Physics while taking calculus for 1st time?

[1AO KTG]

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Professors say to make sure you are at least in calculus when taking calculus based physics. The thing I'm wondering about is the "at least part". I feel like that might not be sufficient enough. Is it a better idea to take calculus before physics vs at the same time? It seems like things may end up going a little too fast in physics which is calculus based, no matter how well the student is doing in the calculus course. The thing is, I really want to take them both at the same time to make things go smooth as far as moving forward in finishing all my prerequisites in the right semester. However I really dont want to set myself up to get anything less than an A in both physics classes. Has anyone gotten an A's in both courses when taking calc for the first time?

 

[typicalindian]

I have not taken calc based physics but I have taken calc, you definitely want to take calc before taking physics because I'm pretty sure some of the calc used in physics requires integrals which isn't taught until the later (2nd half) of most calculus 1 courses. Unless your willing to teach yourself why not just take algebra based physics? If you don't take algebra based physics I strongly recommend you take calc based physics after you have taken calc...just my 2 cents

 

[1AO KTG]

I have not taken calc based physics but I have taken calc, you definitely want to take calc before taking physics because I'm pretty sure some of the calc used in physics requires integrals which isn't taught until the later (2nd half) of most calculus 1 courses. Unless your willing to teach yourself why not just take algebra based physics? If you don't take algebra based physics I strongly recommend you take calc based physics after you have taken calc...just my 2 cents

Yeah but I thought it was pretty essential for pre meds and most science majors to take the calculus based.

 

[mauberley]

Yeah but I thought it was pretty essential for pre meds and most science majors to take the calculus based.

The advice I've heard on SDN is to take algebra-based physics unless you are strong in calculus (implied if you're a physics, engineering, or math major). When viewed on AMCAS, calc-based/non-calc-based is not conveyed in the course title, nor is it asked about anywhere that I'm familiar with.

 

[1AO KTG]

The advice I've heard on SDN is to take algebra-based physics unless you are strong in calculus (implied if you're a physics, engineering, or math major). When viewed on AMCAS, calc-based/non-calc-based is not conveyed in the course title, nor is it asked about anywhere that I'm familiar with.

The case is closed with that reply, thanks

 

[V5RED]

At my school, it would be unwise to take calculus based physics until you have already taken calculus.

My reasons:
-Some problems we are given on exams require the ability to use calculus.

-Some equations are not given since you are supposed to be able to derive them from what you are given.

-You will always feel like there is a gap in your knowledge, so solving problems will be difficult since you will wonder if the solution is based on math you don't know.

 

[deleted393595]

Professors say to make sure you are at least in calculus when taking calculus based physics. The thing I'm wondering about is the "at least part". I feel like that might not be sufficient enough. Is it a better idea to take calculus before physics vs at the same time? It seems like things may end up going a little too fast in physics which is calculus based, no matter how well the student is doing in the calculus course. The thing is, I really want to take them both at the same time to make things go smooth as far as moving forward in finishing all my prerequisites in the right semester. However I really dont want to set myself up to get anything less than an A in both physics classes. Has anyone gotten an A's in both courses when taking calc for the first time?

The calc you use in physics is really basic. It's just simple derivatives, which you'll learn in the first few weeks of Calc class. There might be more complex stuff like u-substitution, but I don't think that they'll throw that at you in Physics 101. It'll probably be saved for 102.

You seem like a pretty smart guy so I don't think that the Calc is going to be a problem for you.

The advice I've heard on SDN is to take algebra-based physics unless you are strong in calculus (implied if you're a physics, engineering, or math major). When viewed on AMCAS, calc-based/non-calc-based is not conveyed in the course title, nor is it asked about anywhere that I'm familiar with.

🙁 Taking the calc out of it takes all the fun out of it.

 

[Slev]

x

 

[typicalindian]

This was my experience. I took Phyisics I and Calc I concurrently and it was fine. Since your school allows it, I'm sure the Physics professor is aware that some people are taking the classes concurrently.

yea but if he doesn't have to take calc based physics for his major he should probably just stay away from it all together. He thought it was better for pre meds to take calc based physics when it actually isn't.

 

[mauberley]

🙁 Taking the calc out of it takes all the fun out of it.

Nowhere was the OP asking about fun. 😛

I would be the first in line to testify about how learning physics without calculus is taking things on faith, but let's be pragmatic here.

 

[Ismet]

I took Calc 1 and 2 concurrently with Calc-based Physics 1 and 2. No problems whatsoever!

 

[deleted393595]

I would be the first in line to testify about how learning physics without calculus is taking things on faith, but let's be pragmatic here.

True, but a little bit of fun goes a long way!

yea but if he doesn't have to take calc based physics for his major he should probably just stay away from it all together. He thought it was better for pre meds to take calc based physics when it actually isn't.

True. The algebra based route may yield higher grades.

I took Calc 1 and 2 concurrently with Calc-based Physics 1 and 2. No problems whatsoever!

Well, that's because you're the Doctor 😛

 

[FictiousForce]

Calculus serves to provide the conceptual foundation for Physics, and therefore is essential for a proper introduction to the subject.

Taking algebra based Physics will result in a more frustrating experience because the tools necessary will be absent and will be replaced with sketchy work-arounds and lackluster exposition.

The level of Calculus required is really only the first few weeks of a semester, and not much beyond that. The actual calculus is not the important part, it's the concepts used in calculus that are used to describe physical phenomena.

Ideally, you should have taken Calc 1 before Physics, but you can take them concurrently if you have been exposed to some form of Calculus before.

 

[mauberley]

True, but a little bit of fun goes a long way!

Med school prereqs are SERIOUS BUSINESS. 😉

Taking algebra based Physics will result in a more frustrating experience because the tools necessary will be absent and will be replaced with sketchy work-arounds and lackluster exposition.

That's a rather grand assertion. My guess is there would be a nontrivial number of people who had no problems with algebra-based physics. Realize that what might be sketchy or lackluster to you may be perfectly acceptable or sensible to another.

 

[IMSingular]

...
🙁 Taking the calc out of it takes all the fun out of it.

Faraday did all his physics without knowledge of cal. He didn't even write down a math equation, though he wrote them in English. I am pretty certain Faraday had lot of fun doing physics.

 

[deleted393595]

Med school prereqs are SERIOUS BUSINESS. 😉

But I'm the kind of guy who likes mixing business with pleasure 😉

That's a rather grand assertion. My guess is there would be a nontrivial number of people who had no problems with algebra-based physics. Realize that what might be sketchy or lackluster to you may be perfectly acceptable or sensible to another.

I think that a lot of Algebra based physics is simplified to the point where it's understandable. You won't be deriving Gauss's law, but you'll be doing V=IR calculations for circuits and what not.

Faraday did all his physics without knowledge of cal. He didn't even write down a math equation, though he wrote them in English. I am pretty certain Faraday had lot of fun doing physics.

Lies! Faraday was bored to death because he had no idea why his experiments were going the way they were. On the other hand, Maxwell was in a state of permanent ecstasy.

 

[MongrelDr]

At the end of the day OP, algebra based calc is the easier option and will solve your just-incase-something-comes-up-later-on-in-calc I-that-you-need-earlier-in-calc-based-physics problem.
But it's up to you if your strong in maths and think calc won't be an issue, go for it! I did algebra based and never had to input specifically which physics I took nor was I ever asked anything about it. Either way, taking the two together will make for a lot of homework 🙁 Good Luck

 

[IMSingular]

..

Lies! Faraday was bored to death because he had no idea why his experiments were going the way they were. On the other hand, Maxwell was in a state of permanent ecstasy.

Maxwell on Farady:

"It is of great advantage to the student of any subject to read the original memoirs on that subject, for science is always most completely assimilated when it is in the nascent state, and in the case of Faraday's Researches this is comparatively easy, as they are published in a separate form, and may be read consecutively. If by anything I have here written I may assist any student in understanding Faraday's modes of thought and expression, I shall regard it as the accomplishment of one of my principal aims — to communicate to others the same delight which I have found myself in reading Faraday's Researches."

If Maxwell had such a delight in Faraday's researches I would doubt Faraday didn't have fun and delight in discovering those things before anyone.

 

[varsityblue]

I think that you can do well in a calculus-based physics course without first taking calculus as long as you're comfortable with derivatives and limits when you walk in. Study a few Khan Academy videos before the term starts and I'm sure you'll be fine.

 

[centrigeugle]

Take physics without calculus -> same material as the MCAT, and it's much easier. It should be an easy A, as far as I'm concerned.

Take calculus I, because it's not that hard, and the MCAT loves to screw with you using acceleration/displacement/velocity graphs that require some fundamental knowledge of derivatives to really understand.

 

[deleted393595]

If Maxwell had such a delight in Faraday's researches I would doubt Faraday didn't have fun and delight in discovering those things before anyone.

Nah. I bet Maxwell said that to be nice, but in his head he was probably thinking, "I pity the fool!"

 

[IMSingular]

Nah. I bet Maxwell said that to be nice, but in his head he was probably thinking, "I pity the fool!"

Well even if you are right Maxwell's comment was delight to Faraday.