Possible to get into competitive residencies with average/passing grades?

[bluesTank]

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Now I am sure that this probably has been asked before, but I couldn't really find a thread about it.

So it has been my dream, for personal reasons, to go into oncology or rad-onc since I was little. Now I find myself starting medical school and wondering if it will be possible for me to ever really be able to do well enough to get honors, let alone high pass grades. Now a few people have told me that basic science grades account for very little in what residencies are looking at. Do you all think that I would have a chance at the above residencies, if I just kept my head above water for these basic science classes with passing/average grades, and then a decent board score with good clinical grades? I know it's a long ways away, but I just am kind of bummed that I won't be able to live out my dreams because of these reasons. Just need some closure.

Thanks

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

I'm there with you. I hope it works out for you.

I hear the same things, but am not sure if it's totally the case or not.

I'm just gonna study hard for year 2, take Step I and hope for the best.

Radiology is what I've always wanted, but I've definitely opened my eyes to EM and Anesthesiology, also pretty competitive, as well. I like IM, but I would never remain in general medicine.

Always, and I mean always, have a backup program of interest.

EDIT: Dude, you're JUST NOW starting med school at BCM, so obviously you're a smart fella, plus, it's only been a week for you I bet -- chill.

 

[Blesbok]

You are way to early in your career to be having negative thoughts like this. If it is worth it to you, you will work your ass off for it and if you work your ass off I guarantee you will do better than you think.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Basic science grades are a lot more under your control than clinical grades. For competitive specialties you'll be better off maximizing research and Step I than counting on clinical grades to get you there.

 

[PeepshowJohnny]

Basic science grades are a lot more under your control than clinical grades. For competitive specialties you'll be better off maximizing research and Step I than counting on clinical grades to get you there.

And sadly, one of the best ways to get a good Step 1 is to master the basic science curriculum.

OP, oncology isn't that competitive. Matching into a good Internal Medicine program that can get you into an oncology fellowship is very doable for an American medical graduate with some gumption. Rad Onc...little bit harder. But if you get to know department heads early, get some research in the field...still doable.

 

[bluesTank]

Thanks all

And I know its early, but like I said, it is really important to me on a personal level, so I don't want to screw anything up.

 

[sirus_virus]

Unless the reason your basic science grades are low is because you spent time studying for step 1, chances are that if you do average on your basic science classes you will probably do the same on step 1.

 

[Law2Doc]

Thanks all

And I know its early, but like I said, it is really important to me on a personal level, so I don't want to screw anything up.

Agree with what's been said here. (1) you can't worry about not getting honors before you have your first test in med school. Assume you can get honors until you don't. Just keep working hard. Because even if you end up learning a lot but come up short, you put yourself into a better position to do well on Step 1. (2) Basic science year grades really don't count much. That's the "dirty little secret" in med school according to some advisors. Schools make you work hard, but when all is said and done, most people just get a P in everything and residency programs ignore it and focus on clinical year grades/evals and Step 1. Doing well in the basic science years is highly correlated with doing well on Step 1, however. (3) oncology is not equivalent to rad onc. For rad onc you have to be a superstar. For IM specialties, you can be mortal. (4) Step 1 is going to count far more than your basic science year grades. If you do great on Step 1, a lot is forgiven. (5) everyone who gets into med school has the ability to do well there. If the adcom took you, then you can be that dude who gets all honors. So cool it with the Mr negativity talk. Study your ***** off and you will get to your goal. Or die trying.

 

[bluesTank]

Ok, so finding out that general onc is not on the same level as rad onc is enlightening. Haha I didn't know that! Took a lot of weight off my mind.

 

[sirus_virus]

Ok, so finding out that general onc is not on the same level as rad onc is enlightening. Haha I didn't know that! Took a lot of weight off my mind.

Don't be in too much of a hurry to take that weight off; while internal medicine might be easy to land, the actual residncy training is rough. I look at IM residency as an extension of medical school clinical years (with some extra hot sauce ofcourse), because even as an IM resident you might still be fighting for good evals, research, kissing ass, etc so you can reach your actual desired specialty, and many will not.

 

[Pinkertinkle]

Ok, so finding out that general onc is not on the same level as rad onc is enlightening. Haha I didn't know that! Took a lot of weight off my mind.

You do know that oncology is a fellowship which is completed after Internal Medicine residency rite?

 

[78222]

Unless the reason your basic science grades are low is because you spent time studying for step 1, chances are that if you do average on your basic science classes you will probably do the same on step 1.

While this is generally true, I didn't honor any classes at all the first 2 years. I got high pass (B) in everything except the super easy doctoring classes. I still managed to do really well on STEP I (probably because I wasn't really concerned with studying for A's but rather for STEP I).

What I would do is set goals for myself. My personal goals were to get at least a high pass in every class and a 240+ on STEP I. Keeping those goals in mind, I worked hard and achieved them.

 

[mikedc813]

I matched into radiation oncology last year so I thought I'd share some of the things I learned along the way about the match in general.

What has been posted already is generally true. As you all know certain fields are more difficult to match into than others. However, I want to stress that if you are aiming to match into something that you think it out of your reach (like I did for rad onc) just go for it. Don't get yourself down and think you won't match. If you want it bad enough, you'll work hard enough to get there.

The MOST important things for matching into competitive specialties are grades/class rank, Step 1 score, and research. Grades and Step 1 scores are used by pretty much all program directors to weed candidates out, so if you don't make the cut from the beginning you're pretty much out of luck. Try to be in the top 3rd of your class and aim for at least a 225-230. Research is the next big piece of the puzzle. Rad onc is notorious for requiring significant research, but other fields are not as demanding. No matter what field you're going into, research will make you stand out and will make you more competitive. To clarify, doing research means having a finished product like a publication or abstract or presentation. No finished product essentially means no research in the eyes of program directors.

The rest of your extracurriculars are important to some extent, but not nearly as important as the 3 things I just listed. I could be biased based on the field I matched into, but this is my experience.

Finally, don't underestimate the power of connections. If you want to go into derm for example, spend as much time as you can in that department so they can get to know you. It can pay off in the end, especially if you want to stay where you went to med school since they will know you better than any of the other people interviewing. I also had mentors make phone calls on my behalf to people that they knew at different places I interviewed at. I was told that this helped put me at #1 on one program's rank list although I have no way of knowing for certain. The point is that you should use all of the connections you can.

I hope this helps at least a little. PM me if you have any questions. I'd be happy to answer them.

 

[bcat85]

Agree with what's been said here. (1) you can't worry about not getting honors before you have your first test in med school. Assume you can get honors until you don't. Just keep working hard. Because even if you end up learning a lot but come up short, you put yourself into a better position to do well on Step 1. (2) Basic science year grades really don't count much. That's the "dirty little secret" in med school according to some advisors. Schools make you work hard, but when all is said and done, most people just get a P in everything and residency programs ignore it and focus on clinical year grades/evals and Step 1. Doing well in the basic science years is highly correlated with doing well on Step 1, however. (3) oncology is not equivalent to rad onc. For rad onc you have to be a superstar. For IM specialties, you can be mortal. (4) Step 1 is going to count far more than your basic science year grades. If you do great on Step 1, a lot is forgiven. (5) everyone who gets into med school has the ability to do well there. If the adcom took you, then you can be that dude who gets all honors. So cool it with the Mr negativity talk. Study your ***** off and you will get to your goal. Or die trying.

Possibly the most inspirational quote in the history of SDN.

 

[Long Dong]

Rad onc is notorious for requiring significant research, but other fields are not as demanding. No matter what field you're going into, research will make you stand out and will make you more competitive. To clarify, doing research means having a finished product like a publication or abstract or presentation. No finished product essentially means no research in the eyes of program directors.

Finally, don't underestimate the power of connections. If you want to go into derm for example, spend as much time as you can in that department so they can get to know you. It can pay off in the end, especially if you want to stay where you went to med school since they will know you better than any of the other people interviewing. I also had mentors make phone calls on my behalf to people that they knew at different places I interviewed at. I was told that this helped put me at #1 on one program's rank list although I have no way of knowing for certain. The point is that you should use all of the connections you can.

Best advice ever for a competitive res. Research begets connections, in life in general who you know is more important then what you know. Especially in small fields like rad onc, plastics and derm.

Possibly the most inspirational quote in the history of SDN.

I like fifty cent better get rich or die trying.😀

Here is one I heard tiger woods dad told him "it's not the skill it's the will."

Here is another one I heard in the movie the pursuit of happiness "if you want something you go out and get it, don't let me or anyone else tell you you aren't good enough."

During interviews for residency I used both of these quotes and told them if they took me I'd do whatever it takes to the point of OCD to master my field.

 

[SnowTown]

Best advice ever for a competitive res. Research begets connections, in life in general who you know is more important then what you know. Especially in small fields like rad onc, plastics and derm.

I like fifty cent better get rich or die trying.😀

Here is one I heard tiger woods dad told him "it's not the skill it's the will."

Here is another one I heard in the movie the pursuit of happiness "if you want something you go out and get it, don't let me or anyone else tell you you aren't good enough."

During interviews for residency I used both of these quotes and told them if they took me I'd do whatever it takes to the point of OCD to master my field.

hahaha... really? 😀