Plan B Schools?

[2bMD]

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What do you all think about the Caribbean schools? If you are older, and less likely to get in a US school are the Caribbean schools a viable option?

If these schools get you to the same goal should you just work on admission to these, or still shoot for US admissions and have offshore as a plan B?

 

[idq1i]

Solution: work your a$s off = no need for plan B

 

[TTSD]

Caribbean Schools are a viable selection if you don't want one of the more competitive slots like Optho, Ortho or Derm. But if you wish to do FP, IM, ER, Surgery, Psych, etc.. Caribbean schools are perfectly fine, just don't count too heavily on getting your first pick for Residency unless you do some @$$-kicking and @$$-licking.

You also want to be sure of the caliber of school you pick. Some have shady records, and some are not licensed in all 50 states. The Top Three are: St. George, Ross and AUC.

Personally though, just to share, if I fail to gain admittance to a US school I'm heading down.. the kicker is if I take a Masters or such, I'm pretty sure my chances will be greatly improved. But what all my ECs have taught me is if I have to stay for at least a year doing more lab reseach I will go homicidal.. so there we are.

 

[Apparition]

Carribean schools are fine if you're not considering a very competitive specialty. But you should still apply to US schools, the process is known to be unpredictable. So just apply to both.

 

[oldtimer]

Carribean schools would be the very last option I would consider. I've heard too many horror stories where people couldn't get residencies. You don't get much respect from the US medical community if you go to one of those schools. I'm not saying it's impossible if you're from a Carribean school. However, I think that you're setting yourself on a much more difficult road to reach your end goal. Consider reapplying after you've beefed up your application or DO schools. For more information, you should check out the International forum to get a better idea of what it's like to go to one of these schools.

 

[MeowMix]

Originally posted by 2bMD
If you are older, and less likely to get in a US school are the Caribbean schools a viable option?

If you are over 60, then age might be a concern. Otherwise, there are already US schools that have accepted students in your age group.

 

[modelcitizen]

I'm considering deferring a DO acceptance, and reapplying to SGU and Ross. Their residency placements (for SGU and Ross) aren't too shabby.

 

[hilikus]

my cousin and his wife went to a school in the DR...he's a nephrology fellow at mayo and she's a pediatrician...

i think if you show you what it takes and mix a little ass kissing in there you should have no problems

 

[bubbajones]

Man you have to be loaded to go to a carribean school. I heard they dont give much financial at whatsoever and tuition can range from 30k on up.

Can you get a HPSP scholarship at a carribean school? just curious

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by bubbajones
Man you have to be loaded to go to a carribean school. I heard they dont give much financial at whatsoever and tuition can range from 30k on up.

Can you get a HPSP scholarship at a carribean school? just curious

No, you can get fed aid (through fafsa) at a number of the carib schools. SGU is outrageous, but Ross is relatively cheap.
I don't know about HPSP.

 

[2bMD]

As a follow up to the original question here, would a Caribbean MD be as good or better than a US DO?

 

[modelcitizen]

some better, some worse.
best to compare residency placements and USMLE board scores/pass rates when choosing.

(and always keep in mind that this site is enormously DO-heavy; they'll come out of the woodwork for these posts. check valuemd.com for an IMG-heavy board).

 

[Cowboy DO]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
I'm considering deferring a DO acceptance, and reapplying to SGU and Ross. Their residency placements (for SGU and Ross) aren't too shabby.

I think you should from other posts by you I have read, you would not be happy with the letters DO behind your name.

As a follow up to the original question here, would a Caribbean MD be as good or better than a US DO?

Depends on who you ask.

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by Cowboy DO
I think you should from other posts by you I have read, you would not be happy with the letters DO behind your name.

Agreed. But it's not so much the letters, it's the OMM crap. I'll likely be miserable for at least 10hrs/wk. But I have no other choice at this time.🙁

 

[Cowboy DO]

doubly agreed, you probably will be then. I personally like OMM, I might never use it unless I go into FP, which I probaby wont. But the girlfriend loves it, and so do some of my other friends. I also like getting it done to me. However there are some students here that dislike it, and that probably is a huge drag on them even though, respectively, OMM is the easiest thing to learn here. If you are really uncertain about it, take the year off , alot of people delay applying to medical school. You may be happier in the end.

 

[modelcitizen]

I think you're right. A year off would probably be best, and that's what I'll likely do. Another option I'm considering is starting at the DO school and then transferring to a MD school. My understanding is that the OMM stuff is fairly light the first year and then gets more involved later.

I realize no US MD schools would ever allow this, but I think SGU/Ross might go for it. But if they won't accept the credit, then there's really no point. I'm checking with them on this.

So, you enjoy OMM for how it feels? This is precisely why I would hate it so much. Sounds too much like a vocational (e.g., massage therapy) school. But to each his own, I guess.

 

[oceandocDO]

Agreed. But it's not so much the letters, it's the OMM crap. I'll likely be miserable for at least 10hrs/wk. But I have no other choice at this time

Just wondering... what do you think of physical therapy? Have you ever had it or needed it? Because 80% of OMM is physical therapy, many of the foundational techniques even have the same names, and it's funny how the allopathic world is insistent on getting everyone PT but OMM scares the crap out of everyone.

I didnt go into osteopathic medicine for the OMM particularly, but now that I've been in the clinical world for a bit, patients friggin love it. Most of the time they dont even know what you're doing to them, but to have a doctor sit down with them and physically touch them for 5-10 minutes straight makes a huge impression. It's another tool in the bag, end of story, and i'm honestly glad i have the tool...

 

[Cowboy DO]

So, you enjoy OMM for how it feels? This is precisely why I would hate it so much. Sounds too much like a vocational (e.g., massage therapy) school. But to each his own, I guess.

Whats wrong with that, Im sure thats why some people like it (just having it done to them even though there is nothing wrong with them,ie massages). I dont know whats the problem or misleading with OMM "feeling good" though, thats what its supposed to do. taking tylenol "feels good" when you have a headache. I have a bad back, after OMM it's considerably better, thats why I like it.

 

[modelcitizen]

Here are a couple differences:
1. Tylenol relieves pain in a measurable way in blind, controlled studies, whereas OMM appears to be more analogous to a sugar pill. Tell patients that you're a doctor and give them a pink sugar pill; tell them that this pink pill will make them feel better and it will. They'll feel just as good as if they had an OMT "adjustment."

2. The prescribing of sugar pills isn't a central tenet of any medical school. There's no b.s. "sugar pill philosophy" that one must embrace to attend.

 

[DrMom]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
I think you're right. A year off would probably be best, and that's what I'll likely do. Another option I'm considering is starting at the DO school and then transferring to a MD school. My understanding is that the OMM stuff is fairly light the first year and then gets more involved later.

I realize no US MD schools would ever allow this, but I think SGU/Ross might go for it. But if they won't accept the credit, then there's really no point. I'm checking with them on this.

So, you enjoy OMM for how it feels? This is precisely why I would hate it so much. Sounds too much like a vocational (e.g., massage therapy) school. But to each his own, I guess.

Don't take a space in an Osteopathic school with this kind of attitude towards Osteopathic Medicine.

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by DrMom
Don't take a space in an Osteopathic school with this kind of attitude towards Osteopathic Medicine.

You don't think the evidence that's presented at OSU that this OMM stuff is the bomb will sway me? They say the best protestants are former catholics...

 

[drusso]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
You don't think the evidence that's presented at OSU that this OMM stuff is the bomb will sway me? They say the best protestants are former catholics...

You might want to try contributing to the OMM journal club in the osteopathic forum.

 

[wholehealth]

Hey Model Citizen,
Perhaps your attitude and closed mind is part of your MD 'acceptance issue'... How ironic would it be if you only ever get accepted to a DO school after all of this bad mouthing.

 

[modelcitizen]

You know, I really did consider that. But I'm afraid those papers aren't meant to be read with much of a critical eye.

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by wholehealth
Hey Model Citizen,
Perhaps your attitude and closed mind is part of your MD 'acceptance issue'... How ironic would it be if you only ever get accepted to a DO school after all of this bad mouthing.

It wouldn't be ironic at all because that's exactly the situation I'm in -- only holding a DO acceptance. Irony refers to a difference between the actual result and the expected result. I fully anticipate not being accepted to an MD school this year.

 

[Optimist]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
Here are a couple differences:
1. Tylenol relieves pain in a measurable way in blind, controlled studies, whereas OMM appears to be more analogous to a sugar pill. Tell patients that you're a doctor and give them a pink sugar pill; tell them that this pink pill will make them feel better and it will. They'll feel just as good as if they had an OMT "adjustment."

Have you ever had a massage? If so you wouldn't think that the good feeling you have is purely psychological.

 

[Cowboy DO]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
Here are a couple differences:
1. Tylenol relieves pain in a measurable way in blind, controlled studies, whereas OMM appears to be more analogous to a sugar pill. Tell patients that you're a doctor and give them a pink sugar pill; tell them that this pink pill will make them feel better and it will. They'll feel just as good as if they had an OMT "adjustment."

I already posted a new thread with this. Just because I thought it was funny. But I cant resist drawing a comparison now, by your logic if we shouldnt use OMM, we shouldnt use parachutes either.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...ve&db=Pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=14684649

Ok but thats enough, this doesn't belong in the pre-allo forum.

 

[Sweet Tea]

Originally posted by DrMom
Don't take a space in an Osteopathic school with this kind of attitude towards Osteopathic Medicine.

Honestly, I wouldn't want them in an Allopathic school either with that kind of attitude towards other health professionals.

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by Sweet Tea
Honestly, I wouldn't want them in an Allopathic school either with that kind of attitude towards other health professionals.

you mean all skeptical and not buying into every load of crap that is thrown their way? i'm with you. those crazy science-types -- who needs 'em?!

 

[2bMD]

I did not mean to start a debate here, I just had some questions. I appreciate your responses though, and I will try to keep them in mind. The DO verses Caribbean MD for plan B seems to be something of a controversy. I take it as:

A) US MD
B) US DO
C) Offshore MD

Anyone disagree?

 

[modelcitizen]

that looks about right. i'd put sgu/ross above all do schools. and auc above certain do schools.

 

[bubbajones]

HOW COMPETITIVE IS IT TO GET AN ER OR PEDS RESIDENCY IF U GRADUATE FROM A SCHOOL IN THE CARRIBEANS?

 

[bullhorn]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
I think you're right. A year off would probably be best, and that's what I'll likely do. Another option I'm considering is starting at the DO school and then transferring to a MD school. My understanding is that the OMM stuff is fairly light the first year and then gets more involved later.

I realize no US MD schools would ever allow this, but I think SGU/Ross might go for it. But if they won't accept the credit, then there's really no point. I'm checking with them on this.

So, you enjoy OMM for how it feels? This is precisely why I would hate it so much. Sounds too much like a vocational (e.g., massage therapy) school. But to each his own, I guess.

Actually Drexel takes DO transfers....according to their website. Just FYI.

 

[Spitting Camel]

Plan A: UCI

Plan B: Any other allopathic school

 

[Echinoidea]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
that looks about right. i'd put sgu/ross above all do schools. and auc above certain do schools.

You'd put SGU & Ross above Michigan State COM? The same Michigan State that is ranked #4 by US News for Primary Care?

I don't think medicine is your calling. Neither is critical thinking. Try being an internet troll. You seem to be having luck with that.

 

[DrMom]

Originally posted by modelcitizen
It wouldn't be ironic at all because that's exactly the situation I'm in -- only holding a DO acceptance. Irony refers to a difference between the actual result and the expected result. I fully anticipate not being accepted to an MD school this year.

I don't know what the story is with modelcitizen, but because of some of his (or her) inflammatory statements about DOs while claiming to be accepted at a DO school & some PMs between us, I went to the admissions office at OSU. They have not interviewed or accepted anyone with stats anything like modelcitizen's (as posted below from another thread), nor have they accepted anyone with a degree from UCSD.

There is definitely some misrepresentation of some form going on here.

Originally posted by modelcitizen
Undergrad: UCSD (transferred)
Undergrad GPA: 2.83
MCAT: 22L
Major: Biology
Applied: SGU, Ross, OSU-COM, COMP, TUCOM, Univ. of Oklahoma, UCSD
Interviewed: SGU, OSU-COM, TUCOM, COMP
Accepted: OSU-COM
Rejected: SGU, Ross, OU & UCSD? (i assume)

OSU-COM does not accept people with stats this low. The minimum GPA requirement at OSU is 3.0, and while they theoretically will accept as low as a 21 MCAT, this is almost never done...and certainly not ever done this early in the application cycle.

 

[Shinken]

DrMom, you mean that modelcitizen was lying? that he's a troll?!

I didn't see that coming! He sounded so....so...mature and knowledgeable!

 

[exmike]

Originally posted by Echinoidea
You'd put SGU & Ross above Michigan State COM? The same Michigan State that is ranked #4 by US News for Primary Care?

I don't think medicine is your calling. Neither is critical thinking. Try being an internet troll. You seem to be having luck with that.

rankings schmankings. for primary care, a huge chunk is made up of % entering primary care, and since MSUCOM has like 85%, they get an artificially higher ranking. I find it curious that MSUSOM is ranked lower than MSUCOM even though they share the same building and many classes. Its an artifact.

 

[doctorcynical]

Originally posted by idq1i
Solution: work your a$s off = no need for plan B

Work your ass off to become a URM = no need for plan B

 

[dollarbincommon]

somebody got caught!

modelcitizen, if you don't like DO schools, then don't apply to them. It is as simple as that.

I don't measure my self-worth by a piece of paper or social institution. and you shouldn't either. university degree is sortof overrated. the good people in the world (mother teresa, ghandi, dalai lama) don't have college education.

think of yourself as very lucky. [/sentimental dollarbincommon on a high-horse]

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by DrMom
I don't know what the story is with modelcitizen, but because of some of his (or her) inflammatory statements about DOs while claiming to be accepted at a DO school & some PMs between us, I went to the admissions office at OSU. They have not interviewed or accepted anyone with stats anything like modelcitizen's (as posted below from another thread), nor have they accepted anyone with a degree from UCSD.

There is definitely some misrepresentation of some form going on here.

--------
Misrepresentation? Inflammatory statements about DO's?

I've included the complete transcript of our PM's here. As you can see, and as I explained in detail many times, it is the OMM aspect of osteopathic medicine that inflames me. I finally stopped responding to your PM's because they had become, as I think everyone will agree after their long read, quite trollish. Who has time to answer the same questions over and over again?

As far as my stats go, they are what I've posted. One person noted that because I had retaken a class it was somehow counted higher at DO schools, but I've never confirmed this. And I think I mentioned that I transferred from UCSD. So, either (i) the admissions office is not telling you the complete truth, (ii) you're not as chummy with them as you thought you were, or (iii) you've beaten them to death with the same question over and over until they finally just gave you any answer you wanted as long as you went away.

--------

DrMom wrote on 01-28-2004 07:03 PM:
I wanted to let you know that, like many other schools do, the admissions office at OSU has been known to read these forums to see what people are saying about the school. You may want to keep that in mind.

modelcitizen wrote on 01-28-2004 09:26 PM:
Thanks, I didn't think about that.

I don't think I've said anything bad about OSU, or any other school that I can think of. I'm just very skeptical of the whole OMM thing. And from the responses I've seen to my inquiries about OMM, I'm finding myself even more skeptical. I'm sure schools would much rather have someone subject it to scientific scrutiny rather than just accept it on its face. Just as I would any bio-organic chemical reaction mechanism, for instance. Do you find it scientifically valid?

At any rate, thanks again and I'll keep in mind that they review these boards.

DrMom wrote on 01-28-2004 07:44 PM:
You may not have said anything negative about OSU, but you have said that DOs are clinically more incompetent. You haven't just been questioning OMM (which isn't a problem), you've been quite negative about it. There is a difference.

As to my opinions, there are aspects of OMM that have been scientifically explained & justified as effective. There are a few problems with OMM research, a major one is blinding (very difficult to do). Also, unfortunately many of the full-time OMM docs are not interested in doing research. I find that very frustrating. We do have a physiology PhD and a pediatrician (an MD, no less) doing OMM research (different studies). The pediatrician recently had a study on OMM and otitis media published.

All that said, I have had wonderful experiences with OMM (patient and treater). I ask that you go into it with an open mind. There are some methods that are a bit odd & I don't think they do a very good job explaining, but methods like muscle energy, counterstrain, and HVLA can be scientifically explained & work well if you have some idea what you're doing. Just like any other skill, it takes practice to be able to do it decently. Most of this comes from treating classmates. I do put time and effort into OMM, but it doesn't take all that much time overall. Only 3 hrs of class/week are devoted to OMM.

I don't have any classmates that I know of who accept OMM blindly (although I've seen 1 or 2 in other classes). We have a wide range of student interest in OMM from gurus to uninterested. I can't think of anyone, though, who comes across as anti-OMM.

Anyways, I just wanted to give you a heads up & try to give you a bit of the info you're wanting.

modelcitizen wrote on 01-28-2004 10:06 PM:
i'll have to disagree here.
1. the published, peer-reviewed article i cited refers to osteopaths' clinical "incompetence." And no one provided anything to rebut this.
2. clearly merely questioning this stuff has become a problem -- it provokes all sorts of attacks that the mods (i.e., you) are willing to turn your back to. it only turns negative in the responses to my questions, never before.
3. to go in with an "open mind" is something you do when evaluating a new religion, not a medical treatment method. all medicine should be subjected to strict scrutiny from the getgo. you would never administer a new drug with an open mind; you would examine every aspect of it as critically as possible. if you don't question OMM now, you'll be just like the old folks you're referring to who have too much vested at this point to start questioning it now. this crap has been around for 130yrs, and it's worse than chiropracty as far as I'm concerned because the people in DO schools are smarter and should know better. we should go in with a *critical* mind.

DrMom wrote on 01-29-2004 03:36 AM:

1.) It is always tenuous to make broad statements based on one study.
2.) As I said, I don't see any problem with questioning, but your tone has not been questioning, it has been outright negative.
3.) An open mind is used in medicine constantly. Surgeries have been performed without double-blinded studies without people having fits over it being unproven. (interestingly enough, I saw a study where they did do some single-blinded surgeries (can't blind the surgeon) ie: lap choles and found that there actually was a placebo effect to surgery. People with proven stones got better without having them removed.) While it is important for scientific studies to be done to prove the efficacy of OMM, you're fooling yourself if you think that all of medicine is scientividally proven.

My whole point has been that your attitude about all of this is negative. You have already decided that OMM is worthless. If you go in thinking that, you won't see it's value at all.

modelcitizen wrote on 01-29-2004 08:11 AM:
1. the "broad statement" is the authors' *conclusion*. if you assert it's wrong, all you have to do is cite *any* evidence to the contrary to defeat it.
2. my "outright negative" tone is called healthy skepticism everywhere else in the scientific world. look at the responses to this questioning; there's where you'll find your outright negative tone.
3. (a) double-blind studies are not the only way to validate (although they could certainly be used in many aspects of OMM). (b) if your example below is true, then surgeons have either stopped performing it, or more validated studies have shown that these earlier results were wrong. either way, surgeons would not have a problem at all stopping said technique and moving on to something that works. in fact, that's what they try to do all the time. that's why research exists. they don't define their "philosophy" by the technique they are using.
4. again, nowhere else (except possibly chiropracty) will you find your "open mind" approach to learning medicine. you will certainly not find it in surgery. i know it is against the DO credo, but i would urge you to stop blinding accepting this hogwash, and critically examine A.T.Still's methods like you would any other medical procedure. it's the only way you're going to get rid of the stuff you have already admitted goes unexplained.
5. finally, requiring proof that something does what it purports to do is not being negative, it's being critical. if there's any "value," it will be have to be proven, which is nothing more than you would ask of any allopathic procedure.

good luck to you. i'm sure you'll make a fine A.T.Still follower. see you next semester.

DrMom wrote on 01-29-2004 02:14 PM:
just out of curiosity, how did you manage to get into OSU-COM with such low stats (as you posted them in a thread around here)?

modelcitizen wrote on 01-29-2004 06:10 PM:
now that sounds a bit mean-spirited...

DrMom wrote on 01-29-2004 06:25 PM:
No, I'm truly curious.

modelcitizen wrote on 01-29-2004 08:32 PM:
i didn't do anything special that i know of. i don't think they're really that low for OSU. in fact one girl that was there when i was interviewing had lower stats than i did. not sure whether she was accepted or not, though.
i think my gpa may have been calculated a bit higher because of a class that i repeated, but i'm not sure about that. my ec's aren't too bad, either. other than that, i just put on the charm that you've seen in these threads 🙂.

DrMom wrote on 01-29-2004 06:55 PM:
Your stats are very low for OSU.

modelcitizen wrote on 01-29-2004 09:04 PM:
thanks for the kind words.

DrMom wrote on 01-31-2004 12:09 PM:
Truly, I'm curious. I don't know of anyone here with stats like that...and they usually interview those with lower stats later in the spring.

Where are you from origninally?

modelcitizen wrote on 01-31-2004 07:16 PM:
enid.

aren't the avg stats around 3.4/26? that means for every 4.0/31 there's a 2.9/21. again, i wasn't even the lowest at my interview. from what i've seen, especially among DO applicants, is that the people with the lower stats either (i) lie about them, or (ii) never disclose them.

-------

 

[doctorcynical]

You know what they always say. If you can't go to med school go to UCLA.

 

[Shinken]

Sorry modelcitizen, but I have to side with DrMom on this one. Your tone has been negative and pretty adversarial. It could be because of the difference between the spoken word and the written word. Who knows. I'm just talking about my subjective impression from reading this thread and your last post (by the way, I think it's poor form to publicly post private messages).

As far as your stats being too low for OSU-COM, I can't comment (and personally it doesn't matter. After all, grades and MCAT don't make a good physician).

Also, don't equate an "open mind" with religion or even cultism. Almost all of medicine requires an open mind or at least some sort of "faith" that the drug/treatment/surgery will work. Scientific studies aren't conclusive, and that's why treatments are constantly being scrutinized (remember hormone replacement therapy?). If you read JAMA, for example, most studies published almost always conclude with "the study suggests that..." or "the results show that there might be a correlation..." or "the authors found that it was likely...". The studies aren't absolutes, but point out to a "likely" outcome. The same with OMM.

Good luck, and I hope that if you do become a DO that you don't become a disgruntled one but one that recognizes the value and privilege of belonging to the greater medical community, regardless of degree obtained.

 

[Odaroloc]

I will have to side with modelcitizen here. I have been reading SDN for awhile now and as a general rule people seem to be oversensitive about MD vs DO discussion and the stigma some see attached to the latter. He/She has made clear his skeptisism and has made compelling arguments to support his disdain for OMM. Also, the PM's were mentioned by the mom person first and I see no reason why he should not be allowed to make them public to clear himself of the troll label if he is in fact not.

 

[DrMom]

Modelcitizen is more than welcome to make the PMs public. They are the actual ones we sent back and forth.

 

[Cowboy DO]

These arguments are so petty. There are so many more important things you can put your energy into like trying to fix the current crisis that we as physicians face now, or as medical students will be facing in the future, there is a grim road ahead for all physicians and it certainly does not make a distinction between MD?s & DO?s, PCP?s or specialists. We don?t have the authority we used to, we are told how we can and cannot treat patients by non-physicians, thanks to insurance companies and ?medical necessity clauses? that we allowed to happen because we fell asleep at the wheel. We are getting sued every which way by sweet talking trial lawyers that have convinced this nation that doctors have bottomless pockets, that every baby should be born perfect, and if anything (and I mean anything) goes wrong it?s the doctors fault. Well guess what... we don?t, that cant happen, and no its not. Thanks to these people malpractice is outrageous. Do you know how many private practice ob/gyn?s are in the Bronx right now? On of the most medically undeserved area in the nation. Not one. I?ll say it again. Not one.

And here we sit bickering like children...

Here?s a riddle for all of you. A diabetic goes to a family practice doc, an internist, a nurse practitioner and an endocrinologist. Who gets the most reimbursement? ... they get the same amount.

Well the endocrinologist has done the most training and certainly he can manage a diabetic better than someone straight out of nursing school right? Damn straight. So what?s the point of specializing if we can get the same amount of reimbursement as a nurse? the benefit to the patient, our own lust for learning? Sure, but should not we be rewarded for this? Did you know that every dollar that is paid as an insurance premium, 14 cents actually go to cover health care costs. 16 cents go to advertising. They pay more for friggin? advertisements!! And the rest goes to processing the 3' pile of papers we have to fill out when someone scrapes there knee. Does anyone else find this asinine?

So while we were busy fighting with ourselves, insurance CEO?s, trial lawyers, and non-physician health care workers were busy reaching there hand into our pockets and those of the taxpayers at the cost of patient care*.

Scared, angry? Yeah you should be. It?s your future.

*This is in no way is meant to demonize all trial lawyers or people who work for insurance companies as there are plenty out there with good intentions. I am also certainly not attempting to berate those who have chosen other careers in health care. Especially nurses, because we all love you and absolutely could not function with out you. Im just trying to illustrate a point.

At times I get really upset with these forums because of the constant immature bickering that I see here and the amount of people that seem to take all these posts at face value, to heart, or even worse as words that some ?supreme medical being? has set in stone, and they end up completely missing the big picture. We are all supposed to be professionals, act like it. Nothing is set in stone. If you don?t like it, change it. If it hasn?t been done before, do it. Lastly, for gods sake quit arguing. Sorry but this crap just makes me sick. Every once and awhile you need to stop, take a look at that bigger picture and ask yourself what really matters.

I will be posting this in other threads I am disgusted with.

Thank you for letting me rant, as you can see I was very moved by a health policy lecture I had this afternoon 🙂 which I am almost reiterating. I will now step off my soap box and try to prevent future outbursts such as these from happening. I hope I have not offended anyone, I am only trying to open my future colleague?s eyes to the severity of the problems that face us in the future.


Cowboy

 

[modelcitizen]

Originally posted by DrMom
Modelcitizen is more than welcome to make the PMs public.

Thanks for the OK on that, DrTroll.

 

[Spitting Camel]

I agree with modelcitizen as well. People are too sensitive. I know this because I have been guilty of giving in every once in a while, too. Anyways, no one can tell you how to think or how to act.

 

[ocean11]

Who the heck bothers with reading these petty argument posts? 😴 😴 😴

Seriously I just skim past those loooong posts......... guys lets argue about something worth arguing about........

Back to Bed (I wish.........)