OMFS Stats Check

[stuckinthesnow]

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Hey all - sorry to be that person who posts about their stats, but I just need some perspective. I applied for 20 programs this year and only got one interview. I ranked first in my class out of 44 students. I have some publications and externship experience, some student body involvement etc. My biggest issue - a 67 on the CBSE. Is this score too low? Does my class rank make up for this?

 

[Sublimazing]

Being Canadian definitely the biggest problem on your application...without a doubt. I would also look into why didn't you get interview invites where you externed?

Having said that, you should definitely strongly consider retaking the CBSE for next cycle...as 67 isn't really that competitive of a score for a number of reasons:

1. 2 full years ago the average 6 year matriculant scored a 75.3 and the average 4 year matriculant a 63.5... the combined average was 68.9. Granted those numbers were based off survey respondents...but you can believe that in 2 years that matriculant score has only gone significantly up. Those averages also likely include individuals who got accepted because of a non-categorical year or because of some sort of social connection.

2. A very high class rank juxtaposed against a lower than average CBSE is going to be regarded with suspicion.

3. Anecdotally it seems like the individuals who crushed the CBSE applied to notably more programs than normal because of virtual interviews.

4. In addition to it being well below the average for 6 year matriculants...it also doesn't represent a clear passing score on Step 1 (which I believe is 68? unless scaling changed?). It seems very unlikely to me that any 6 year programs would have extended interviews to anyone below their passing cutoff (without the non-cat/social connection).


Obviously your biggest hurdle will be identifying which programs are Canada friendly.

 

[stuckinthesnow]

Being Canadian definitely the biggest problem on your application...without a doubt. I would also look into why didn't you get interview invites where you externed?

Having said that, you should definitely strongly consider retaking the CBSE for next cycle...as 67 isn't really that competitive of a score for a number of reasons:

1. 2 full years ago the average 6 year matriculant scored a 75.3 and the average 4 year matriculant a 63.5... the combined average was 68.9. Granted those numbers were based off survey respondents...but you can believe that in 2 years that matriculant score has only gone significantly up. Those averages also likely include individuals who got accepted because of a non-categorical year or because of some sort of social connection.

2. A very high class rank juxtaposed against a lower than average CBSE is going to be regarded with suspicion.

3. Anecdotally it seems like the individuals who crushed the CBSE applied to notably more programs than normal because of virtual interviews.

4. In addition to it being well below the average for 6 year matriculants...it also doesn't represent a clear passing score on Step 1 (which I believe is 68? unless scaling changed?). It seems very unlikely to me that any 6 year programs would have extended interviews to anyone below their passing cutoff (without the non-cat/social connection).


Obviously your biggest hurdle will be identifying which programs are Canada friendly.

Thanks for the response! Is there a reason why programs don't like taking Canadians? I made sure all schools I applied to accept Canadians.

I only externed in Canada, where no one is accepted without a non-cat year or at the very least a GPR. There are only 6 programs in Canada (effectively 5 if you don't speak French), and so no one is accepted straight out of dental school.

This year's step 1 passing score equivalent was 67 (194 on the new scale), but I certainly understand what you are saying. I am planning on rewriting the CBSE and hoping to land a non-categorical position to boost the strength of my application for next year.

 

[deleted1082923]

Thanks for the response! Is there a reason why programs don't like taking Canadians? I made sure all schools I applied to accept Canadians.

I only externed in Canada, where no one is accepted without a non-cat year or at the very least a GPR. There are only 6 programs in Canada (effectively 5 if you don't speak French), and so no one is accepted straight out of dental school.

This year's step 1 passing score equivalent was 67 (194 on the new scale), but I certainly understand what you are saying. I am planning on rewriting the CBSE and hoping to land a non-categorical position to boost the strength of my application for next year.

A lot of programs don't want to deal with Visa issues, and so only take US citizens or permanent residents.

 

[nade0016]

Thanks for the response! Is there a reason why programs don't like taking Canadians? I made sure all schools I applied to accept Canadians.

I only externed in Canada, where no one is accepted without a non-cat year or at the very least a GPR. There are only 6 programs in Canada (effectively 5 if you don't speak French), and so no one is accepted straight out of dental school.

This year's step 1 passing score equivalent was 67 (194 on the new scale), but I certainly understand what you are saying. I am planning on rewriting the CBSE and hoping to land a non-categorical position to boost the strength of my application for next year.

As a PD who does take Canadians I can vouch for the visa issue. It is expensive to host a visa for 4-6 years. Around 3K/year but it does depend on the type of visa. As a large academic institution and on the Canadian border the visa cost issue is minor but hospitals and hospital based programs may be reluctant due to cost. There is also the issue with obtaining a full dental license as some programs require. While CODA will accredit the Canadian SOD certain state dental boards may only accept a certain board exam which may not include the Canadian version requiring you to go take another set of boards. Risky, for if you don't pass or take them later in the year then you cannot be a resident day 1, which is tough for many programs.

I personally have not had any issues with "foreign" resident visas. So it doesn't bother me much.

 

[stuckinthesnow]

As a PD who does take Canadians I can vouch for the visa issue. It is expensive to host a visa for 4-6 years. Around 3K/year but it does depend on the type of visa. As a large academic institution and on the Canadian border the visa cost issue is minor but hospitals and hospital based programs may be reluctant due to cost. There is also the issue with obtaining a full dental license as some programs require. While CODA will accredit the Canadian SOD certain state dental boards may only accept a certain board exam which may not include the Canadian version requiring you to go take another set of boards. Risky, for if you don't pass or take them later in the year then you cannot be a resident day 1, which is tough for many programs.

I personally have not had any issues with "foreign" resident visas. So it doesn't bother me much.

Thank you for the insight, I appreciate this. In regards to the licensing issue, would the completion of an intern year and obtaining of a full dental license then make a Canadian applicant much more appealing?

 

[nade0016]

sure, but thats not the issue. Its the cost of the visa.

 

[dentistrydmd]

Thank you for the insight, I appreciate this. In regards to the licensing issue, would the completion of an intern year and obtaining of a full dental license then make a Canadian applicant much more appealing?

The intern year would. Your CBSE score along with being Canadian are the two most significant reasons. You should look into which programs have historically taken Canadians in the past. Using that strategic list you should be able to get more interviews. Programs that I know of that have taken Canadians include Boston U, NYU, University of Maryland, and Emory. I'd encourage you to look up their current resident list to find out if it is worth applying.

 

[missmisdemeanor]

As a Canadian you qualify for a TN Visa as a dentist under NAFTA. The cost of the TN visa is $56USD - you pay when you cross the border to apply and is valid for up to 3 years. No cost to your institution unless they are kind enough to provide a lawyer. You don't qualify for this visa during med school years and would need sponsorship which is why you'll find fewer 6 year programs accepting Canadians.

 

[OMaxFace]

Being Canadian definitely the biggest problem on your application...without a doubt. I would also look into why didn't you get interview invites where you externed?

Having said that, you should definitely strongly consider retaking the CBSE for next cycle...as 67 isn't really that competitive of a score for a number of reasons:

1. 2 full years ago the average 6 year matriculant scored a 75.3 and the average 4 year matriculant a 63.5... the combined average was 68.9. Granted those numbers were based off survey respondents...but you can believe that in 2 years that matriculant score has only gone significantly up. Those averages also likely include individuals who got accepted because of a non-categorical year or because of some sort of social connection.

2. A very high class rank juxtaposed against a lower than average CBSE is going to be regarded with suspicion.

3. Anecdotally it seems like the individuals who crushed the CBSE applied to notably more programs than normal because of virtual interviews.

4. In addition to it being well below the average for 6 year matriculants...it also doesn't represent a clear passing score on Step 1 (which I believe is 68? unless scaling changed?). It seems very unlikely to me that any 6 year programs would have extended interviews to anyone below their passing cutoff (without the non-cat/social connection).


Obviously your biggest hurdle will be identifying which programs are Canada friendly.

Agreed. Being Canadian in addition to a non-competitive CBSE score isn't ideal. Canadians need to really stand out for programs to rank them highly. The visa process is a headache for both parties. I tend to recommend to Canadian applicants that a CBSE score close to 75 should be the goal.

Like Sublimazing said, figuring out Canadian friendly programs is your first step. Email coordinators about this.

With regards to the TN mentioned above, that will really depend from institution to institution. Some will allow for a TN, while others will make you do the J1. Just because you qualify for it doesn't mean your institution allows for it to be used on a resident level. If you can, try your hardest to et the TN. You'll likely be on an F1 during medical school.