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Option A: Mid-career (15 years experience) fellowship-trained in pain. Married with two kids. Worked brief stint in academia, then locums for a number of years, then a couple gigs with various large health systems. No true PP experience. Competent in all interventional modalities, but rather opinionated with possibly an exaggerated sense of self-worth. Spent 30 mins in interview talking about a "conspiracy" at last job involving unfounded allegations made about a HIPPA violation. At the end of dinner, gets into the passenger side (spouse drives) of a late model Subaru that has a Bernie Sanders bumper sticker on it.

Option B: New grad who recently completed a high procedural volume fellowship in "Sports and Spine." Broadly trained in most procedures, but lacks experience in some areas. Went to work for the fellowship director and now seeking new opportunity in different part of the country. Seems eager to please with good, strong work ethic. Socially agreeable and malleable. Recently engaged to a drug rep. No kids. Checks cell phone frequently during dinner and left table twice to talk to significant other who was pre-occupied with a sick dog (Doberman) at home. Drives an Acura ILX.
 

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Option A: Mid-career (15 years experience) fellowship-trained in pain. Married with two kids. Worked brief stint in academia, then locums for a number of years, then a couple gigs with various large health systems. No true PP experience. Competent in all interventional modalities, but rather opinionated with possibly an exaggerated sense of self-worth. Spent 30 mins in interview talking about a "conspiracy" at last job involving unfounded allegations made about a HIPPA violation. At the end of dinner, gets into the passenger side (spouse drives) of a late model Subaru that has a Bernie Sanders bumper sticker on it.

Option B: New grad who recently completed a high procedural volume fellowship in "Sports and Spine." Broadly trained in most procedures, but lacks experience in some areas. Went to work for the fellowship director and now seeking new opportunity in different part of the country. Seems eager to please with good, strong work ethic. Socially agreeable and malleable. Recently engaged to a drug rep. No kids. Checks cell phone frequently during dinner and left table twice to talk to significant other who was pre-occupied with a sick dog (Doberman) at home. Drives an Acura ILX.

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Option A is totally off the table unless you're looking for drama.

Option B is undervalued by others and himself due to his non-accredited fellowship. I would look at online reviews with a critical eye. If they say, "he kept checking his phone during the interview", it could be a problem.

If everything else checks out, he could be an excellent choice. It would be nice to meet his neurotic wife if possible...
 
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Aether2000

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Surely there must be an option C...... Both A and B will pose problems for you. Option A will be a nightmare of professional drama- most career minded doctors in their prime will not do locums long term- that in itself is a red flag of instability. The opinionated part may be more problematic- suggesting lack of flexibility that is a necessary part of private practice. Option B is most concerning because they were checking their phone during the interview, strongly suggesting your time and the time they would spend in medical practice is less valuable to them than external events and their private life. While this may be a millennial trait, it is also a harbinger of things to come in the future when you will be left doing their work when they have to take off for girlfriend's sick dogs, anti-Trump marches, or whatever the doctor deems more important than a career on a given day.
 

SSdoc33

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Surely there must be an option C...... Both A and B will pose problems for you. Option A will be a nightmare of professional drama- most career minded doctors in their prime will not do locums long term- that in itself is a red flag of instability. The opinionated part may be more problematic- suggesting lack of flexibility that is a necessary part of private practice. Option B is most concerning because they were checking their phone during the interview, strongly suggesting your time and the time they would spend in medical practice is less valuable to them than external events and their private life. While this may be a millennial trait, it is also a harbinger of things to come in the future when you will be left doing their work when they have to take off for girlfriend's sick dogs, anti-Trump marches, or whatever the doctor deems more important than a career on a given day.

i wouldnt put too much stock in the car they drive

if i had to choose one, i would choose the latter. however, he would be more likely to bolt after a short amount of time due to the lack of kids and needy wife.

if possible, try to find someone with oregon roots and who isnt a complete social idiot. if it is a younger doc, who is at least bright, they should be able to learn on the fly and improve procedure skills with time.
 

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Option b is not terrible. The sports and spine training may bring another dynamic to your practice. Yes he won't be doing celiac plexus blocks and managing cancer pain for you but how much of that do you need? Being a millennial is not great but at least he's a millennial male. If he has an older sibling may not be too bad. Can't fault the guy entirely for having to deal with his wife's meltdown. We've all been there at one point or another. Agree if he is attached to his phone it's a problem but this is also the world we live in now to a degree and transcends generations. Agree with keep looking for option c though...
 

Ligament

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Option A: Mid-career (15 years experience) fellowship-trained in pain. Married with two kids. Worked brief stint in academia, then locums for a number of years, then a couple gigs with various large health systems. No true PP experience. Competent in all interventional modalities, but rather opinionated with possibly an exaggerated sense of self-worth. Spent 30 mins in interview talking about a "conspiracy" at last job involving unfounded allegations made about a HIPPA violation. At the end of dinner, gets into the passenger side (spouse drives) of a late model Subaru that has a Bernie Sanders bumper sticker on it.

Option B: New grad who recently completed a high procedural volume fellowship in "Sports and Spine." Broadly trained in most procedures, but lacks experience in some areas. Went to work for the fellowship director and now seeking new opportunity in different part of the country. Seems eager to please with good, strong work ethic. Socially agreeable and malleable. Recently engaged to a drug rep. No kids. Checks cell phone frequently during dinner and left table twice to talk to significant other who was pre-occupied with a sick dog (Doberman) at home. Drives an Acura ILX.

Option A is a socialist who wants you to become slave to the government under single payer, who wants you to pay even more taxes, etc etc. That bumper sticker is grade A evidence that he will be bad for your private practice business...in fact he is fundamentally opposed to any private practice and especially to self-pay private practice. The Suburu is a soft red flag, but not as bad as the Bernie sticker.

Option B sounds good, maybe the dog was critically ill and wife was freaking out? Still not good to check phone during interview dinner, but may not be too bad overall. Maybe wife is unstable and will be a mental drain on him as an employee...?
 
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Aether2000

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Option B does not have a wife. He has a girlfriend who has a sick dog that caused him to lose interest and focus in the interview. Although B is definitely better than A, C may be better than either. Why accept the questionable when there are other candidates that have the common sense to not check their phones several times during the interview (may have been checking other offers, his stock report, the next LBGT march location, or sexting).
 
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drpainfree

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I would never consider a guy/gal who would check phones several times during a job interview...regardless how well trained, bright, skilled, charming s/he is.
 
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I would want more info to see if this is a one time thing. Also the setting, if there are 8 people at dinner, that's different than making me sit and wait for him to return.

But if it's a relatively minor breach of etiquette, and the guy has outstanding references and no other flags, I wouldn't write him off.

Obviously would prefer official pain training in a new grad, mostly for confidence/coverage. But if he'll do every LESI and peripheral joint for 30% less, there might be a place for him...
 

Ducttape

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I'd be a little concerned too about option b inasmuch as why, in this day or age, did he not do an ACGME fellowship? Not a deal breaker, but I'd just look in to whether he did try to get in but wasn't qualified....

Too much drama with #1, but I suspect that #2 will not hang out too long...

Why not hire geauxg8rs?


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If you don't have the respect to stay off your phone during a dinner/interview, definitely a no go in my book
 

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If you don't have the respect to stay off your phone during a dinner/interview, definitely a no go in my book

Superficially I agree with the general feeling of the candidates. I will say that if it had theoretically been the case where candidate B said that there was a personal matter going on that he had to keep tabs on, apologized in advance if he appeared to be distracted by his phone but assured that he was wholeheartedly engaged in the evening, and said he may have to step out to take a couple calls, I would be understanding. I wouldn't have to know what it is unless they were at liberty to say, though a needy GF with a sick dog would be a big no for me if they shared that. I would also expect another apology, and a "thank you for being understanding" at the conclusion of the night.

With regards to the non-ACGME, important to hash out why and get a sense for the program, but I have met some very poor ACGME trained and excellent non-ACGME pain physicians
 

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Option A: Mid-career (15 years experience) fellowship-trained in pain. Married with two kids. Worked brief stint in academia, then locums for a number of years, then a couple gigs with various large health systems. No true PP experience. Competent in all interventional modalities, but rather opinionated with possibly an exaggerated sense of self-worth. Spent 30 mins in interview talking about a "conspiracy" at last job involving unfounded allegations made about a HIPPA violation. At the end of dinner, gets into the passenger side (spouse drives) of a late model Subaru that has a Bernie Sanders bumper sticker on it.

Option B: New grad who recently completed a high procedural volume fellowship in "Sports and Spine." Broadly trained in most procedures, but lacks experience in some areas. Went to work for the fellowship director and now seeking new opportunity in different part of the country. Seems eager to please with good, strong work ethic. Socially agreeable and malleable. Recently engaged to a drug rep. No kids. Checks cell phone frequently during dinner and left table twice to talk to significant other who was pre-occupied with a sick dog (Doberman) at home. Drives an Acura ILX.

No on Option A: Does not seem like he would be pragmatic or diplomatic. Some of the vitriol on this forum, imagine that coming out face-to-face in your office.

Option B: Not sure. You stated eager to please with good, strong work ethic, but the checking cell phone frequently and leaving the table twice is a little odd. Potentially unfocused, flaky, or maybe some personality quirks you haven't fully seen yet. If you're still considering Option B, maybe invite him out to spend a couple days in clinic/procedures with you, so you can get a better look.
 
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Pacman27

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Always show up time or early.

If you are truly interested in something give it 100% of your focus
 
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