Pay and Stuff

[appelsoranjes]

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So after 7 long years, I'll finally have my Ph.D. soon (in Clinical Psych). Just took a 2 year postdoc that pays peanuts (33k), turning down a "big money" (45k) postdoc that was one-year but had less intriguing opportunities. I'll be 32 soon, admittedly am pretty disappointed at the job market...most postings I see are offering 50-60k starting - especially since some friends who didnt even go to college are pulling in 100k+. I went into psychology for idealistic reasons, and thought it would be a comfortable living - but I guess that term is relative. Anyways, I've flirted with the idea of doing a post-bac and going to medical school... but maybe it's just the anxiety of entering the "real world"....

Anyways, not sure what I'm looking for...sympathy, encouragement, hope, reality checks....

Anyone think the mental health parity act is going to improve salary?

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Salaried positions by design will not be a great option for maximizing your income potential. I'll probably start at one, and then try and build my own path because squeaking out a living isn't what I want to do for a career.

 

[deleted176373]

So after 7 long years, I'll finally have my Ph.D. soon (in Clinical Psych). Just took a 2 year postdoc that pays peanuts (33k), turning down a "big money" (45k) postdoc that was one-year but had less intriguing opportunities. I'll be 32 soon, admittedly am pretty disappointed at the job market...most postings I see are offering 50-60k starting - especially since some friends who didnt even go to college are pulling in 100k+. I went into psychology for idealistic reasons, and thought it would be a comfortable living - but I guess that term is relative. Anyways, I've flirted with the idea of doing a post-bac and going to medical school... but maybe it's just the anxiety of entering the "real world"....

Anyways, not sure what I'm looking for...sympathy, encouragement, hope, reality checks....

Anyone think the mental health parity act is going to improve salary?

There is always the military. While the pay may seem less (starting basic pay is $43k per year) that does not include housing and food allowances which can be nearly 30k per year tax free (it's about 30k in the DC area, less in rural places like San Antonio, TX). They also have a very nice loan repayment program which will pay up to $30k per year (IIRC). So if you are getting 30k of loan repayment, 30k of housing, and 43k of salary, things look a lot less bleak at $100k of compensation.

Mark

 

[PsyDr]

1) define the day to day lifestyle you want. be realistic. spending 3 months in monte carlo is just not happening
2) determine exactly how much money is required for this lifestyle
3) create a business plan
4) save up enough money while working for someone to partially finance the start up costs
5) get a business loan with your business plan


bonus points if you add in what you'll need for retirement using a reputable calculator.

if you are interested in med school, you should do an opportunity cost + ROI analysis. you could end up losing money on the deal.

the parity bill is not going increase salary but it will increase income. i do not pay anyone more when an insurance plan reimburses at a higher rate than others.

 

[deleted176373]

1) define the day to day lifestyle you want. be realistic. spending 3 months in monte carlo is just not happening
2) determine exactly how much money is required for this lifestyle

Let me shorten the plan for those who want to live a more opulent lifestyle.

1) Define the day to day lifestyle you want. be realistic. spending 3 months in monte carlo is just not happening <- Maybe or maybe not with my 3 step plan.
2) Determine exactly how much money is required for this lifestyle.
3) Marry into it. (Don't tell me I'm sexist, it works for both men and women.)

This is a far easier path... sure, it's easier with your own trust fund.

Mark

 

[BamaPsych]

So I have no experience at all to comment here with, BUT, I agree with what you said about income being relative. I grew up in a family with nothing, am the first person to graduate with a BA let alone pursue a PhD...so a 60k salary to me sounds awesome 😀.

I have a dream career where I'm working 30-35 hours a week at my "real job" and teaching one class per semester to rake in some extra cash, enjoy teaching without pursuing a full-fledged academic career, and pay off my student loans if I have any! So specific I know..but I can dream right? 🙂

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

3) Marry into it. (Don't tell me I'm sexist, it works for both men and women.)

I jokingly have been saying this for years.

I'm not too worried about making good money, but it'd be a lot easier with some good seed money. 😀

 

[GiantSteps]

but it'd be a lot easier with some good seed money. 😀

T4C, you put you finger on it. "Seed money"! Intellectually gifted people like all of you, who are at top graduate schools, should sell your sperm and eggs for top dollar! People want smart and successful kids and are willing to pay for it.

 

[appelsoranjes]

So I have no experience at all to comment here with, BUT, I agree with what you said about income being relative. I grew up in a family with nothing, am the first person to graduate with a BA let alone pursue a PhD...so a 60k salary to me sounds awesome 😀.

I have a dream career where I'm working 30-35 hours a week at my "real job" and teaching one class per semester to rake in some extra cash, enjoy teaching without pursuing a full-fledged academic career, and pay off my student loans if I have any! So specific I know..but I can dream right? 🙂

If you go to a Ph.D. program you will have very little loans since most tend to fund with a tuition waver and stipend...and it's very realistic to work + adjunct teach on the side (adjuncting pays beans, so it would be for the love).

As far as relative salaries go, my old man is an Ob/Gyn and rakes in 500k (gross) a year... so my psychologist salary will always seem meager by comparison (aren't we supposed to do better than our fathers? maybe I have daddy issues in this realm). I guess being entrepreneurial is the ticket...

 

[appelsoranjes]

1) define the day to day lifestyle you want. be realistic. spending 3 months in monte carlo is just not happening
2) determine exactly how much money is required for this lifestyle
3) create a business plan
4) save up enough money while working for someone to partially finance the start up costs
5) get a business loan with your business plan


bonus points if you add in what you'll need for retirement using a reputable calculator.

if you are interested in med school, you should do an opportunity cost + ROI analysis. you could end up losing money on the deal.

the parity bill is not going increase salary but it will increase income. i do not pay anyone more when an insurance plan reimburses at a higher rate than others.

Thanks for the info... are you in private practice? If so, what are insurance reimbursement rates like, and where do you expect them to rise to?

 

[Olivia101884]

Or if you're into private practice, work in NYC where a significant amount of psychologists (and LCSWs) do not take insurance.

 

[deleted176373]

So I have no experience at all to comment here with, BUT, I agree with what you said about income being relative. I grew up in a family with nothing, am the first person to graduate with a BA let alone pursue a PhD...so a 60k salary to me sounds awesome 😀.

I have a dream career where I'm working 30-35 hours a week at my "real job" and teaching one class per semester to rake in some extra cash, enjoy teaching without pursuing a full-fledged academic career, and pay off my student loans if I have any! So specific I know..but I can dream right? 🙂

Congratulations... being the first to break that mold will likely help generations beyond you for a considerable time... Educated families tend to produce educated children who on average do better for themselves.

A good success story is always nice to hear.

Mark

 

[hereandnow]

_My perspective_

Life consists of time.

Discretionary time
is more important
than discretionary money.

--from my friend John Heider

 

[cara susanna]

My brother's a computer programmer and he makes more with a 4 year degree than I ever will even after grad school. Ah well. 😀

 

[Cosmo75]

My brother's a computer programmer and he makes more with a 4 year degree than I ever will even after grad school. Ah well. 😀

In my previous life, I made a good amount of cash working in IT. I was also miserable. I'll take less money in psych, if it comes to that, because I know this is where I want to be. I think I'm fortunate to have explored other careers before deciding to go back to psych. Money is not my primary motivator. Don't get me wrong, I want to be comfortable. But if that was all I cared about I'd still be writing code and cursing the corporate B.S.

 

[The Sonoran]

I'm not too worried about making good money, but it'd be a lot easier with some good seed money. 😀

If you're looking for seed money, I saw a morning television show today describing that one could make up to 14K/year being a sperm bank donor.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

In my previous life, I made a good amount of cash working in IT. I was also miserable. I'll take less money in psych, if it comes to that, because I know this is where I want to be. I think I'm fortunate to have explored other careers before deciding to go back to psych. Money is not my primary motivator. Don't get me wrong, I want to be comfortable. But if that was all I cared about I'd still be writing code and cursing the corporate B.S.

I too am a tech convert, and while it can pay well....the lifestyle definitely leaves something to be desired. I'm going to take my consulting knowledge, sprinkle in some clinical application, and ride this cash cow to early retirement.

It isn't that you can't make money as a psychologist....it is that most people aren't willing to step outside of the box and risk a bit to gain a lot.

 

[cara susanna]

There was an episode of The Big Bang Theory where the two main characters, who are genius physicists, were going to contribute to some "high IQ sperm donor" bank for cash.

 

[ladysky61]

My plan after I get my degree is to work in a high need clinic, make less but get tuition reimbursement. Supplement my income by teaching at the community college level or as an adjunct at a small liberals arts school (makes peanuts but I enjoy teaching). After a few years, work half-time with undeserved populations and part time with well-off clients and part time purposing writing (I wanna write memoirs and self-help books to bring CBT to the mainstream). My dream would also be to be on Oprah and have my own call in radio show. I also want to use my fame to lobby for people with mental illness.

I don't want to be the next Dr. Judy or Dr. Phil, but I definitely want to be a position to help as many people as possible.

Extremely idealistic I know.

 

[PsyDr]

appplesororanges,

i personally think that the reimbursement rates are fair. i think the rates will continue to keep pace with inflation.

making money in this area is real easy. you just put in the hours and get paid. you want to make more, you work more. what's even more ridiculous is that people want services at all times of day. 7 AM groups, 8PM therapy sessions and everything in between. if you work only 40hrs a week, you could net 200k. it's all a matter of getting the patient base and being willing to bust your ass.

as for not being enough. your father has apparently done very well for himself. last i looked the average OB income was something in the 200K range with what looks like a 50k standard deviation. i am going to guess that he works tons, ridiculous call schedule, etc. ask him how much he makes per hour when he is not performing a procedure. i'll bet it is close to your reimbursement rate. then ask him how many hours he works per week. physicians, unlike a lot of psychologists, are willing to work ridiculously long hours.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Groups can be a great revenue generator....I'd definitely suggest checking out this area out. I've tried to gain a lot of experience running a range of groups in preparation to make it part of my clinical practice.

45 minute group....$25/pp, 8 people: $200/session.

Running 2 groups a week will gross $16k/yr (40 wk schedule). There is little overhead if you use the same PP space, and if you do it in the right area you can run multiple types of groups. You can run psychoeducational, support, process.....not a bad gig.

 

[deleted190534]

I agree with what you said about income being relative. I grew up in a family with nothing, am the first person to graduate with a BA let alone pursue a PhD...so a 60k salary to me sounds awesome 😀.

Ditto here. First BA...first anything beyond. We were on welfare & all that fun stuff, so salary DEFINITELY is relative.

 

[psychmama]

T4c - I love groups and agree they can be a great source of revenue. The only catch is that they are a colossal pain to get started and coordinate due to the multiple variables. Gotta love groups though -- they are so....groupy!😀