PhD tittle while on the wards

[gonogo]

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I was just curious, do you use your PhD tittle while in the wards? meaning, do you have it on your ID? Was just wondering what was common. Here where I'm doing residency it seems like the norm that every ID just says MD, so I was wondering how others do it.

 

[xanthines]

As a student or resident? If you're an MSTP student in the 3rd/4th yrs of med school and you've got PhD on your ID, you're just asking for a beat-down.

If you're in residency and completed your degree, I don't think it really matters either way, but it should be your preference.

 

[z31]

Yikes! What could someone possibly gain from saying "Actually, call me Dr. X. Actually, don't! I know nothing directly relevant here."

 

[Neuronix]

I say student doctor all the time. Medical student gets me refused by some patients and raises a lot of eyebrows. People don't take me nearly as seriously. Now that I look older after my PhD I do find that I get a lot more respect, even if I don't put the PhD on my name badge.

I do plan on putting the PhD on later IDs and white coats if I can help it. I feel like Dr. Evil. I didn't spend 4 years in evil graduate school...

 

[gstrub]

For me it depends...

I mostly say "I'm so and so and I'm one of the medical students on the surgery service" if I'm meeting a family/patient for the first time and will be following them. I find that this establishes a good rapport, and it feels nice to hear people say "you're going to make a great doctor" or something similar on the occasion that happens.

If I'm calling on the phone for a lab result/radiology report/update from nurse/another hospital for records or info...then I'm DR. so and so from surgery. That gets sh"*t done.

About the ID...if you are still a M3 student and have PhD on your ID or, worse, lab coat, you are a complete toolbox. As an intern, you should (if you like) have M.D./Ph.D on your coat.

 

[Shifty B]

I'm currently a resident and my coat and badge both have only MD on them. Not because it was my preference or anything, but they just printed all the ones for my department the same. Honestly, it doesn't matter, because the patients don't care about your PhD. The only people who notice are other doctors.

If I have a medical student with me, I usually introduce them as, "Doctor X, one of the medical students at our institution".

I realize it's giving an extra credential to the students, but I find that the patients understand it a little better than "student-doctor" or just your first name. So many people come through those rooms in a day the patients get confused about who's part of the physician team.

 

[nomogram3]

We have "MD/PhD 20xx" with our graduation year on our badges when we go back for MS3, but don't receive any degrees until graduation so we technically aren't doctors. This was the program's decision, so my director is a toolbox that's your opinion. If you are the type of person who will take bull**** from residents and attendings for being an MD/PhD and have some kind of complex about it, then you need to get over it. No one cares what degree you have as an MS3, you are there to learn how to take care of patients just like all of the other med students, and that's how you will be measured.

 

[gonogo]

Thanks for your replies. I more meant as a resident, not as MS3 or 4. Just as with Shifty B in the post above, my program made the badges all with the MD on it. I was just wondering how it was with others, whether it was worth having them changed with the MD/PhD. I guess it would involve bringing the original PhD diploma or a copy to the office in charge. I really don't care too much about the tittle either, except that sometimes I feel the PhD was a lot work for not even carrying the tittle with me!

 

[QofQuimica]

Thanks for your replies. I more meant as a resident, not as MS3 or 4. Just as with Shifty B in the post above, my program made the badges all with the MD on it. I was just wondering how it was with others, whether it was worth having them changed with the MD/PhD. I guess it would involve bringing the original PhD diploma or a copy to the office in charge. I really don't care too much about the tittle either, except that sometimes I feel the PhD was a lot work for not even carrying the tittle with me!

I would leave well enough alone. The MD is the degree that is relevant to your work in the hospital, and why would you want to go out of your way to draw attention to yourself when none of the other MD/PhDs at your institution have the PhD on their ID tags?

Also, the word is *title*. I'm just telling you this because I'm guessing that you're a non-native speaker of English, and a tittle is something that you would most certainly not want on your ID. See definition #2. 😳

 

[pdz]

Follow quimica's advice and don't ever have phd on your id badge. Phds are considered losers by most mds.

 

[dmblue]

I would leave well enough alone. The MD is the degree that is relevant to your work in the hospital, and why would you want to go out of your way to draw attention to yourself when none of the other MD/PhDs at your institution have the PhD on their ID tags?

Also, the word is *title*. I'm just telling you this because I'm guessing that you're a non-native speaker of English, and a tittle is something that you would most certainly not want on your ID. See definition #2. 😳

I, the other hand, would like the i to be dotted on my name. If they don't put the tittle on my badge, I will complain.

 

[calvinNhobbes]

Phds are considered losers by most mds.

Really? 😕

Not my experience. Most MD attendings in the academic setting that I've spoken with state they are intimidated when it comes to PhDs. Moreover, the ones that think PhDs are "losers" tend to simply be expressing their inferiority complex via arrogance.

 

[Shifty B]

So, I've never been considered a loser by an attending, at least not because I have a PhD. Maybe for other reasons....

Granted, it's not on my badge/coat but it usually comes up after I've worked with the same team for a couple of weeks. Usually the first response is surprise because I look fairly young. Then, second they usually will pleasantly address me about research and whatever their research interest are. In my experience people have been respectful of my experience.

It is possible that people may prejudge you as being a certain type of person, but has not been a problem for me.

 

[calvinNhobbes]

From my experience, when it comes to anything that could be categorized as "basic science" it is not only assumed I know it, but that I know it better than anyone without a PhD. Of course that is rarely true unless it happend to be in my area of research, but it did get me out of a lot of potentially embarassing pimping sessions. 😀

Attending/resident: cNh, do you know why blah blah basic science question is important.
cNh (totally lost and day dreaming, stares blankly like a deer in the head lights): 😕
Attending/resident: Oh wait, you have a PhD, of course you know it's because of blah blah. Ok, let's move on to the next patient.

 

[QofQuimica]

Follow quimica's advice and don't ever have phd on your id badge. Phds are considered losers by most mds.

Thanks for your support, but hyperbole in the other direction isn't necessary to bring home the point. 😛

I, the other hand, would like the i to be dotted on my name. If they don't put the tittle on my badge, I will complain.

Now *this* is a just cause that I can support whole-heartedly. It breaks my heart to think about how many innocent i's have suffered throughout history due to someone neglecting to dot them. Who else is with us here?

 

[Neuronix]

I get far more flack from PhDs for being an MD than I get from MDs for being a PhD.

The worst I get from MDs is that I may not remember the clinical side as well or be as strong clinically as a pure MD. "All our worst residents have been MD/PhD, so you need to be just as strong as the MDs clinically" is probably the worst thing I've ever heard. Even people who don't believe in the whole physician-scientist thing will often say, "well, at least you have no debt! That's a pretty smart move!"

Yeesh from the PhDs...
"MDs are taught to memorize, not think."
"Medical students can't do research."
"All MDs who do research are bozos, including MD/PhDs."
"MD,PhD really means MD and MS."
"You can't do both, so don't even try."

 

[nomogram3]

"All our worst residents have been MD/PhD, so you need to be just as strong as the MDs clinically"

I laugh every time I hear this, and gently remind attendings/fellows/residents that the chairs of most well-known departments of medicine are researchers who have labs, whether they have PhDs or not. Obviously they must be clinically incompetent.

 

[calvinNhobbes]

"You can't do both, so don't even try."

This one is my favorite. It took me a awhile to figure out it really means:
"I couldn't do both, and since I am so arrogant and believe no one could possible do something I couldn't, you also can't do it."

 

[Brunette1981]

On a slightly related note, I would never call myself Dr. on the wards (as an M3/M4) because of my PhD. It's not relevant to the setting and it's misleading.

On the other hand, I do usually do the whole "Student Doctor LastName" thing because it grates on me to call the patients Mr. SoandSo or Ms. SoandSo while they call me by my first name. Why do I get less respect than they do? And it keeps the relationship formal/professional as it should be.

What do you guys think? Do you like patients calling you "Matt" or "Mary" as an M3/M4? Or not care?

 

[EMMudphud]

I don't care if they call me by my first name when I do have both the MD and the PhD in a couple months. I'll still call them Mr. or Mrs X. I had an attending/advisor who was a Hughes investigator, full professor, MD PhD etc who always had everyone call him by his first name. I liked it and his patients all seemed to love him. I'll probably model after that.

 

[gorgias]

My school recently stopped putting PhD on the badges of returning students. I believe this was because of one student who returned to the wards insisted that everyone call him Dr. in the hospital because he had a PhD. This evidently annoyed the housestaff and attendings.

People who know I have a PhD occasionally address me as Dr. but I don't really care either way. I have also had many people ask why, if I have a PhD, my badge does not say so.

I have never had anyone look down on me or belittle me for taking the time to go to grad school. At worst I get bafflement or indifference. Many physicians seem too wrapped up in self-importance to feign any interest in what the medical students around them have to say. The funniest ones are those who clearly do not understand that transmission of knowledge can be bi-directional.

 

[Neuronix]

I don't care if they call me by my first name when I do have both the MD and the PhD in a couple months. I'll still call them Mr. or Mrs X. I had an attending/advisor who was a Hughes investigator, full professor, MD PhD etc who always had everyone call him by his first name. I liked it and his patients all seemed to love him. I'll probably model after that.

👍 This is my goal as well.