So i match into a pgy 2 spot through the nrmp match. I am a DO and want to do orthopedics in an osteopathic program but failed to match. As a back a plan I chose a second specialty to apply to and matched into an advanced position. My question is, is it ok to reapply to the DO match without violation of my advanced position. I am aware that I will have to let my pgy2 spot know by approx mid jan that I would like to cancel the contract. I just dont want to some how lose my pgy 2 spot because i applied and then failed to match ortho in the osteopathic match
possible to apply DO match with and advanced NRMP spot
- Thread starter MUDO16
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Your description is a bit confusing. Reviewing your old posts, I gather that:
1. You're a DO student who applied to the DO orthopedic surgery match, and didn't match.
2. You also regstered for the NRMP match, and matched into a PGY-2 PM&R position.
3. You obtained a TRI for your PGY-1, either in the AOA match or in the scramble afterwards (details are immaterial for your question).
4. You still want Ortho, and would like to try to match in the AOA match again this year.
5. If you don't match in ortho, then you want to keep your PM&R position (although you also posted that you were trying to trade your PM&R spot for an Anesthesia spot, but that's a different matter). You worry that applying for ortho might somehow be a match violation.
Assuming I have all that correct...
1. Yes, technically it is a match violation to do this. The NRMP states that it is a violation to search for a concurrent spot once you are matched. Hence, looking for any sort of residency position to start in July 2012 is against the rules. Theoretically, you need to resign your PM&R spot first, and then look for ortho spots.
2. Realistically, the NRMP is unlikely to notice.
3. In any case, the timeline doesn't really work for you. AOA match day is Mid Feb 2012. You'd need to resign your spot by Jan 15th, long before match day. So you can't hold onto your PM&R spot until you match in ortho....but....
4. ...if you did that, you'd be a match violator. The worst the NRMP could do is bar you from future matches, which if you've matched into DO ortho program really doesn't matter at all. You'd need to assess the ethics of this, and whether you feel it's professional or not.
Summary:
1. As a DO in a TRI who didn't match into ortho last year and isn't doing ortho aways this year, your chances of matching into ortho are very low. That being said, if it's what you really want to do, perhaps it's worth trying and seeing what happens.
2. You could probably apply to DO ortho programs and see what happens. If you get no interiews, then the game is over and I don't think you could be blamed for violating the NRMP match. My personal feeling (which counts for nothing in this case) is that it would be reasonable to apply to programs to see what happens. If you get lots of interviews and you start interviewing for spots, that's when you start risking the ire of the NRMP.
3. If you get interviews, you'll need to decide whether to resign your PM&R spot, or keep it and interview.
4. Submitting an AOA match list while you are still matched to an NRMP spot is DEFINITELY a match violation. The AOA match is after the NRMP waiver deadline, so you can't have it both ways -- although the chance of getting caught doing this is very low. You'll need to assess the risks, and the professionalism of withdrawing from your program should you match into ortho.
5. The AOA match contract is not online (at least, not on their public site that I can see). It might be an AOA match violation to try to do this also. If so, you could easily get "caught" if you match into ortho, and lose both spots and your entire career.
1. You're a DO student who applied to the DO orthopedic surgery match, and didn't match.
2. You also regstered for the NRMP match, and matched into a PGY-2 PM&R position.
3. You obtained a TRI for your PGY-1, either in the AOA match or in the scramble afterwards (details are immaterial for your question).
4. You still want Ortho, and would like to try to match in the AOA match again this year.
5. If you don't match in ortho, then you want to keep your PM&R position (although you also posted that you were trying to trade your PM&R spot for an Anesthesia spot, but that's a different matter). You worry that applying for ortho might somehow be a match violation.
Assuming I have all that correct...
1. Yes, technically it is a match violation to do this. The NRMP states that it is a violation to search for a concurrent spot once you are matched. Hence, looking for any sort of residency position to start in July 2012 is against the rules. Theoretically, you need to resign your PM&R spot first, and then look for ortho spots.
2. Realistically, the NRMP is unlikely to notice.
3. In any case, the timeline doesn't really work for you. AOA match day is Mid Feb 2012. You'd need to resign your spot by Jan 15th, long before match day. So you can't hold onto your PM&R spot until you match in ortho....but....
4. ...if you did that, you'd be a match violator. The worst the NRMP could do is bar you from future matches, which if you've matched into DO ortho program really doesn't matter at all. You'd need to assess the ethics of this, and whether you feel it's professional or not.
Summary:
1. As a DO in a TRI who didn't match into ortho last year and isn't doing ortho aways this year, your chances of matching into ortho are very low. That being said, if it's what you really want to do, perhaps it's worth trying and seeing what happens.
2. You could probably apply to DO ortho programs and see what happens. If you get no interiews, then the game is over and I don't think you could be blamed for violating the NRMP match. My personal feeling (which counts for nothing in this case) is that it would be reasonable to apply to programs to see what happens. If you get lots of interviews and you start interviewing for spots, that's when you start risking the ire of the NRMP.
3. If you get interviews, you'll need to decide whether to resign your PM&R spot, or keep it and interview.
4. Submitting an AOA match list while you are still matched to an NRMP spot is DEFINITELY a match violation. The AOA match is after the NRMP waiver deadline, so you can't have it both ways -- although the chance of getting caught doing this is very low. You'll need to assess the risks, and the professionalism of withdrawing from your program should you match into ortho.
5. The AOA match contract is not online (at least, not on their public site that I can see). It might be an AOA match violation to try to do this also. If so, you could easily get "caught" if you match into ortho, and lose both spots and your entire career.
yes, you fully understand my situation. I am aware that it is def an uphill battle to try to match ortho after i failed to last year. like you said i will apply feel out the situation see if i get any interviews. It doesnt seem to be any harm in applying and possibly even interviewing. I will not give up that spot unless I get a very very strong feeling from an ortho program, at that time i would go through the process to try to get out of the nrmp obligation. and you do raise a point say I hold my spot until the match and i get a violation in the nrmp match, so if they gave me a violation, what would it really matter. from talking to the nrmp today, they really have no communication with the aoa.
I tried to look up the aoa match process to and talk to someone but they were very vague
pmr which i have no problem doing as a career, its was just not my #1 goal.
I tried to look up the aoa match process to and talk to someone but they were very vague
pmr which i have no problem doing as a career, its was just not my #1 goal.
This sounds like a mess. I was told it was essentially impossible to obtain a DO ortho spot if you didn't match the first time around. Has anyone ever heard of a person matching into Ortho after doing a TRI? Just curious..
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I personally know one person who did this. But they did the TRI at the same place the program is and personally knew many of the residents, so they got a lot of face time and experience with the program. But yeah, it's notoriously nearly impossible to get into a program like ortho when you didn't match the year before. Just as an aside, in my observation of classmates trying to get into DO ortho, I have come to the conclusion that the DO match for ortho is one of the most convoluted, corrupt, and shady processes ever. We think it's bad in the NRMP match--it's 10x worse for the DO people trying to get ortho.
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They will tell you it's a match violation.
