Orlando College of Osteopathic Medicine

[Allosteopath]

Whoot whoot....

Another month another DO school applying for pre-accreditation. This Dr. Hasty guy is quite hasty with opening them isn't he?

OCOM - Orlando College of Osteopathic Medicine - Orlando, FL

The Orlando College of Osteopathic Medicine (OCOM) is Central Florida's first osteopathic Medical School.

www.orlandocom.org

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[FootballAndSkiing]

Im bored, but I was curious to see how close we were to completing the Alphabet with all these XCOMs
ABCs of COMs or AZCOM (Arizona)

ACOM (Alabama)
BCOM (Burrell)
CCOM (Chicago)
DCOM (DeBusk)
E
F
G
HCOM (OU-HCOM)
ICOM (Idaho)
J
KCOM (Kirksville)
L
MCOM (Montana--RVU)
N
OCOM (orlando)
PCOM (Philly)
Q
R
S
TCOM (Texas)
U
VCOM
W
X
Y
Z

12/26 Almost half way there!

 

[Goro]

Im bored, but I was curious to see how close we were to completing the Alphabet with all these XCOMs
ABCs of COMs or AZCOM (Arizona)

ACOM (Alabama)
BCOM (Burrell)
CCOM (Chicago)
DCOM (DeBusk)
E
F
G
HCOM (OU-HCOM)
ICOM (Idaho)
J
KCOM (Kirksville)
L
MCOM (Montana--RVU)
N
OCOM (orlando)
PCOM (Philly)
Q
R
S
TCOM (Texas)
U
VCOM
W
X
Y
Z

12/26 Almost half way there!

You forgot the Oklahoma school, WCU, the three, soon to be four [bleah!] Touros, Rowan, the two NYITCOMs and ARCOM, for starters. There are 58 DO schools currently. Gawd help the profession.

Bob Hasty interviewed for a Dean position at my school. The Faculty universally found him to be unfit. He is the only human being I have ever met to have his name monogramed on his cuffs.

 

[FootballAndSkiing]

You forgot the Oklahoma school, WCU, the three, soon to be four [bleah!] Touros, Rowan, the two NYITCOMs and ARCOM, for starters. There are 58 DO schools currently. Gawd help the profession.

I was trying to stick with the schools thats were just one letter followed by COM (XCOM format), and actually went by that name as a common way to refer to the school.

 

[Goro]

I was trying to stick with the schools thats were just one letter followed by COM (XCOM format), and actually went by that name as a common way to refer to the school.

I refer to it as OKCOM

 

[Osminog]

“The Most Magical Med School on Earth.”

 

[FootballAndSkiing]

I refer to it as OKCOM

Well we already have a KCOM, and OCOM was the inspiration of the post.

 

[Wjldenver]

This DO school expansion is pure craziness. More new DO schools coupled with expanding class sizes in many of the existing DO schools. Apparently, the COCA members never took an introductory microeconomics class which covered the simple supply and demand model. It's Machiavellian, but if I was a DO degree holder or student, I would want the number of available residencies to be held flat to control the number of entrants to the physician market.

It will get to the point where there are other educational alternatives which will provide a much higher return on investment than medical school. For example, Amazon just announced today that the max base pay for corporate workers was just raised to $350,000 as the labor market is heating up. And top tier MBA's only take two years to complete, not four with a three or more-year residency.

We'll see, my son is now a 3rd year resident, and there is no turning back. But at this point, he is still happy with his decision to become a physician.

 

[Dr Meow]

I'm waiting for YCOM

 

[Goro]

This DO school expansion is pure craziness. More new DO schools coupled with expanding class sizes in many of the existing DO schools. Apparently, the COCA members never took an introductory microeconomics class which covered the simple supply and demand model. It's Machiavellian, but if I was a DO degree holder or student, I would want the number of available residencies to be held flat to control the number of entrants to the physician market.

It will get to the point where there are other educational alternatives which will provide a much higher return on investment than medical school. For example, Amazon just announced today that the max base pay for corporate workers was just raised to $350,000 as the labor market is heating up. And top tier MBA's only take two years to complete, not four with a three or more-year residency.

We'll see, my son is now a 3rd year resident, and there is no turning back. But at this point, he is still happy with his decision to become a physician.

The AOA mindset is "more DOs good!!!"

 

[Obnoxious Dad]

This DO school expansion is pure craziness. More new DO schools coupled with expanding class sizes in many of the existing DO schools. Apparently, the COCA members never took an introductory microeconomics class which covered the simple supply and demand model. It's Machiavellian, but if I was a DO degree holder or student, I would want the number of available residencies to be held flat to control the number of entrants to the physician market.

It will get to the point where there are other educational alternatives which will provide a much higher return on investment than medical school. For example, Amazon just announced today that the max base pay for corporate workers was just raised to $350,000 as the labor market is heating up. And top tier MBA's only take two years to complete, not four with a three or more-year residency.

We'll see, my son is now a 3rd year resident, and there is no turning back. But at this point, he is still happy with his decision to become a physician.

The number of residency slots is not going to "hold flat" because expanding resident classes is cheaper at the margin than hiring additional nurse practitioners, physician assistants or attending physicians. See the note by Chandra, Khular and Wilensky in the June 19, 2014 edition of the New England Journal of Medicine.

Look at the five-year NRMP data. Here and there residency programs add slots even without additional Medicare funding.

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Program-Results_2017_2021.pdf

A medical license is not a guaranteed ticket to wealth. This is why physicians, who won't qualify for loan forgiveness, should pay off their loans ASAP and live well within their means.

 

[Browns99]

My goodness, and they talk about NP/PA encroachment. The non-stop opening of DO schools are hurting the profession.

 

[BioPsychotic]

Are the accreditation requirements for DO schools more lax than those for MD schools? If so, that should change. If these schools are not able to provide students with high quality preclinical education and robust rotation opportunities, they should not be opening.

 

[scoopdaboop]

Are the accreditation requirements for DO schools more lax than those for MD schools? If so, that should change. If these schools are not rigorous enough to provide students with high quality preclinical education and solid rotation opportunities, they should not be opening.

i dont see a big problem with this. applicants just have to realize if they apply to these programs you are relegated to FM/IM/Peds.

 

[BioPsychotic]

i dont see a big problem with this. applicants just have to realize if they apply to these programs you are relegated to FM/IM/Peds.

Applicants want to get into medical school. I can guarantee you that we do not have a solid understanding of what specialty we want to enter.

To open new schools that do not provide you with a good education is *definitely* a problem because that’s the Caribbean offshore school business model.

I hope this school will open and provide opportunities to fill the physician shortage. But if it does that by straddling students with debt and a subpar education, then the consequences will be far reaching.

 

[ortnakas]

I received an invitation to apply for a faculty appointment.

I’ve been done with residency for under one year.

 

[scoopdaboop]

I received an invitation to apply for a faculty appointment.

I’ve been done with residency for under one year.

how much they offering, give us the deetz.

 

[Isoval]

i dont see a big problem with this. applicants just have to realize if they apply to these programs you are relegated to FM/IM/Peds.

I think this is idiotic.

 

[scoopdaboop]

I think this is idiotic.

How so? It is up to the APPLICANT to decide what schools to apply to. If someone's only goal in life is to become a doctor and wish to apply to a new school knowing they might be shooting themselves in the foot, so be IT.

 

[ortnakas]

how much they offering, give us the deetz.

No idea. Have not accepted their invitation and the letters don’t say.

 

[DarkHorizon]

You forgot the Oklahoma school, WCU, the three, soon to be four [bleah!] Touros, Rowan, the two NYITCOMs and ARCOM, for starters. There are 58 DO schools currently. Gawd help the profession.

Bob Hasty interviewed for a Dean position at my school. The Faculty universally found him to be unfit. He is the only human being I have ever met to have his name monogramed on his cuffs.

I rotated with Dr. Hasty as a MS3 on internal medicine service. At that time, he was involved in both didactics and clinical education at Nova. He was the PD at Palmetto hospital for medicine program and helped start a cardiology fellowship. He was a stand up guy in my experience and a great teacher btw. He was a student advocate and was universally liked by students and faculty.

I vividly remember a conversation with him one afternoon regarding RVU. The founding Dean at RVU was Ronnie Martin, who had previously been a faculty at Nova. We talked about for-profit model for medical schools and how RVU gave DOs a bad name. He was critical of Dr. Martin to say the least and vehemently opposed the for-profit model.

That was over 10 years ago. I’m not sure what changed since then. I know he left Nova to start Campbell and then founded Idaho school. He is now running a consulting company to start osteopathic schools.

What We Do — ROUNDOCITY

What We Do

www.roundocity.com

I looked up to Dr. Hasty as a student. It’s disappointing to see him at the forefront of for -profit DO school expansion, and help dilute the osteopathic profession and medicine in general.

 

[Isoval]

How so? It is up to the APPLICANT to decide what schools to apply to. If someone's only goal in life is to become a doctor and wish to apply to a new school knowing they might be shooting themselves in the foot, so be IT.

Let’s just make hundreds of new schools! Who needs jobs? Law schools already tried this. It’s going very well, but you know, applicants have a choice between going to a new law school or Harvard Law where they will most likely be offered a job after completion.

Point being that it’s completely ridiculous to deliberately saturate a market to the point where people are being outcompeted from the word “go”.

 

[PapaGuava]

Yikes, not the most exciting news to read. Those in power see the writing on the wall with the current trend but are full stream ahead.

 

[Goro]

Are the accreditation requirements for DO schools more lax than those for MD schools? If so, that should change. If these schools are not able to provide students with high quality preclinical education and robust rotation opportunities, they should not be opening.

EDIT: modifying my original reply. COCA, sadly is less stringent for the DO world than is LCME for MD schools. We're already seeing the possibility that the odious for-profit CNU MD school might actually lose accreditation. COCA would never, ever do that to one of the COMs.

But back to your question, Bio, COCA has no real requirement for that pesky thing called scientific research. And as we all know , there's no requirement for DO schools to have teaching hospitals. So, DO students go far and wide across their own state, if not the entire USA, to do thier core rotations, many of which they have to set up themselves, with very little oversight, especially with the newest schools. The veteran schools have more rigor, at least.

Applicants want to get into medical school. I can guarantee you that we do not have a solid understanding of what specialty we want to enter.
To open new schools that do not provide you with a good education is *definitely* a problem because that’s the Caribbean offshore school business model.
I hope this school will open and provide opportunities to fill the physician shortage. But if it does that by straddling students with debt and a subpar education, then the consequences will be far reaching.

Pay careful attention: THERE IS NO PHYSICIAN SHORTAGE. There is a physician maldistribution. BUt central FL does not need two medical school. Arkansas does not need three med schools [fount if you count the school that the Walton family want to start!] , and Montana, of all places, doesn't two [RVU-MT and Touro-MT or three if you count U WA putting MT in the WWAMI system]

I received an invitation to apply for a faculty appointment.

Ortnakas, you are one of my fave SDNers, and this is NOT meant an a slight to you, but this illustrates what a lousy school OOCOM is starting out to be. It's almost as if that spamming every DO in the country with job invite. This is not how one starts a med school. IT's how one one starts a Nigerian bank account scam. Did they just go through the AOA membership rolls or LinkedIn and pull out email addys?

I’ve been done with residency for under one year.

What????!!!! But you just graduated med school like...two days ago! Are you violating the laws of physics!!??!!

Let’s just make hundreds of new schools! Who needs jobs? Law schools already tried this. It’s going very well, but you know, applicants have a choice between going to a new law school or Harvard Law where they will most likely be offered a job after completion.

Point being that it’s completely ridiculous to deliberately saturate a market to the point where people are being outcompeted from the word “go”.

AOA mindset: More DOs good!
They haven't learned yet that this is killing Pharmacy and Law.

 

[ortnakas]

Ortnakas, you are one of my fave SDNers, and this is NOT meant an a slight to you, but this illustrates what a lousy school OOCOM is starting out to be. It's almost as if that spamming every DO in the country with job invite. This is not how one starts a med school. IT's how one one starts a Nigerian bank account scam. Did they just go through the AOA membership rolls or LinkedIn and pull out email addys?

Thanks, and no offense taken because I feel the same way. Maybe by 2026 (when they have rotating students) I might be in the position to have a rotating medical student here or there, but recruiting me now, with minimal attending experience and zero teaching experience outside residency and the time I tutored o-chem 15 years ago, smacks of desparatjon to just add names to a list.

 

[Real McCoy]

"Pay careful attention: THERE IS NO PHYSICIAN SHORTAGE. There is a physician maldistribution. BUt central FL does not need two medical school. Arkansas does not need three med schools [fount if you count the school that the Walton family want to start!] , and Montana, of all places, doesn't two [RVU-MT and Touro-MT or three if you count U WA putting MT in the WWAMI system]" @Goro

And one of those Arkansas medical schools continues to claim they're going to have the largest research program of any DO school. Ask how much NIH/NSF/AHA funding they have, whether technicians, postdocs, graduate students, etc. are commonplace, how many publications (not abstracts or posters) faculty and students publish each year, what their IDC recovery rates are, or whether an animal facility or patient sample biobank exists, and you'll find out very quickly that they, like many osteopathic medical schools have no idea what infrastructure is required to run a substantial research enterprise.

 

[Goro]

"Pay careful attention: THERE IS NO PHYSICIAN SHORTAGE. There is a physician maldistribution. BUt central FL does not need two medical school. Arkansas does not need three med schools [fount if you count the school that the Walton family want to start!] , and Montana, of all places, doesn't two [RVU-MT and Touro-MT or three if you count U WA putting MT in the WWAMI system]" @Goro

And one of those Arkansas medical schools continues to claim they're going to have the largest research program of any DO school. Ask how much NIH/NSF/AHA funding they have, whether technicians, postdocs, graduate students, etc. are commonplace, how many publications (not abstracts or posters) faculty and students publish each year, what their IDC recovery rates are, or whether an animal facility or patient sample biobank exists, and you'll find out very quickly that they, like many osteopathic medical schools have no idea what infrastructure is required to run a substantial research enterprise.

Don't do that, McCoy!!!
****! I literally just spit my tea all over my keyboard laughing out loud!!!

I know of a least two DO schools that outproduce (in terms of papers and grants) all other DO schools combined.

I vividly remember a conversation with him one afternoon regarding RVU. The founding Dean at RVU was Ronnie Martin, who had previously been a faculty at Nova. We talked about for-profit model for medical schools and how RVU gave DOs a bad name. He was critical of Dr. Martin to say the least and vehemently opposed the for-profit model.

That was over 10 years ago. I’m not sure what changed since then. I know he left Nova to start Campbell and then founded Idaho school. He is now running a consulting company to start osteopathic schools.

Obviously corrupted by the dark side of the Force.

 

[Sugammaflexx]

You forgot the Oklahoma school, WCU, the three, soon to be four [bleah!] Touros, Rowan, the two NYITCOMs and ARCOM, for starters. There are 58 DO schools currently. Gawd help the profession.

Bob Hasty interviewed for a Dean position at my school. The Faculty universally found him to be unfit. He is the only human being I have ever met to have his name monogramed on his cuffs.

He also used his head shot as bullet points during med school lectures

 

[Goro]

He also used his head shot as bullet points during med school lectures

My head exploded on that one!

 

[deleted1100659]

Do they need an assistant dean? Ill consider the job for a measly 500k a year. Thats what, only 10 DO students annual tuition a year? I remember approximately 0% of the OMM I ever learned but its all good.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

He also used his head shot as bullet points during med school lectures

Can someone teach me how to do this in Powerpoint? Not for my headshot, but pictures of cats or something.

It would be unique if -- in 30 years -- the Fatheads of all the deans of the school get placed down a central hallway...