ok what do i do having a breakdown!!

[aimsz88]

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Hi all,


First I want to apologize to QofQuimica...I already PMed Q about my situation but I seriously am having some serious self-doubts that I can do this.

Here's the rundown of anybody who cares to read:

USC in cali:
admitted at age 16 as a Resident Honors Program student (40 per nation per grad class)
admitted with full academic scholarship
won a spot in the music school as a Cello Performance major

four years there were a disaster. tried to do everything. ended up with 2.9 gpa or so, ****loads of extracurriculars (started my own unite for sight chapter, tutored disadvantaged kids for two years, all good things but not really helpful) took the MCAT once, got a 22R.

UCLA Extension:
retook my pre-meds and took physics which I haven't taken. 4.0 everything. I think the GPA is now up to around 3.4 or so. Took the MCAT last August 24R.

work full time now as a research assistant to cardiothoracic surgeon at UCLA. banging out the posters, abstracst, and publications like cookies.

Breakdown:
So do I just give up or what? I'm gonna take the MCAT in April, but I just feel like I am never going to be good enough and it will be 50 before I get to the point where I can apply to schools without hanging my head in shame. What should I do? an SMP? a structured post bacc? keep going as is and just get the MCAT up? argh!!!

any advice would be taken gratefully. thanks!

 

[MD Rapper]

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[njbmd]

<Snip>
Breakdown:
So do I just give up or what? I'm gonna take the MCAT in April, but I just feel like I am never going to be good enough and it will be 50 before I get to the point where I can apply to schools without hanging my head in shame. What should I do? an SMP? a structured post bacc? keep going as is and just get the MCAT up?

Hi there,
I think you already know the answer to your question and it seems that you are working on what you need to do. You NEED to be very, very sure that you are prepared for doing well on the MCAT this time around. If not, opt out and do not take this exam. You already have two mediocre scores so the next one needs to be very, very good. You DO NOT have the option of posting another low score. A very strong MCAT score might be all you need but you need to be very sure that you have taken care of whatever keeps you from doing well on this important exam.

You already have your pre-med coursework done so I am not sure that a post-bac is going to do much for you. Your MCAT is your weakness and you need to make sure that it becomes a strength. A special masters program (like Georgetown's) is another option (expensive) that you might want to check out. If you can get into a SMP with linkage, you could avoid re-taking the MCAT.

Good luck
njbmd 🙂

 

[MD Rapper]

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[QuikClot]

For a guy whose story screams "two percenter!" those are a couple of really poor MCATs. Why do you think you scored so low, after doing so well in your pre-req.? What was your preparation like?

 

[aimsz88]

hey all,


thank you very much to all those that replied. i think i was just having a flipping out mental time yesterday, and it was only temporary. just frustration, mostly.

yeah, i guess i will just keep on trucking. i have a week to decide whether i really am going to kill this MCAT in april, or in august. if i put it off until august it will be another application year slipping through my fingers...but i guess i can not afford to do so poorly again.

i think i didnt pay attention to my pre-reqs the first time around and second time around i didnt have all of the classes yet as a review...so i taught myself everything again for the second mcat but didnt realize i probably didn't have a lot of the concepts solidly locked in. i know next time will be better, but its a question of how much better.

njbmd, i think you are right. how poorly does it look to have multiple low scores on an application? do they see all these scores?

 

[MD Rapper]

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[QuikClot]

Many schools average the scores . . . you probably want to avoid those.

Something seems confusing here. You didn't really pay attention, but you got a 4.0 in all your pre-req.s? You're certain you'll "kill" on the next MCAT, but you haven't said anything about how you're going to change your prep.

With a 3.4, 24, and publications "like cookies" you might be accepted to some allopathic schools, and certainally to many DO schools. You haven't mentioned which schools you're aiming for, however.

Have you thought about why you are doing this? I only ask because you seem to be in a terrific rush to get where you're going, but in some ways it seems like your thought process is a little different from the norm.

 

[rgerwin]

For DO schools, if you apply broadly, your MCAT would be fine, especially since you brought your GPA up. You're actually average, not below average.

 

[Chronic Student]

I would encourage you not to give up. Your GPA in not the best, nor the worsrt. However, it would be wise to get a 30+ on the MCAT and apply to as many schools as is realistic for you.

-Mike

 

[aimsz88]

Many schools average the scores . . . you probably want to avoid those.

Something seems confusing here. You didn't really pay attention, but you got a 4.0 in all your pre-req.s? You're certain you'll "kill" on the next MCAT, but you haven't said anything about how you're going to change your prep.

With a 3.4, 24, and publications "like cookies" you might be accepted to some allopathic schools, and certainally to many DO schools. You haven't mentioned which schools you're aiming for, however.

Have you thought about why you are doing this? I only ask because you seem to be in a terrific rush to get where you're going, but in some ways it seems like your thought process is a little different from the norm.

well i retook a lot of my prereqs. so in my opinion the A wasn't AS hard the second time around. true, i was never in class the first time, but i got my act together this time around.

i'm aiming for any school that will take me. i would prefer to be in a large city, as i'm a los angeleno, but hey, beggars can't be choosy.

yes, i am in a terrific rush and i don't know why. my thought process? i'm not sure what you are referring to..maybe that i just feel old. i know im only 22, and that's not old at all...but i just want my med school life to begin...someday...

 

[aimsz88]

It won't look bad if you make a dramatic improvement the next time you take the exam... otherwise, your chances for admission are going to diminish greatly.

All scores are automatically released to the AAMC when you submit your AMCAS.

diminish greatly? wow. i am thinking august is a smart choice then to take the mcat. do the scores ever expire or drop off your record at any point?

 

[kelli]

diminish greatly? wow. i am thinking august is a smart choice then to take the mcat. do the scores ever expire or drop off your record at any point?

Schools don't accept scores more than 3 years old. But I'm not sure if they're still available to be viewed after that point. I would think no, but don't quote me on that.

 

[kelli]

And you're only 22? Why are you in such a huge rush? You're not behind schedule by any stretch of the imagination. Do things right this time around, even if you're not ready for the August MCAT, postpone things another year and do everything to the best of your ability. Study and take practice tests until you can do them in your sleep. Don't half-ass things again or else you won't be taken seriously anywhere.

 

[FDoRoML]

OK, as a re-applicant (and a successful one at that!), I can maybe offer some advice and encouragement.

Your MCAT needs to come up substantially for any allopathic schools. I would also suggest you plan on applying to DO schools... they are not "lesser" schools but are a heck of a lot more tolerant about scores being so-so and more focused on you as a person and your motivations for medicine. Study, at least 300 hours. Take practice tests until you want to puke. Yes, timed tests under slightly uncomfortable conditions (no bathroom breaks in the middle of a section; no snacks!). PM me if you want suggestions about how to tackle this one-- it was the bain of my existence for a while!

Yes, they do see ALL of your scores. I took it 3 times (twice in the year I first applied, and then once in August for this application year) and they were all visible on AMCAS. Allo schools will look at an "average" but will notice low scores (your most recent had better be your best score, and if you interview be prepared to discuss it!). Osteo schools actually look at your highest score in each section of ANY exam... and your current score is average for many DO schools anyway.

So, you've mentioned your academic credentials. I agree that a master's program might be a good idea for you. BUT-- what held you back this time? Do you not have significant experience in medicine? While they want to see nice community service, if they don't see shadowing or other significant clinical experience (paid or unpaid) they will be wary of you. You're only 22 and do you really know what you're getting into? You can say, emphatically, "YES, I DO!" if you have shadowed for a number of months and gotten good LORs from that physician.

I know you are in a hurry... I was. Of course, I was older when I first applied, so don't feel too bad. I took 3 years to square everything away to improve my application and it worked. You just have to set the goal in sight and keep trucking....

FDoRoML

 

[QuikClot]

well i retook a lot of my prereqs. so in my opinion the A wasn't AS hard the second time around. true, i was never in class the first time, but i got my act together this time around.

i'm aiming for any school that will take me. i would prefer to be in a large city, as i'm a los angeleno, but hey, beggars can't be choosy.

yes, i am in a terrific rush and i don't know why. my thought process? i'm not sure what you are referring to..maybe that i just feel old. i know im only 22, and that's not old at all...but i just want my med school life to begin...someday...

That feeling of life rushing by subsides sometime in one's twenties. When I was about 29 I looked around and said -- "My God. It just goes on and on, doesn't it?"

Advice from a hoary elder, applicable to the practice of patient care as much as to this process: hasty actions waste time. Considered and delibrate action is the quickiest route. You have two bad MCATs. That is a lot of wasted time already. Pause, and ask yourself: why is this MCAT going to be different; are my LOR and essays all excellent; am I ready to interview well; am I applying to a wide range of schools, including DO school, to maxmize my chances.

When you have answers for all these questions -- based not on hopes or resolutions but on a strategy -- you're ready to apply.

 

[kelli]

Yes, they do see ALL of your scores. I took it 3 times (twice in the year I first applied, and then once in August for this application year) and they were all visible on AMCAS.

I really don't think that schools can see scores that are more than 3 years old. Reason being that on the AMCAS website (http://www.aamc.org/students/amcas/faq/transcripts.htm) it states:

If you need to release scores from an MCAT exam taken prior to 2003, you can do so through the MCAT THx System.

... meaning that you have to access their THx system to purposely report those outdated scores, right?

 

[FDoRoML]

... meaning that you have to access their THx system to purposely report those outdated scores, right?

I'm not sure if maybe you took the MCAT and *never applied* with those scores, but mine were released when I applied in 2003 (scores were 2001/2002) and remained so (whether I liked it or not!!) when I reapplied this year. They were automatically populated into AMCAS and I only had to use THX to release to DO schools.

 

[aimsz88]

OK, as a re-applicant (and a successful one at that!), I can maybe offer some advice and encouragement.

Your MCAT needs to come up substantially for any allopathic schools. I would also suggest you plan on applying to DO schools... they are not "lesser" schools but are a heck of a lot more tolerant about scores being so-so and more focused on you as a person and your motivations for medicine. Study, at least 300 hours. Take practice tests until you want to puke. Yes, timed tests under slightly uncomfortable conditions (no bathroom breaks in the middle of a section; no snacks!). PM me if you want suggestions about how to tackle this one-- it was the bain of my existence for a while!

Yes, they do see ALL of your scores. I took it 3 times (twice in the year I first applied, and then once in August for this application year) and they were all visible on AMCAS. Allo schools will look at an "average" but will notice low scores (your most recent had better be your best score, and if you interview be prepared to discuss it!). Osteo schools actually look at your highest score in each section of ANY exam... and your current score is average for many DO schools anyway.

So, you've mentioned your academic credentials. I agree that a master's program might be a good idea for you. BUT-- what held you back this time? Do you not have significant experience in medicine? While they want to see nice community service, if they don't see shadowing or other significant clinical experience (paid or unpaid) they will be wary of you. You're only 22 and do you really know what you're getting into? You can say, emphatically, "YES, I DO!" if you have shadowed for a number of months and gotten good LORs from that physician.

I know you are in a hurry... I was. Of course, I was older when I first applied, so don't feel too bad. I took 3 years to square everything away to improve my application and it worked. You just have to set the goal in sight and keep trucking....

FDoRoML

you guys are awesome. i honestly am taking every bit of advice to heart, which is kinda scary in the sense that i don't know you guys at all...but i know you all are good people with sdn love and i really appreciate it.

i guess for some reason lately i wake in the morning going..."auguuuggggghhhh" and i feel panicked just thinking about the prospect of never going to medical school, seeing as how finally i am really actually working towards this goal with nothing else on my mind.

yes i have extensive clinical experience. to make money as an undergrad i was a certified nurse assistant and an emergency room tech for two years. since i work for a surgeon now, i am always visiting her clinic, interacting with her patients, and she allows me to help during surgery (very minor things, of course).

i guess i would have to say yes on the "do i really know what i am getting into" part of the question. as a former professional musician, ballet dancer, radio dj, apartment manager...and a whole list of other random things i've learned to do along the road of life...there's absolutely nothing else i can do in life that will make it meaningful. nothing. like, if somebody were to tell me that i could never be a doctor, i think i would probably decide that life was not worth living. not to sound crazy suicidal, but i HAVE to be a doctor. there is no back up plan now.

 

[aimsz88]

I'm not sure if maybe you took the MCAT and *never applied* with those scores, but mine were released when I applied in 2003 (scores were 2001/2002) and remained so (whether I liked it or not!!) when I reapplied this year. They were automatically populated into AMCAS and I only had to use THX to release to DO schools.

when you say that the scores were averaged, that means that even if there is a significant improvement, your overall MCAT that they use to evaluate you is an average including the two low scores?

 

[FDoRoML]

when you say that the scores were averaged, that means that even if there is a significant improvement, your overall MCAT that they use to evaluate you is an average including the two low scores?

Allo schools will look at an "average" but will notice low scores (your most recent had better be your best score, and if you interview be prepared to discuss it!). Osteo schools actually look at your highest score in each section of ANY exam... and your current score is average for many DO schools anyway.

Hm. Not sure which you mean... when I said "average" referring to the allo schools, they take them all into account. Your most recent is the most important to them, so significant improvement in all sections will not be averaged lower based on prior scores. I probably should have been more clear on this-- so, many people who retake will fluctuate around the mean of a few sections if they mostly need to improve one section (for me, it was PS that I had to study like crazy). So, if you get a 10, 9, 11 in three tries on one particular section, they pretty much think of you like a 10 but appreciate that your last score was the highest. If it was 9, 10, 9, they unintentionally (I think it's unintentional, at least) average you at a 9+ and think of you in that manner.

I don't think they actually do any calculations to average anything. I was strictly speaking of the psychology of the AdCom. Of course, if you go from a 24M to a 29R... I don't think they'll really hold the 24 against you provided you explain why it happened and how you improved it so much and what you learned from the experience. It's all in how you spin it, sometimes. 🙂

 

[UMP]

every school treats repeat MCAT scores differently... some take the best, some take the most recent, some average, some even pull your best score from each section... taking the most recent score seems to be the most common method, though.