I am currently in contract negotiations for a t-t faculty position and (among other requests) I am writing in the costs of my licensure into my start-up package. I will be entering the position straight out of internship (yes I know there are lots of pros and cons for doing this; I've already hashed them out and decided I'm taking the plunge) and thus I'm trying to estimate the cost of supervision during the postdoctoral hours I will be accruing while on faculty. Given the requirements of licensure in this state, assuming I dedicate one day/week towards 'direct service hours' (assuming a 10-hour day, with at least 50% of the time being face-to-face), I'll need 75 weeks of supervised practice (as the rest of my hours can be fulfilled through related activities, such as research and teaching). The state requires one hour of weekly supervision during the postdoctoral period. Do you have any thoughts on how much money I should estimate for weekly supervision costs? Thanks for your help!
PhD/PsyD Postdoctoral Hours & Supervision in Faculty Position
- Thread starter SLB-CO
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I took the plunge too-- some hoops but I'm very happy and think its working out. My friend in a similar situation budgeted the cost of one therapy hour per hour of supervision -- the going rate was comparable when she priced it out. Another option you may have already explored is to see if they have faculty either at that campus or at another/satellite campus who could do it for free. I have at least two friends going that route.
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I had a friend do this and she was able to get a fellow faculty member to provide supervision for free; this was part of her contract.
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I've seen others pay outside rates for doctoral supervision and it was often not cheap- folks I know were charged 100/hour or so.
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Seems dicey and open to a possible ethics violation for multiple relationships.
Yep, that's why I'm seeking supervision outside of the department. I know departments that offered that, but it seems like shaky territory. Thanks all for weighing in. I had been planning to factor in $150/hour, so it's nice to know that me spit-balling is higher than what it might end up eventually costing.
D
deleted343839
Sounds like a good plan. Congrats on the new job!
Thank you! It's the position that inspired me to get on the job market this year, so it is exciting to see things work out!
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possibly, but in many states it isn't legal to charge postdocs for supervision, so there are ethical questions on both sides.
FWIW, this person was in a state where supervision was for anything in the professional practice of psychology, and could be done entirely through supervision of teaching activities - if you imagine how that plays out, it seems quite reasonable that a more senior faculty member would provide mentorship and supervision to a new faculty member, no?
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Not sure I'd use that reason to justify an ethics violation. The board would not agree. And regardless of the supervision, the supervisor is in a position to sign the paperwork saying whether or not the supervisee is competent in whatever they are being supervised in. Having a lateral colleague perform this is problematic. Certainly not the worst violation I've seen, but certainly one I would stay away from , personally.
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There's a difference between a lateral colleague and a senior colleague. In my department, new faculty are supervised by those with supervisory status with the state, which is a select few senior faculty. Not lateral in faculty status (though I guess kinda lateral in the realm of faculty voting and all--everyone gets one vote). We use this system because otherwise new faculty can't really supervise in our in-house training clinic, it would be weird if an outside person were privvy to clinic cases and student information (and supervision counts as direct service hours). I can certainly see a potential ethics conflict here, but is fine with our board and has worked for the last 5 new faculty.
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An argument could be made that the colleague who is licensed would not really be a lateral colleague even if they are at the same level. In my experience, postdocs tend to automatically relate to or defer to licensed colleagues as being in a position of authority. I really don't see how this could be ethically problematic unless it is something more specific to academia.
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Postdocs are clearly not lateral to full-time staff in pretty much any setting. If you are hired at the same full-time position, you are technically a lateral employee, that they are supervising you, is really just an artificial, and temporary, caveat. I'm sure in some large institutions, this can be done without ethical entanglements, I just remain skeptical.
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I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I am having trouble thinking through what one would do if they were unlicensed, hired to a faculty position, and lived in a state where paying for supervision was not legal. If not by receiving supervision from a licensed more senior faculty member, how would that person get supervision?
(For the record, this is all pretty hypothetical for me; I did a traditional postdoc and am already licensed... so this is just out of curiosity)
For me it is more of an issue of comfort than anything else, but I do also find the multiple relationships issue a bit of an ethical quandary. In my position, I'd be supervised for the clinical hours; another licensed psychologist, such as the department chair, can sign off on the other hours that aren't direct service. While in theory (and apparently in practice) it also works fine to have a colleague (who is naturally more senior if he/she is licensed) supervise that clinical work, ultimately he/she is judging your clinical competency, which presents a very clear power dynamic that could lead to strain in other contexts (even if he/she isn't someone you usually collaborate with). Additionally, you'd probably want your supervisor to be in your specialty area, no? I certainly want that....and so the likelihood that this potential supervisor exists at your institution is slim since they hired you and if that person did already have a position in your department, wouldn't that person be a natural collaborator for research projects? If so, the ethics get really tricky in my mind. Suffice it to say, that's why I'm glad I have the budget to pay someone outside that department, and that the state I took the position in is fine with having the supervision paid for.
