Hi everyone, i'm currently a 2nd year osteopathic medical student and am interested in orthopedics, say i finish this year with a cumulative gpa between 3.5-3.6 and (with me not being the greatest standardized test taker) i hit a 80-83rd percentile on step 1, but i have a very strong letter from a former chief resident of the hospital i want to match into which is also DO friendly, how good or bad would my chances be at that point. I'm simply trying to predict how badly i need to bust my behind my 3rd and 4th year so any input from anyone will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
Ortho chances
- Thread starter DNA-RL
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First off... definitely do your research and find out which programs are and aren't DO friendly. This is kind of like finding out which programs may or may not invite you for an interview if you don't rotate there (or if you're not from the region, etc.). Second, I would definitely drop a line to either the chair of a nearby allopathic ortho program or that of the program which you mentioned in your post. Get your former chief's help to contact this person and get to know him. I don't know if your DO school has an ortho program (or if any DO schools have them), but you're definitely going to be playing on an allopathic-heavy field, so getting to know your friends and competition isn't a bad idea. Use your connections to get your foot in the door and assess yourself better as a candidate in "their" eyes.
Now, down to the nitty gritty... scoring in the 80-83rd percentile on Step I may be a potentially career-crushing move. I know that there is a lot of debate on the emphasis placed on USMLE exams, but the truth of the matter is that cut-offs exist... it's a sad fact of the game that we play. A safe Step I score is usually considered to be 230-235 or above, depending on the program. There is also a lot of commentary on the smaller community programs having higher cut-offs (240-250) than the bigger academic powerhouses. These are all things to take into consideration. You need to speak with someone regarding converting your DO credentials (i.e., GPA rather than H/HP) into MD speak, so you know how to present yourself to allopathic programs.
Plain and simple... no matter how "good" of a candidate you are, no one with any serious intention of applying to ortho should not work their behind off 3rd and 4th year. All you have to do is travel to www.orthogate.com and lookin the forums there... some people who are AOA with great board scores don't end up matching. Never take anything for granted. Letters of recommendation go a long way, and programs want to know that you're willing to work hard and sacrifice to become part of the ortho community. Aim to get the best grades in every rotation, get in on some ortho research if possible, start networking in the ortho community, and of course, don't burn yourself out doing it. They also want to know that you're a human being and a person with other interests and unique qualities outside of ortho. People want to know that you're going to fit in with the program/residents/faculty, or as one director told us, "I want to know that your personality disorder isn't going to clash with my personality disorder."
Work hard, be yourself, have a life, and be serious about your commitment to orthopaedics. Good luck!
Now, down to the nitty gritty... scoring in the 80-83rd percentile on Step I may be a potentially career-crushing move. I know that there is a lot of debate on the emphasis placed on USMLE exams, but the truth of the matter is that cut-offs exist... it's a sad fact of the game that we play. A safe Step I score is usually considered to be 230-235 or above, depending on the program. There is also a lot of commentary on the smaller community programs having higher cut-offs (240-250) than the bigger academic powerhouses. These are all things to take into consideration. You need to speak with someone regarding converting your DO credentials (i.e., GPA rather than H/HP) into MD speak, so you know how to present yourself to allopathic programs.
Plain and simple... no matter how "good" of a candidate you are, no one with any serious intention of applying to ortho should not work their behind off 3rd and 4th year. All you have to do is travel to www.orthogate.com and lookin the forums there... some people who are AOA with great board scores don't end up matching. Never take anything for granted. Letters of recommendation go a long way, and programs want to know that you're willing to work hard and sacrifice to become part of the ortho community. Aim to get the best grades in every rotation, get in on some ortho research if possible, start networking in the ortho community, and of course, don't burn yourself out doing it. They also want to know that you're a human being and a person with other interests and unique qualities outside of ortho. People want to know that you're going to fit in with the program/residents/faculty, or as one director told us, "I want to know that your personality disorder isn't going to clash with my personality disorder."
Work hard, be yourself, have a life, and be serious about your commitment to orthopaedics. Good luck!
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DNA-RL said:
This might get me flamed, but your chances are very poor. I seriously don't mean to be rude, just realistic.
What are the risks of applying to ortho if you don't have a good chance of matching?
-To match, you pretty much need to go all out ortho in rotations and research
-If you don't match, you'll end up applying to another specialty with relatively no rotational or research experience in that field
-If you don't match, you'll apply to a second specialty with some excuse like "I thought about ortho but decided the lifestyle wasn't for me, that's why I never did any anesthesiology/EM rotations"
-If you're otherwise a high caliber applicant and don't match ortho, you may find that the high caliber programs of your backup aren't interested in ortho non-matchers and you may get stuck in a backup specialty in a backup location for a few years (this would add insult to injury).---this would be my biggest worry
For the above reasons, I couldn't in good conscience take a "go get 'em tiger" response to your query.
We interviewed maybe a dozen second-time applicants this year. All were MD. Most had scores at/better 80th percentile. None matched (here).
I wish you success in whatever you do.
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I don't at all mean to flame the above poster, but as a 2nd year DO student who may already have some connections to a DO friendly program, I don't think he's SOL. He just needs to get serious about his standardized test taking, speak with program directors/chairs about his chances and what he does/doesn't need to do to improve his outlook, and then, if his chances are better than a one-legged man in an a$$ kicking contest and he's still determined to give ortho a go, implement the changes, work the connections, and work his behind off 3rd and 4th year. I didn't say his chances were great (but even with people with 250+, AOA, and research don't match... so who's the final judge... definitely not you nor I) and indeed, after speaking with people and being realistic he may get a "no go" or "it's not worth it" answer and have to contemplate his future a little more... but he shouldn't give up at this point.
