Observing Surgeries

[DryHopped]

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I am a pre-med student that is interested in observing surgeries, if there is anyone on here that knows how to set up the opportunity to do this I would appreciate some info how to make it happen.

My father is a physician(OB/GYN) and he tells me that it is impossible to do this as a student due to HIPPA laws. I have also had other physicians tell me the same, then I go on here and read posts from people that say they have shadowed physicians in the OR. I am confused...

 

[allie1361]

I watched an OB/GYN do 3 C-sections and 1 natural birth. As long as the patient OKs it, there shouldn't be any problems. Some hospitals may have much stricter policies than where I shadowed, but as along as the physician says you can and the patient says it's OK, there shouldn't be a problem. I got to put on scrubs and stand on a little stool behind everyone and out of the way, but got to see most of what was going on...pretty sweet.

Find a doctor to shadow, find out if s/he does surgeries and if you'd be allowed to watch one or two. Pretty simple.

 

[SudLagniappe]

I shadowed a Neurosurgeon. It was a pain to set up, but I managed. I had to go through some HR training through the hospital (even though I already worked there), then I had to get permission from the OR Manager and the head of surgery, then I had to go through an OR orientation, then when all that was done, I had to set up the date, let the OR know, and then they had to okay it through all the patients that I would see in the OR. Took a few weeks for it all to get set up, but it IS possible.

 

[Antibodies]

I am a pre-med student that is interested in observing surgeries, if there is anyone on here that knows how to set up the opportunity to do this I would appreciate some info how to make it happen.

My father is a physician(OB/GYN) and he tells me that it is impossible to do this as a student due to HIPPA laws. I have also had other physicians tell me the same, then I go on here and read posts from people that say they have shadowed physicians in the OR. I am confused...

It is possible. You just need to go through HIPPA training and what not. Best thing to do is contact the volunteer office in the hospital. Some hospitals have such programs already in place and some don't. If there is no program in place then it would be a real pain to set things up.

 

[Andy71600]

I am a pre-med student that is interested in observing surgeries, if there is anyone on here that knows how to set up the opportunity to do this I would appreciate some info how to make it happen.

My father is a physician(OB/GYN) and he tells me that it is impossible to do this as a student due to HIPPA laws. I have also had other physicians tell me the same, then I go on here and read posts from people that say they have shadowed physicians in the OR. I am confused...

All you really have to do is ask.

I sat in on an 8 hour open heart case... Not just watching through the glass. I was next to the anesthesiologist talking the whole time.

 

[jm192]

Try to talk to the physician if possible. I tried to shadow a surgeon this past October and the only available phone # put me in touch with the actual clinic instead of his office. I told them I wanted to shadow him, and they told me the process I'd have to go through, and that I could only shadow him in the office.

I've heard of people that were able to speak directly to the physician's office that were able to shadow in the operating or delivery room.

 

[DryHopped]

I have asked multiple physicians in my area and every one of them has said that I can shadow them in the office, but that I cannot observe surgeries...these are all physicians affiliated with the same hospital as my father...So, it sounds as if I need to get lucky and find a hospital without strict policies on observation. Thanks for the input everyone.

 

[just one]

Most hospitals have regulations for medical students only. I was able to observe several surgeries by shadowing an ophthalmologist and was invited to see surgeries at a surgical center he owned. Since he was part owner and it was a smaller surgical center only, there were no regulations on pre-meds. In fact there were two other pre-meds there that day observing other surgeries. On the off chance you are in Oklahoma I could give you the name to the center via pm.

 

[carboxylWill]

The fact that your dad is a doctor really helps, because he can introduce you to all the surgeons. I got to see 7 surgeries a couple years ago when I was considering doing post bacc premed. My dad is also a doctor, and just asked each of the surgeons if I could spend some time with them in the OR that day. In each case, I was introduced to the patient and granted permission to observe them, so I don't believe there is a HIPPA privacy issue or anything like that. Definitely don't talk to the office, you'll just make more work for them so of course they will try to dissuade you, you have to find the doc sometime in the hospital that morning.

It sounds like your dealing with a really strict hospital. The one where my dad works is small, and community based, so it's entirely possible that if you're dealing with a large academic hospital, you may be S.O.L.

 

[familyaerospace]

I just asked a plastic surgeon and he said he can't let me watch at the surgical centers (they don't even let med students back there) but its easy to sneak me back into the OR at the main hospital even as a premed. Now I do volunteer so he knows I've been through all the privacy training and such, but the nurses back in the OR don't know that. They don't know I've been checked for TB either. All they care about is what year in school I am in because they have to write down that I was an observer. So as long as I am with my "sponsoring physician" no one cares. I'm even allowed back into the physician's lounge.

Shadowing a surgeon has been the easiest thing I've done. I've watched two breast augments, lipo/fat transfer, part of a tummy tuck, breast biopsy, and mass extraction from the wrist, and part of a nose job. It was much harder to shadow other people.

 

[YouNeverKnow22]

it's easy just email some surgeons and get it set up, some docs are more willing than others

 

[TooMuchResearch]

I have asked multiple physicians in my area and every one of them has said that I can shadow them in the office, but that I cannot observe surgeries...these are all physicians affiliated with the same hospital as my father...So, it sounds as if I need to get lucky and find a hospital without strict policies on observation. Thanks for the input everyone.

I shadowed a surgeon at a teaching hospital. There was no HIPPA training, and no one asked the patients if it was alright. I don't know if it was hospital specifically, the fact that it was a teaching hospital...maybe the surgeon just didn't care about the rules.

 

[sm640739]

If you're comfortable, try emailing/contacting department chairs - I don't know why, but this has worked for me in the past. One of the two hospitals I've shadowed in wanted HIPPA clearance and TB shot. The other didn't ask... although maybe it was assumed I had both since I work in a hospital.

Question though - if someone is HIPPA trained/certified at one medical teaching hospital and then observes a surgery at another hospital, does the certification apply? One would think HIPPA is HIPPA... just curious.

 

[bassvp]

Hippa-->hipaa

 

[psipsina]

If you're comfortable, try emailing/contacting department chairs - I don't know why, but this has worked for me in the past. One of the two hospitals I've shadowed in wanted HIPPA clearance and TB shot. The other didn't ask... although maybe it was assumed I had both since I work in a hospital.

Question though - if someone is HIPPA trained/certified at one medical teaching hospital and then observes a surgery at another hospital, does the certification apply? One would think HIPPA is HIPPA... just curious.

I've had to re-hippa at each hospital I've trained at for the most part, both as a medstudent and as a premed. I'm doing away rotations and I have to redo it for each of their hospitals this year.

 

[orthomyxo]

What if I've had HIPPA training as a part of my job as a pharm tech? Will they make me retrain at the hospital if I ever shadow a surgeon?

 

[familyaerospace]

Question though - if someone is HIPPA trained/certified at one medical teaching hospital and then observes a surgery at another hospital, does the certification apply? One would think HIPPA is HIPPA... just curious.

Generally they will have you redo it.

 

[JFK90787]

As others have said, just email doctors. Some will tell you that it's not possible due to blah blah blah; ignore these people, it's very much possible, you just need to get lucky and email the right person.

As for actually observing surgery, it's boring. You will most likely need to stand so far back that it will be impossible to tell what's going on, so you'll just settle for watching on one of the TV screens in the room, which just sucks all the fun out of it.

 

[psipsina]

What if I've had HIPPA training as a part of my job as a pharm tech? Will they make me retrain at the hospital if I ever shadow a surgeon?

Yes. Each hospital has to document that it trained you for JAHCO. I have been HIPPA'd at 7 hospitals so far (6 of them in the same city!!). At some point you don't have to sit thru the training anymore and can just take a darn quiz and sign something.

 

[softmed]

It is possible. You just need to go through HIPPA training and what not. Best thing to do is contact the volunteer office in the hospital. Some hospitals have such programs already in place and some don't. If there is no program in place then it would be a real pain to set things up.

Ya, that's probably the problem.

I had already gone through the HIPPA training because I am a volunteer and a grad student at the local hospital. All they really had to do was ask the patient if it was okay that a student could observe their surgery.

Now allow me to reminiscence about a time I went to see surgery:

This nurse wouldn't let me in. I told her who I was and she had my name from the surgeon, but she kept insisting that I was not allowed. She said only medical students, nursing students, and pre-meds are allowed to observe surgery.

Obviously this annoyed the crap out of me. I insisted I was a student (even showed her my ID) and I was applying to medical school, which made me pre-med. She argued with me and told me I'm not premed because I'm getting my degree in Genetics. Eventually someone else came and let me in. But it was still an annoying 30 minutes of conversation and a waste of my time.

 

[476515678234896]

Tons of forms + HIPPA lecture + HIPPA test + pt consent = a pretty dull 4 hr long procedure

 

[476515678234896]

This nurse wouldn't let me in. I told her who I was and she had my name from the surgeon, but she kept insisting that I was not allowed. She said only medical students, nursing students, and pre-meds are allowed to observe surgery.

Obviously this annoyed the crap out of me. I insisted I was a student (even showed her my ID) and I was applying to medical school, which made me pre-med. She argued with me and told me I'm not premed because I'm getting my degree in Genetics. Eventually someone else came and let me in. But it was still an annoying 30 minutes of conversation and a waste of my time.

this is the reason that all you need to get into nursing school is a pulse

 

[riss11]

There's this pediatric surgeon I really really want to shadow. I emailed the office manager of the practice she works at and she or he hasnt responded yet and it's been two months....I googled the surgeon I wanted to shadow and she has a facebook lol its probably a really bad idea to send her a message right? I don't want her to think I'm a psycho stalking her but she doesn't have a direct email and everytime i call the office, they don't answer....I've volunteered at the children's hospital that she works at plus three other hospitals over my sophomore and junior year so I'm well informed bout HIPPA, infection control, ect...
Idk if I should facebook msg her.....I feel like its really inappropriate and informal to do that but it seems like that's the only way I can reach her...advice?
oh I'm a high school senior btw

 

[familyaerospace]

I would just keep calling the office. The plastic surgeon I shadowed had a facebook, but we already knew each other well before I ever made that step towards messaging him that way.

 

[Ansar]

Just go to private practices
I asked and have been able to watch every surgery he does

 

[dice404]

As for actually observing surgery, it's boring. You will most likely need to stand so far back that it will be impossible to tell what's going on, so you'll just settle for watching on one of the TV screens in the room, which just sucks all the fun out of it.

I regularly shadow an orthopedic surgeon, and I have to say, it is anything but boring. Make sure the attending lets you scrub for cases. I scrub for every case, so I'm right there at the table.

 

[Zairair]

So what's the best way to go about this scenario?

You ask, "Hey can I watch you do a surgery?"
Docter/volunteer coord says, "No, it's the law."
Do you proceed to ask another doctor or do you try to work your way in the same doctor? + How?

(Don't grill me on this, I've never tried, I just imagined it being like this)

 

[fizzgig]

riss11, i don't know that i would facebook msg someone... not for any hard rule that i can think of but just.... meh? i am just starting to shadow. for one of my shadows so far i needed to go cold like you - i want to shadow a PCP which requires leaving my better connections at an academic center.

what i did was write a letter and print a hard copy, directed to the doctor him/herself. i googled to find these people. one of them i chose because she had a mentoring award listed on some site, which made me think she could be more open to having a shadow, and lo, she is the one who has emailed me (will see about the other, dropped them off less than a week ago). the point is that i dropped off the letter in person, i think based off advice i saw on sdn. i wanted SOMEONE to have a tiny bit of interaction with me in addition to my written letter. dunno how much effect it has, but looking up info on potential docs and also taking a letter directly to their office to go in their mailbox at least gets your info into their hands, and not into the inbox of some nice but overworked office assistant who gets 400 emails a day..

i also don't know if this makes any difference, but i did make sure to give a bit of background as to why i wanted to shadow, why that particular area of med, and i made sure to mention that i had observed at our academic ctr too, had hipaa training, and that i understood the professionalism required etc. obviously it's my word and if they want me to do their hipaa that's great, but they know i've thought about it and that i have been in a similar situation. if you haven't observed before but did hipaa to do your clinical volunteering, same idea. i wanted them to know how little trouble i would be 🙂

 

[riss11]

Thanks I think I'm going to stop by their office sometime this week and just drop off my cover and resume stuff and briefly talk to their office manager. I shadowed an orthopedic surgeon last semester and went through the necessary OR and HIPPA training....the only problem that I might encounter if I get to shadow this pediatric surgeon is the fact that I'm not 18 yet...I'm six months shy of it

 

[ericksonj15]

.

 

[SFO-IST]

do international work. I've held protractors, surgical grips (attached to an appendix), put in/taken out stitches, dressed wounds, helped set a cast, lubricated a UG catheter, taken histories, done paperwork, etc. all before even being a med student.

 

[Silverman780]

I have found that teaching hospitals with medical school affiliations are generally easier to land observation times because the doctors are more used to the idea of having a observer.

However unless your goal is to become a surgeon I can't see it being that much more useful than regular shadowing.

 

[Hah]

I shadowed a surgeon that I met during volunteering at the hospital. Your volunteer coordinator will probably be great help with that if you have one.



But on an unrelated note: Shadowing a surgeon is good cause you get to yawn!!!! It's hard not too when its a 5 hours surgery -.-..


And no I don't want to be a surgeon.