Older surgical resident interested in military medicine

[goldie]

I'm 37, having taken ten years off between college and med school, and am currently a PGY-2 surgical resident. I'm aware that the military accepts MDs at all levels of training, but I'm wondering what the age limitations are. I thought you were acceptable up to your early 40's, but am wondering if I could get clarification. Also wondering if anyone got into this late in the game. Finally, any input from military surgeons - their opinion of their practice vs. civilian practice, opportunity for fellowships, etc. - would be very much appreciated.

Thanks.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Galo]

I'm 37, having taken ten years off between college and med school, and am currently a PGY-2 surgical resident. I'm aware that the military accepts MDs at all levels of training, but I'm wondering what the age limitations are. I thought you were acceptable up to your early 40's, but am wondering if I could get clarification. Also wondering if anyone got into this late in the game. Finally, any input from military surgeons - their opinion of their practice vs. civilian practice, opportunity for fellowships, etc. - would be very much appreciated.

Thanks.

I cannot answer you about age limits, but I'm fairly certain when you finishe your residency, they would likely take you. I'm sure calling a recruiter would get you that answer. As far as a place to practice surgery, at this point in time, and in the next 3 yrs, I think it would be the biggest mistake of your early surgical career. You need to read this forum thoroughly, especially the stickies. As a 6 year USAF surgeon, I can tell you from my experience, and that of many others, you will be misserable and watch your skills heavily deterioriate while you become at most a part time gastroenterologist, that is unless you are at a place where they have one, and you will then have very little to do. Friends that I talked to in the Army, (no Navy ones), have said much the same, especially if you find yourself at a small base. PM me if you have any other questions.

 

[SF49ers Fan]

I'm 37, having taken ten years off between college and med school, and am currently a PGY-2 surgical resident. I'm aware that the military accepts MDs at all levels of training, but I'm wondering what the age limitations are. I thought you were acceptable up to your early 40's, but am wondering if I could get clarification. Also wondering if anyone got into this late in the game. Finally, any input from military surgeons - their opinion of their practice vs. civilian practice, opportunity for fellowships, etc. - would be very much appreciated.

Thanks.

I'm right there with you in age, but you are a bit further along than me in your training. I don't know what the age limit is, but you shouldn't have any problems. They didn't seem to mind an old crusty sea dog like me. Good luck.

 

[a1qwerty55]

I'm 37, having taken ten years off between college and med school, and am currently a PGY-2 surgical resident. I'm aware that the military accepts MDs at all levels of training, but I'm wondering what the age limitations are. I thought you were acceptable up to your early 40's, but am wondering if I could get clarification. Also wondering if anyone got into this late in the game. Finally, any input from military surgeons - their opinion of their practice vs. civilian practice, opportunity for fellowships, etc. - would be very much appreciated.

Thanks.

A little confused... are you trying to enter as a surgical resident?

If so, I would say, stay where you are assuming it is a ok program, after graduation, negotiate for your duty station if possible as surgical case load is an issue in a smaller facility.

I would take negative posts from USAF posters with a grain of salt. They routinely project their negative experiences on the other services.

As far as age limit, I have seen docs enter the military in their 50's so that isn't an issue.

 

[Galo]

By all means, take everything here with a grain of salt. Do your research, and call up active duty surgeons, especially army, to get a better idea of what you may be getting into. The more you call, the better idea you will get about the current and future climate of surgery in the military.

 

[MaximusD]

Found that in an unexpected place...

***You must meet these basic requirements to join the US Air Force. To QUALIFY for the US Air Force you must: Be a US citizen or have valid unrestricted alien registration card from the USCIS with at least 2 years remaining until expiration (You must obtain this status on your own, the Air Force cannot assist you with obtaining it), Be between the ages of 17-27 (enlistment) upto 35 (officer commissioning) upto 48 (healthcare professionals), Be a high school graduate, Have parental consent if age 17, Be of good health and moral character, Meet our height and weight requirements, reference link Height/Weight Chart***

Age limit for healthcare professionals is 48.

 

[RichL025]

Age limit is completely waiverable.

Nuts, I wish I could remember the guys name.... some fairly famous surgeon joined right after 9-11, he was in his late 50s, I met him down at Ft Sam (well, I was briefly introduced to him to be truthful <g>)...

Anyway, YES, if after you finish your training, you decide to join the military, you will be able to.

I'm also a surgery R2, 40 years old, already in the military. My story is a little different because I spent most of those intervening years in the military though - I "came up" through the system if you will.

Suggestion: complete your program, obtain any sub-specialty training you are interested in, and if you still have the desire, contact a health professions recruiter of the service of your choice (we are all generally biased towards our own services, but I seem to hear worst things about the USAF than I experience in the Army - from Galo mainly).

Obtaining sub-specialty training first will ensure you don't get assigned to a smaller army hospital where Galo's comments about being a gastroenterologist tend to be more likely...

Then again, if you contact the recruiters as a graduating chief resident, you might be able to request / demand assignment to a better hospital (make sure anything like that is in WRITING in your contract. There is no such thing as a gentleman's agreement).

Most subspecialty training is done at civilian fellowships anyway, there are only a very few that the military does in-house, and even for those (vascular, CT, can't think of anything else) the majority of people go to civilian fellowships- but sometimes they are required to do a year or three as a bread & butter general surgeon at a small, out-of-the-way army base to pay their dues, so I would NOT look to do your fellowship after you come in to the military, in your current situation.

If you have a crushing debt burden, the military has loan repayment programs in exchange for a longer commitment. If your debt burden is manageable, then I would suggest avoiding such programs because it gives you more flexibility to walk away should the army stick you in a very undesirable location with a low case load, etc.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those "hate the army" types who always pines for my freedom. But you need to realize that the "Needs of the Army" always comes first when it comes to personnel decisions, and many times the "Needs of the Army" do not correlate with the "Career Goals of the Individual".

Good luck, and feel free to pm me off line with any other questions.

 

[IgD]

Suggestion: complete your program, obtain any sub-specialty training you are interested in, and if you still have the desire, contact a health professions recruiter of the service of your choice (we are all generally biased towards our own services, but I seem to hear worst things about the USAF than I experience in the Army - from Galo mainly).

Obtaining sub-specialty training first will ensure you don't get assigned to a smaller army hospital where Galo's comments about being a gastroenterologist tend to be more likely...

You will likely have to complete a utilization tour before you can get a serious look for sub-specialty training at the annual selection board.

I don't think your second point is accurate. The military puts sub-specialists at small hospitals. If it is you then you are on call 24/7 plus responsible for the general issues in your field. I had a colleague one time who was deployed as a heme/onc subspecialist to fill a general internal medicine billet.

 

[MaximusD]

staying anonymous at least in searches 😉

 

[IgD]

This is why I am wondering if I'd have luck doing straight-through residency training in internal medicine followed by my 3 years of payback (3-year HPSP) then getting out and doing a 2-year fellowship in a subspecialty at a civilian program. I wouldn't mind being an internist for a few years, but long term I think I would rather find a subspecialty... It is my understanding that most fellowships take their own and that coming from a military residency would put me at an inherent disadvantage. How true is this? Is this scenario extremely unlikely to play out well? Thoughts?

Your thoughts are very relevant. There are 2 key stumbling blocks:
1. You might have to do a GMO tour in between internship and PGY2
2. Possible utilization tour after graduating residency prior to fellowship

Every time you hit a stumbling block you might accrue additional payback.

On the flip side as a fellow in the military you get paid as if you were a general internal medicine attending (base pay + ISP + ASP bonus). If you do a civilian fellowship you would probably make half that even if you cashed in the GI bill.