Post-Bacc Programs and Difficulty

[mzeroapplicant]

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I'm looking at various post-bacc programs, and I'm interested in what experiences people have had at different post-bacc programs in terms of difficulty. I'd like to find a post-bacc program that is challenging enough to prepare me for the MCAT and (obviously) med school, but I'd also like to weed out any programs that have a reputation for being unreasonably difficult (testing a lot of material that wasn't taught in the course, unforgiving curves, and just plain unfair tests).

Here's the scattered information I've picked up from all the posts I've seen:

Brynn Mawr: teaching is good, but classes are curved and the program is selective, which leads to *very* difficult competition in terms of grades
Goucher: I hear the teaching is great, not sure about test/grades.
Bennington: (same as Goucher)
Penn: teaching is great, difficult (but not impossible) to get an A in most courses.
Northwestern: good teaching, tests are challenging but fair, the Orgo course at Northwestern is supposed to be even more challenging than elsewhere (but also renowned enough that an A or a B gets much recognition)

Not really sure about the other programs, thanks for any information in advance.

 

[Law2Doc]

I'm looking at various post-bacc programs, and I'm interested in what experiences people have had at different post-bacc programs in terms of difficulty. I'd like to find a post-bacc program that is challenging enough to prepare me for the MCAT and (obviously) med school, but I'd also like to weed out any programs that have a reputation for being unreasonably difficult (testing a lot of material that wasn't taught in the course, unforgiving curves, and just plain unfair tests).

Here's the scattered information I've picked up from all the posts I've seen:

Brynn Mawr: teaching is good, but classes are curved and the program is selective, which leads to *very* difficult competition in terms of grades
Goucher: I hear the teaching is great, not sure about test/grades.
Bennington: (same as Goucher)
Penn: teaching is great, difficult (but not impossible) to get an A in most courses.
Northwestern: good teaching, tests are challenging but fair, the Orgo course at Northwestern is supposed to be even more challenging than elsewhere (but also renowned enough that an A or a B gets much recognition)

Not really sure about the other programs, thanks for any information in advance.

Do you have the credentials to get into all of these? A lot of the selection may get done for you. In general the formal postbac programs do a good job covering the MCAT material, and will all make you work for your grades.

 

[mzeroapplicant]

Do you have the credentials to get into all of these? A lot of the selection may get done for you. In general the formal postbac programs do a good job covering the MCAT material, and will all make you work for your grades.

I will be applying this fall, hopefully I have a shot at most of these programs. I graduated with a 3.7 from tier 1 liberal arts college. That was with almost no science; I did take several math courses in college and got A's in those. I've also got some nice soft factors (peace corps, experience in a clinical setting, etc) that should be appealing. Bryn Mawr looks like the most selective program so I'm not counting on getting in there, but I'm not sure whether I'm a shoe in at the others.

 

[letitgo]

I went through the post-bac at Northwestern, but on an informal basis. I don't think it's very hard to get in there, but the program is solid. Classes and tests were very fair, and the teaching was good. I did not take Orgo there because I took one semester as an undergrad, and was told to avoid taking it at Northwestern at all costs. So I'll probably take the other semester at Loyola. Overall I'd recommend it, though.

 

[mzeroapplicant]

I went through the post-bac at Northwestern, but on an informal basis. I don't think it's very hard to get in there, but the program is solid. Classes and tests were very fair, and the teaching was good. I did not take Orgo there because I took one semester as an undergrad, and was told to avoid taking it at Northwestern at all costs. So I'll probably take the other semester at Loyola. Overall I'd recommend it, though.

Thanks for the info on Northwestern, this helps to confirm everything I've heard about it. By the way, have you heard anything about Loyola?

 

[Pemulis]

Goucher: I hear the teaching is great, not sure about test/grades.

Everyone can get an A in the courses at Goucher--and most do. But, you have to work hard for it. There are no shortcuts, but at the same time there are no curves either, and the profs aren't looking to make life arbitrarily difficult.

 

[mzeroapplicant]

Everyone can get an A in the courses at Goucher--and most do. But, you have to work hard for it. There are no shortcuts, but at the same time there are no curves either, and the profs aren't looking to make life arbitrarily difficult.

Thanks for the info on Goucher, that sounds like the sort of program that I'm looking for. They also have some linkages, which would mean possibly avoiding a glide year.

 

[AmyGW]

I will be applying this fall, hopefully I have a shot at most of these programs. I graduated with a 3.7 from tier 1 liberal arts college. That was with almost no science; I did take several math courses in college and got A's in those. I've also got some nice soft factors (peace corps, experience in a clinical setting, etc) that should be appealing. Bryn Mawr looks like the most selective program so I'm not counting on getting in there, but I'm not sure whether I'm a shoe in at the others.

Goucher is just as difficult to get into as Bryn Mawr... maybe even more so since its class is significantly smaller. As far as reputation and quality, they are virtually the same. Also, they are only one year, and they both have excellent linkages (which quite a few people, myself included, utilized). I'm not sure about the other programs you listed, though *I think* Bennington at least is two years.

Your stats are good. I would say an undergrad gpa of 3.7 was probably about average at Goucher when I went there. I'm not really sure, since no one outwardly discussed it, but that was the impression I got. The soft factors are what will make you stand out, though. The fact that you were in the peace corps will definitely help you out, and having experience in a clinical setting works in your favor, as well.

I'm a real proponent of the Goucher/Bryn Mawr type programs, because I think you really get the most out of your post-bacc experience there. They are extremely rigorous, but you are showing the medical school admissions committees that you can take a full load of science classes and succeed, while studying for the MCAT, while volunteering, etc. They are expensive, and difficult, and sometimes frustrating, but if you do well, you are very attractive to medical schools.

As far as quality of teaching goes, I can't speak for Bryn Mawr, but Goucher was excellent. There may have been a few students who felt a profound sense of injustice over the fact that they weren't doing as well in physics as they expected, but all of our professors were 100% fair all the time. Tests were sometimes hard, but I think most students would agree that if you felt you didn't do well, it was usually because you didn't study as much as you should have - not because the tests were unfair or convoluted.

Anyway, I hope this helped. If you have any more questions, feel free to ask!

AmyGW

 

[letitgo]

Does anyone know anything about Bryn Mawr's courses? I may take organic chemistry there in the summer, was wondering if anyone knows anything about the difficulty (ie. how hard is it to get A's). I heard about rampant grade inflation over there from someone.

 

[Trismegistus4]

I will be applying this fall, hopefully I have a shot at most of these programs. I graduated with a 3.7 from tier 1 liberal arts college. That was with almost no science; I did take several math courses in college and got A's in those. I've also got some nice soft factors (peace corps, experience in a clinical setting, etc) that should be appealing. Bryn Mawr looks like the most selective program so I'm not counting on getting in there, but I'm not sure whether I'm a shoe in at the others.

FYI, you're definitely a shoe-in at Penn.

 

[mzeroapplicant]

FYI, you're definitely a shoe-in at Penn.

Thanks, I'll definitely be applying there in the fall.

 

[Andes87]

Does anyone have any opinions on the Harvard post bac?

 

[wpeck]

Does anyone have any opinions on the Harvard post bac?

bump

 

[MissGlassSir]

...Do NOT go to CUNY (City University of New York). I'd be inclined to say the same for any big public school, though I can only speak from my experience.

Here's the problem: You can't get the classes you need when you need them because everything is overcrowded. I couldn't start my Gen Chem sequence until my third semester, and it is thus taking me 2 1/2 years to finish eveything. Second, at a school that has very low admissions standards (like the CUNYs), the classes are created to weed out as many people as possible from pursuing pre-med, and the faculty does not care about fairness. I had a high 80 average in a Bio class in which the average was a 50 - guess what I got? A B+. This is because they "don't curve." The Bio professor flat-out said to me that they "aim to fail 40% of the class." The tests are ungrammatical, the questions have more than one right answer or no right answers, but the professors don't care as long as "only" 40% fails. Bottom line, they are NOT on your side. They do not care if you get into medical school. Private post-bacc programs care tremendously. Even if they cost more, they are totally worth it, because you will actually get into a U.S. medical school. If you go to a big public school, this is not a guarantee, no matter how hard you work.

As a side note, one more issue is that at my school the "pre-health advisors" literally know absolutely nothing about med school. NOTHING.

I went to a small, first-tier private school for undergrad, where I know for a fact that unfair exams, no curves, and a 40% fail rate would not fly. Seeing the differences between large public vs. small private has been an eye-opening sociological experience.

Main point: Avoid doing a post-bacc at CUNY.

 

[drizzt3117]

The Scripps program (along with BM and Goucher) are the big three formal postbacs if you will. It's smaller than the Goucher and BM programs (15-18) and probably about the same in terms of selectiveness, and has a number of linkages, which about half the class each year tends to use. I've posted a lot more information about the program in the Prospective Scripps College Postbac thread, so you can check it out there, but the cliff notes are that you take classes with other Claremont College undergrads, but there are no curves. Class size is extremely small, all classes are taught by faculty, and there is no grad school there so the faculty are focused on teaching. I believe the student:teacher ratio is somewhere around 10:1, and like Goucher and BM which are also excellent programs, 100% of people successfully finishing the program have been accepted to medical schools in the last five years.

I think the average GPAs for the postbac program are around 3.75 or so, it's rigorous and pretty good preparation for the MCAT but not ridiculous. One enormous advantage is Scripps' partnership with the Berkeley Review for MCAT prep, giving their students the best possible test preparation IMO. Most of the postbacs still had time to enjoy the numerous recreational options in the greater Los Angeles area.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=455275

Feel free to reply to the Scripps College thread if you have specific questions about the program.

 

[lawnboy313]

Does anyone know anything about Bryn Mawr's courses? I may take organic chemistry there in the summer, was wondering if anyone knows anything about the difficulty (ie. how hard is it to get A's). I heard about rampant grade inflation over there from someone.

Didn't go to Bryn Mawr--I did UConn's program--but I have a close friend who did.

For BM, exams are take home, so you take them at your own convenience--so no having to perform under the gun. You are graded on a curve with the undergrads even though you take classes only with post-bacs. The end result is that your B's become A's--my friend wasn't a natural at the sciences, but she had no problem getting a 4.0 at BM. Not to say that it's a walk in the park, but it's pretty cush compared to other programs (UConn included).

 

[NYCFL]

Are you referring to the City College or Hunter program? The Hunter program talks about linkage programs on its site and acceptance rates of 65%+. I'm checking out this option and your feedback can be very helpful. Thanks.

 

[sleffel]

How hard is it to get into the Post-Bacc program at Northwestern? I'm applying soon and I'm super worried. I have a 3.0 GPA and am currently taking classes at Northwestern and getting A's. Yikes.

 

[JES224]

Does anyone know anything about the American University post-bacc? It says it has an 86% acceptance rate to med school which seems really high, but I haven't heard much else about it...