10 years you think we have a healthcare crisis now. wait until many people cant find a neurosurgeon or any other specialists to take care of them. I guess they will go to a nurse practicioner to talk the subarachnoid hemmorhage away.
Guys. This is simple, naked political savvy. Nurses vote Democrat, whereas doctors are split 50/50 between the parties. Nurses are also more likely than doctors (VERY unfortunately) to be ethnic minorities and staunch supporters of Obama. /end analysis
Obama is following what he knows best. NOTHING.
Its time we get rid of obama and put in a paralegal. They do more work right according to his logic.
He need to understand the pyramid scheme (since he is on top) and realize that its how the world works. When you turn the pyramid upside down, it crumbles.
When nursing salaries outweigh physician salaries (per hour), then you will see mass exodus from medicine.
But don't worry. obama will still want to be seen by a physician and not a nurse when it comes to his own health.
Again, do as I say not as I do. The democratic motto.
Its time we get rid of obama and put in a paralegal. They do more work right according to his logic.
He need to understand the pyramid scheme (since he is on top) and realize that its how the world works. When you turn the pyramid upside down, it crumbles.
When nursing salaries outweigh physician salaries (per hour), then you will see mass exodus from medicine.
But don't worry. obama will still want to be seen by a physician and not a nurse when it comes to his own health.
Again, do as I say not as I do. The democratic motto.
I think that this pretty much hit the nail on the head. Welcome to politics.
Why do we want to give these guys more power over the medical profession again?
Guys, I am missing something. I couldnt find more than the CBS article said so maybe I am missing the context, and I agree he might have over-stated himself when he said they did "most of the work," but just because he said nurses are unappreciated and important for our healthcare system it doesnt mean doctors arent also important! (But mom, you said you love my brother. Why dont you love me!) Last I checked, there is a huge nursing shortage and they are a vital part of our healthcare system! I agree they are decently paid for their education and sure know how to petition for limited hours far better than residents do. But last I checked, we couldnt run a hospital without them. So why not give them a little pat on the back???
Are you saying nurses should be left out of the roundtable?
Are you saying nurses should be left out of the roundtable?
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
Exactly.
By the way, just saw you have a blog going there, will have to add it to my "med blogs" list that I check up on so I look forward to reading it.
At the end of the day it's going to be up to us to get involved in this "game". Frankly, I've never really liked politics beyond a sort of morbid curiosity of this whole process, but more and more realizing that it's going to impact how I practice and no one is going to speak up for me besides me.
Was just up in DC a few weeks ago for an organized medical lobbying day and it was very interesting going around and meeting with my congressmen/women and their staff. Even if you don't really like politics I'd encourage people to start becoming involved at some level at least, and maybe even start forming a dialogue with your reps/senators and their staff. Feel free to personally write a letter or email to send to them. Even if you don't talk directly with the congress member remember that they listen to and rely very heavily on their staff, which in a lot of cases are young professionals OUR AGE. Introduce yourselves to them, tell them about yourself, your story, your concerns for the profession, etc....
At a couple of the reps offices we went to I was with another local physician and the staff knew him by name and was willing to sit with us for 30min because that doc had formed a relationship with that office over the previous years and kept in touch with them on healthcare issues.
As a 2nd year IM resident that works almost 80 hours per week earning less than a first year nurse at my hospital and who work 12 hour shift for 4 days per week Im pretty disgusted by President Obama remarks.
I voted for Obama, but Im not democrat nor republican so i dont care to change my vote in 2012
I voted for Obama, but Im not democrat nor republican so i dont care to change my vote in 2012
Um, we are all aware that a hospital cannot run without them. We are also well aware that there is a huge nursing shortage. We all know that hospitals need the nurses to survive and function, so no need to state the obvious. What I do believe is that the two fields cannot be compared and should not be compared. Whenever I am on floors, I am working the equivalent of two full-time jobs and up to 24 patients at any given point in time. If our patient census was dropped to carry the same load as the nurses, well, sure, I'd have plenty of time to spend in my patient rooms. Not to mention it would be fantastic to work three 12-hour shifts in a week and call it good. It just cannot be compared.
I guess I just am irritated by his comments that almost imply doctors are lazy and uncaring.
Last edited:
He was basically saying, nurses do all the work and doctors just waltz in for like 5 mins and do nothing. I mean nurses need to be appreciated but you cant compare what docs do and what nurses do. Its like comparing the truck driver to the guy loading the trucks.
Because we let it happen.
Notice how the majority of med students are democrats/liberals and are openly allowing our profession/salaries to be destroyed.
Sounds worse to me in context than the little snippet the OP posted.
Like i said in defense to obama i think he was just appeasing this stupid a** who asked the question and nurses in general. He is a politician.
I'm concerned when Obama supporters "defend" him by saying that he is just saying things out of political expediency. That is just bad. It shows that he will create policy the same way.
I have run into this kind of Pollyannaish attitude about Obama in my partners who voted for him. Many of us have started to examine ways to change our compensation model to decrease income and increase pre tax hold backs to get us under the $250K cut off. These Obama supporters have all said that they don't think it's necessary as they don't really believe he'll push for confiscatory tax rates against us. So they seem to believe he will not do any of the things he's said he will do repeatedly😕.
I think that all docs should know that we are not part of Obama's constituency. You may like him, support him, think we need "change" and love some of his policies but he will not support us at all. You may even think we need socialized healthcare. Fine but know that this president will not be looking out for our interests in that system.
What do you expect from a guy who's wife was pulling in >270k a year as vice president for "community affairs" at the University of Chicago Hospital system.
If nurses work so hard at the hospital, why do their asses tend to grow along with their seniority? Seriously, like 80% of nursing students are these hot, little 20 somethings that I see. Then they become nurses and get bitchier and pear-shaped. I always joke with my friends that if you cut a nurse's leg off, you can tell how long shes been working by counting the rings.
Other than that, I have nothing new to add. Agree with the above post about who did the LP (Maybe it was a DNP?). But then again, if it was a doctor, he was the mean one who caused his daughter so much harm, while the nurses sat there and held her hand and administered the pain meds, that I'm pretty sure a doctor ordered. Maybe someone should tell Obama that there's a physician shortage. Maybe someone should also tell him a great way to help the healthcare system and reduce shortage. SUBSIDIZE MEDICAL EDUCATION!!!!! (Medical, nursing, you name it) More people will go into healthcare. More physicians will go to into the shortage areas (primary care because it pays the least). You want to socialize healthcare? Pump that money back into the system. Maybe physicians wouldn't mind taking a reasonable decrease in salary if they didn't have 300,000 in loans to pay. And, for me, that will cost me 700,000 to pay back. That's $400,000 that I could have pumped back into the economy that instead is going to some loan company's pocket to pay for some ass-bag's golden parachute.
Other than that, I have nothing new to add. Agree with the above post about who did the LP (Maybe it was a DNP?). But then again, if it was a doctor, he was the mean one who caused his daughter so much harm, while the nurses sat there and held her hand and administered the pain meds, that I'm pretty sure a doctor ordered. Maybe someone should tell Obama that there's a physician shortage. Maybe someone should also tell him a great way to help the healthcare system and reduce shortage. SUBSIDIZE MEDICAL EDUCATION!!!!! (Medical, nursing, you name it) More people will go into healthcare. More physicians will go to into the shortage areas (primary care because it pays the least). You want to socialize healthcare? Pump that money back into the system. Maybe physicians wouldn't mind taking a reasonable decrease in salary if they didn't have 300,000 in loans to pay. And, for me, that will cost me 700,000 to pay back. That's $400,000 that I could have pumped back into the economy that instead is going to some loan company's pocket to pay for some ass-bag's golden parachute.
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
Why is anyone surprised by this?
Obama is a Marxist. As such, he believes in taking from the "privileged" and giving to the "unprivileged". In medicine, it's the mean, nasty, paternalistic, capitalistic doctors, and the poor, sweet, nurses.
Note who is bigger about bureaucracy: Nurses. Note who legislates responsibility/honor and doesn't earn it: Nurses.
And cut it out with the whole "intelligent and charismatic" bit already. For a guy who can't survive without a teleprompter (and hacks on SPECIAL NEEDS kids when he doesn't have one), and whose idea of saving our economy is spending into oblivion, I've had enough of it. He's coming for you, fellow doctors, can't you open your eyes up already and see that?
Obama is a Marxist. As such, he believes in taking from the "privileged" and giving to the "unprivileged". In medicine, it's the mean, nasty, paternalistic, capitalistic doctors, and the poor, sweet, nurses.
Note who is bigger about bureaucracy: Nurses. Note who legislates responsibility/honor and doesn't earn it: Nurses.
And cut it out with the whole "intelligent and charismatic" bit already. For a guy who can't survive without a teleprompter (and hacks on SPECIAL NEEDS kids when he doesn't have one), and whose idea of saving our economy is spending into oblivion, I've had enough of it. He's coming for you, fellow doctors, can't you open your eyes up already and see that?
What did you guys expect? Obama was playing politician to a nurse who was playing the "woest me" card to a national audience. He had to sound very nurse-friendly. I'm not convinced yet that Obama will tilt the balance in favor of nursing like Clinton did. Clinton had an ulterior motive because his mommy was a CRNA. I think Obama respects the time and dedication that physicians put into their training and work. I think that he understands that you cannot obtain those skills by trying to take a shortcut. I watched the townhall meeting live and he also mentioned that the ob-gyn was a close friend even though that person could only spend 15 minutes delivering his baby. He also said that the physicians did a tremendous job treating the case of meningitis when his kid was 3 months old. I think that he recognizes that bedside nursing is critical which I agree. I don't think that he's saying that physicians should be replaced by nurses.
Look at how he has been handling the Wall Street bonus issue. As much as he is disgusted by the outrageous bonuses, he understand that he cannot govern by emotion or flawed thinking. He understands that you need to provide right incentives or otherwise people will leave. He understands if he screws over the physicians then fewer people or lower caliber people will become physicians. I don't think that Obama wants that.
Look at how he has been handling the Wall Street bonus issue. As much as he is disgusted by the outrageous bonuses, he understand that he cannot govern by emotion or flawed thinking. He understands that you need to provide right incentives or otherwise people will leave. He understands if he screws over the physicians then fewer people or lower caliber people will become physicians. I don't think that Obama wants that.
😴
YES. Leave current nursing leadership and their built in bureaucracy out of the roundtable. Their multi-layered approach to patient care has added innumerable cost and inefficiency to the system.
If you want to improve healthcare, focus on the physician-patient relationship. That's the center of healthcare, and all of these folks who love to get in between it with their mindless rules and paperwork are costing our country a FORTUNE.
Sorry Mr. President, but nurses have great hours, great pay, great job flexibility, and great quality of life. They can leave a job and have a new one within 24 hours, and at the end of the day, are not ultimately responsible for their patients, especially when not on a shift.
Obama is coming for you, fellow physicians. He nominated Sebelius, one of the most rabid, anti-physician governors, to head HHS. He is shoving through "healthcare reform" to bankrupt us even further. Open your eyes, and save the profession while there is still a bit of time left!
Obama is coming for you, fellow physicians. He nominated Sebelius, one of the most rabid, anti-physician governors, to head HHS. He is shoving through "healthcare reform" to bankrupt us even further. Open your eyes, and save the profession while there is still a bit of time left!
what physician shortage? medical schools have zero problems putting asses in their seats.
And those asses get into massive debt, making them feel obligated to go into specialties, not primary care. There was a recent thread in the FP forum that shows FP spots, filled spots, and AMG's going into FP have steadily dropped over the past 12 years. And, in response to the primary care shortages, what happens? You get these schools like Columbia and their DNP programs.
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=613667
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=606609
the problem is that all the fp docs are not in the right areas? so those areas that have shortages are gonna have to pony up the money. FP residencies dont have a problem filling do they?
.
Last edited:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94lW6Y4tBXs
sounds very familiar
You can't expect the dwindling number of productive members of society to hold back the surge of the quickly multiplying dependency class. They will eventually tire, and then guess what, everyone is in the dependency class, yay!!! everyone is now equal.
Last edited:
not necessarily true... FP residencies have one of the lowest "fill rates" in the residency match... if not THE lowest.
I believe this chart explains it all..
Last edited:
Yes it does. Very good.
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
from the same webpage: I find this hilarious!!
Thursday, March 19, 2009
Nurse Practitioners: All The Attitude Of A Physician, None Of The Skills.
My friends, this night I will convince you that all Nurse Practitioners should be stripped of their prescribing authority. Actually I won't do it, a Nurse Practitioner who chose to put on public display her incredible ignorance will. All I will do is cut and paste a letter to the editor from the leading trade magazine Drug Topics:
Generics are not the same
I am an NP in pediatrics old school, you could say practicing for close to 20 years. I have a real problem with generics for my patients, family, and myself. I was taught and have read that certain generics such as those used in warfarin and cardiac therapy should not be used.
Even the slightest difference could prove harmful. An oncologist here in town will only use brand Coumadin for her patients. I witnessed my father's blood pressure soar after only a few days on a generic and quickly return to normal after he took an extra dose and then went back to brand. I find various generic antidepressants have little to no therapeutic effects on the majority of my patients.
Brand drug prices are soaring. No one really talks about this subject, and consumers, our patients, should know or have a choice!
Jeanne Monaco, BM, BSN, MSN, ARN, CPNP
Dear Jeanne,
I am a community pharmacist that has practiced for almost 20 years-old school you could say-if you were dumb, because there are about as many people who have practiced longer than me as there are people who haven't been practicing as long. So you could call me old school if you want, but a little mental effort would tell you I am really middle school.
But the fact you have no sense of time doesn't make you stupid. Well, actually it does, but that wouldn't be a problem if that was where the stupidity ended. The real reason I'm posting here Jeanne, is to let the world know all Nurse Practitioners are incompetent. I have a real problem with Nurse Practitioners for my patients, family, and myself. I was taught and have read that some Nurse Practitioners don't know what the word "bioequivalent" means and should not be used.
I know an oncologist who refuses to let his wife or anyone he cares about see a Nurse Practitioner. And one time, I witnessed a patient who was treated by a Nurse Practitioner, then died. Many other people have died after seeing Nurse Practitioners as well. One other time, a person I know being treated by a Nurse Practitioner went code blue at the hospital, only to quickly return to normal after being attended to by a physician. I find various Nurse Practitioners to have little to no therapeutic effects on the majority of my patients.
The cost to see a physician is soaring. No one really talks about this subject, and consumers, our patients, should know or have a choice!
So there you go Jeanne, I just proved Nurse Practitioners are dangerous and should be avoided. The same way you took down over two decades worth of real world data and scientific evidence regarding generic drugs in 143 words. Or I just pulled a bunch of **** out of my ass, one of the two. Either way, our letters are remarkably similar, yes?
Something tells me you don't see my point.
Drugmonkey
ABU, NCH, OFLET, TERS, TOH, IDE, IMAM, ORON.
Where did you escape from?
My head just spun around and I lost some of the pea soup I ate for lunch.
That s*** is hilarious!
Highvoltage got banned? So I guess you CAN get banned for stupid questions.
you are right on the money! He will say what ever is politically expedient. Do not think for one moment his own political objectives are not driving his comments (still think he is doing a good job wait for you tax bill and call me)
