PMP/PDMP IN your state?

[JamesL1585]

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Hey everybody,

How is PMP in your state? Anyone state uses Appriss? Whats your feedback on it? Is it helpful? is it reliable? Is there good data on it?

 

[JamesL1585]

Hey everybody,

How is PMP in your state? Anyone state uses Appriss? Whats your feedback on it? Is it helpful? is it reliable? Is there good data on it?

Anyone?

 

[pharmdit]

I'm in NY. The PMP serves its function. We are able to submit our prescriptions to it without many issues. We don't query it often because we serve skilled nursing facilities. It's used mostly for the assisted living patients.

I don't know if NY uses Appriss. I looked it up and it seems like a decent product. Interoperability is a major barrier to consistent use of PMP data in practice. It's cumbersome entering patient data into a separate website. Based on a presentation I saw at the NCPDP conference this year, other states allow a certain degree of interoperability with EHRs and dispensing software which seems awesome.


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[FarmD711]

I practice on a border with another state whose PMP we don't have access to. My primary store is literally 0.8 miles from the border. Makes it hard to be useful not seeing this other states info.


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[Sine Cura]

If you mean PDMP AWARxE, Arizona CSPMP does not utilize it. California's PDMP (CURES) does not. Nevada BOP does, but I was denied access to it because I also have an AZ license. (Imagine if AZ BOP denied my application because I have a Nevada license!)

The PDMPs help serve their basic function, except it is difficult to track abuse of vet controlled Rx because there is no way to report owner information.

The main quibbles I have with California's is that it doesn't really specify if prescribers are dispensing opioids, that it goes back only 12 months, and that it does not maintain a search history (you have to save results deliberately). Arizona's data goes back further and it retains a list of recent searches.

 

[farmadiazepine]

In NJ. PMP connects to a couple other states. It's good for what it's supposed to do. It searches by name, birthday, address, etc. I see the problem being if someone gives multiple names to multiple doctors, then they will circumvent the whole purpose of the PMP. PMP needs to identify people uniquely, like the way a fingerprint identifies a single unique person, we need a number like a SSN (which everyone does NOT have), to uniquely identify people.

 

[confettiflyer]

California made us sign up for it, but I don't know how to use it and I probably need a password reset. I've never attempted to use it. Not really interested, either.


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[owlegrad]

I always found Florida's to be cumbersome.

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[Niosh]

Iowa's seems pretty nice. We're required to report data to it weekly so it is reasonably up to date and reliable. You can search using wildcards to help catch AKAs (Kath* would pull up Kathy, Kathie, Kathryn, Kathlyn ...) Can also search 5 nearby states as well. But not Missouri, because Missouri. I don't use it often though. I have no idea what system it runs.

 

[maria1oh]

In ohio we can search border states except for Pennsylvania

 

[JamesL1585]

Here's a follow-up question for you? Has anyone found a fraud prescription, or several fraud prescriptions on pmp? I think the shortfall is with patients who are knowingly abusing medications. They use different names, or bring in fraud prescriptions or other mechanisms. But the PMP/PDMP isn't smart enough to detect that. Thats still our own due diligence to find it. Then when we do, theres not much we can do about it.

 

[BidingMyTime]

Has anyone found a fraud prescription, or several fraud prescriptions on pmp? I think the shortfall is with patients who are knowingly abusing medications. They use different names, or bring in fraud prescriptions or other mechanisms.

Well, if a prescription has been filled on the PMP, then obviously the pharmacist who filled it thought it was legit, so you have to trust your professional colleagues and assume RX's filled were legit. The only way a fraudulent RX would be caught on the PMP, is if someone was using multiple doctors under one name, and then a pharmacist calls the doctors and finds out they didn't actually write those RX's.

As to the first question, I have no idea what kind of PMP Illinois has. I've found it helpful in ascertaining whether or not a suspicious patient is using multiple pharmacies and doctors.

 

[JamesL1585]

Well, if a prescription has been filled on the PMP, then obviously the pharmacist who filled it thought it was legit, so you have to trust your professional colleagues and assume RX's filled were legit. The only way a fraudulent RX would be caught on the PMP, is if someone was using multiple doctors under one name, and then a pharmacist calls the doctors and finds out they didn't actually write those RX's.

As to the first question, I have no idea what kind of PMP Illinois has. I've found it helpful in ascertaining whether or not a suspicious patient is using multiple pharmacies and doctors.

My follow-up question would be, what next. If they were able to fill one fraud prescription, wouldn't they be able to fill others? I just think the PDMP isn't as useful as it shows. It helps with some abuse, but certainly not all. And I think the amount of fraud prescriptions is equal to the amount of patients whom doctor shop. So we're only eliminating one of the big things we try to avoid.

If you catch a fraud prescription, there are few actions you can take, and i hate that about the current pmp system.

 

[owlegrad]

What do you mean, there are few actions you can take? You can ban the patient from your pharmacy for a start. You can also call the police and have them arrested, if you are so inclined.

 

[Sine Cura]

Here's a follow-up question for you? Has anyone found a fraud prescription, or several fraud prescriptions on pmp? I think the shortfall is with patients who are knowingly abusing medications. They use different names, or bring in fraud prescriptions or other mechanisms. But the PMP/PDMP isn't smart enough to detect that. Thats still our own due diligence to find it. Then when we do, theres not much we can do about it.

Yes, usually because due diligence wasn't practiced, like alprazolam 2 mg #120 from "urgent care" or tramadol from a psych office (stolen pads or fake call ins) or pharmacists just being flat out bad at spotting out-and-out fakes.

 

[JamesL1585]

What do you mean, there are few actions you can take? You can ban the patient from your pharmacy for a start. You can also call the police and have them arrested, if you are so inclined.

Ban them from the pharmacy? Okay. So then they just go to the other one across the street, or the other side of town. Alot of them are smarter than you think. I had a lady I found that had frauded roughly 50 prescriptions over the course of 3 months, because she used small quantities each day. And always put an antibiotic on it. The lady was genius. Had to call the DEA on her.

Same thing with professionals that call in fake RX's. *Sigh* This isn't as easy as you make it seem, and it happens to every pharmacist, just the people doing it are professionals.

 

[owlegrad]

Ban them from the pharmacy? Okay. So then they just go to the other one across the street, or the other side of town. Alot of them are smarter than you think. I had a lady I found that had frauded roughly 50 prescriptions over the course of 3 months, because she used small quantities each day. And always put an antibiotic on it. The lady was genius. Had to call the DEA on her.

Same thing with professionals that call in fake RX's. *Sigh* This isn't as easy as you make it seem, and it happens to every pharmacist, just the people doing it are professionals.

What options are you lacking that you desire? You caught a forger and called the authorities. What more would you like to be able to do?

 

[farmadiazepine]

There is no helping everyone. You find a fraudulent prescription, you have 2 options: 1) Call the cops or 2) Tell them they are banned and don't come the f*ck back.

I've done both.

I prefer the second option.

These people will find drugs no matter what. Whether they go to jail or go to another pharmacy, it is the person who is the problem. You, by using PMP, will not be able to do anything except see what other controls they get, which doctors are prescribing them, and how soon they get them. That's it.

If PMP was universal, for all of the United States, I would like it more. The NJ one is okay, but the fact that each state has its own and you have to learn to navigate it (as easy as it is), is a pain in the as*. I still haven't signed up for NY's due to it's ridiculous requirements to sign up (something about downloading a form, getting a notarized paper, creating another account, and all..)

One national system would be best, and something better than that shi**y Obamacare website.

 

[RxPreceptor]

I must say, love it or hate it, e-scribing seems to have vastly cut down on PMZ + Codeine attempts & other suspicious Rxs...the problem is this needs to be done on a national level, not just here in NYS (the bitch paperwork is worth it).

On the other hand, detecting fraudulent e-scripts would seem nearly impossible if drug addicts had access...other than obvious red flags.

 

[BidingMyTime]

My follow-up question would be, what next. If they were able to fill one fraud prescription, wouldn't they be able to fill others? I just think the PDMP isn't as useful as it shows. It helps with some abuse, but certainly not all. And I think the amount of fraud prescriptions is equal to the amount of patients whom doctor shop. So we're only eliminating one of the big things we try to avoid.
If you catch a fraud prescription, there are few actions you can take, and i hate that about the current pmp system.

Yes, but the more people write fraudlent RX's, the more likely they are to get caught (and they will get caught, because by the time an addict is willing to take the great risk of writing a fradulent RX (or photocopying an RX to use it repeatedly), they aren't going to stop with one.

But I feel this is way down. Maybe I don't work enough retail, but it's been a long time since I've seen a fake RX. The mechanisms in place (tamper proof, e-rx, PDMP, etc.) certainly help a lot. Of course, nothing is fool proof. Why can't police catch serial killers after they kill one person, instead of many people? Why do chronic shoplifters get away shoplifting so much before they get caught? I get what you are saying, but we live in a very imperfect world, maybe in the future better systems will be developed, but I don't have any ideas on how things could currently be made better.

 

[rph3664]

I can't be the only person who keeps reading the header as "Pump & Dump".

 

[ldiot]

It doesn't nothing to prevent fake scripts. That is up to the pharmacist. What it is useful for is seeing that the patient filled the same script at the pharmacy down the street yesterday from their other doctor. Or run a search on a patient that you've never filled for before to see if they have a history that suggests abuse/early fills.

"This percocet from Dr. X is for my back, this percocet from Dr. Y is for my neck, this percocet from Dr. Z is for my hip". 3 doctors 3 pharmacies, this is where it is useful. Also useful if they filled the script last month at a different pharmacy, you can make sure that it is not filled too early.

 

[JamesL1585]

Thanks guys for your feedback. I am currently working with a consultant team, they are working indirectly with a company doing PMP and some organizations trying to nationalize it. Any other suggestions, please put them and I'll make sure they are translated to the company! Thanks!

 

[Dr Wario]

Thanks guys for your feedback. I am currently working with a consultant team, they are working indirectly with a company doing PMP and some organizations trying to nationalize it. Any other suggestions, please put them and I'll make sure they are translated to the company! Thanks!

If you really want to make PMPs useful, make them national as you said, and get it somehow integrated directly into our computer systems, or at least faster to access than they are now.

 

[Farmercyst]

Thanks guys for your feedback. I am currently working with a consultant team, they are working indirectly with a company doing PMP and some organizations trying to nationalize it. Any other suggestions, please put them and I'll make sure they are translated to the company! Thanks!

I've been lucky enough to get access to CA, OR, and NV. I like NV because they have agreements with other states that allow me access to them as well CO, UT and others. CA rolled out CURES 2.0 a few months ago which allows prescribes to indicate if a pain contract is in place. There's also an option to contact the prescriber via email if an email address is on file. I haven't used that feature yet, but in a rural area where patients have a legitimate need to drive long distances to see specialists, the added access may come in handy.

 

[PikminOC]

I'm in il. I check my written script on pmp to make sure i know there are no fraud prescription under my name. I also check patients names to make sure they are only getting from me

 

[PharmDBro2017]

Hey everybody,

How is PMP in your state? Anyone state uses Appriss? Whats your feedback on it? Is it helpful? is it reliable? Is there good data on it?

We run "pimps" (PMP) on people often when your intuition tells you something seems off.

 

[trailerpark]

I run the PMP if they are paying cash which always seem to be non regulars.

 

[RxPreceptor]

We run "pimps" (PMP) on people often when your intuition tells you something seems off.

Is "pimp" official medical slang for PMP'd or just a typo...I see in the MD notes section "pimped" occasionally...hilarious

 

[PharmDBro2017]

Is "pimp" official medical slang for PMP'd or just a typo...I see in the MD notes section "pimped" occasionally...hilarious

Idk, it's just slang for what we call PMP in the pharmacy. It's a lot easier (and more fun) to say than "P-M-P".

Use it and I promise you'll like it. "I think we need to run a pimp on this guy...."