Pre Obama vs Post Obama Crown Cost

[rkamsterdam]

You made my point for me. This can only happen in America because this is a country where your hard work can lead you to success. If you remove the incentive for hard work (high earnings) and spread the wealth like a socialist society you are no longer America.

No one paid for school for me. I did it all on loans. So no I don't feel bad for *most* of our country because they could have done the same thing.

I think that equal opportunity to acheive that american dream does not exist. That's why i choose the side that I'm on. Sure, you can give me some examples of those who rose to prominance from the ghettos, but its rare and exceptional.

It angers me that the republicans have resorted to using scare tactics like socialism. We're america still, guys. It's as silly to call democrats socialist as it is to call republicans fascist. (and maybe I have point with all those puritanistic social restrictions and loss of civil liberties y'all want to force among the americans people)

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[OceanDMD]

I'm sorry but you come across as extremely condescending; typical for dentist, right?

Ocean, did you not read the headlines? The democrat won. If you think liberal views are irrational, you're accusing the majority of Americans as irrational; and surely you didnt mean that. Just face it, your economic views are in the minority as with all the rest the conservatives on this board. History will prove who's right in the end, making this conversation and many immaterial. It just seems so silly for you to resort to name calling when YOU are apparently the one in the wrong on this issue according to national consensus.

I think we are talking about overhead costs and runnning a business. The thread is about raising the fees for dental services performed. Have you performed any dental services for a fee that you have set based on running your business? I dont think Im calling anyone names, Im expressing how I feel during this discussion. There are practicing dentists on this board (some for over 3 and 4 years, and this is your "minority" conservative views) tell you that there will be an impact with Obamas economic philosophy. All I keep hearing from dental students is no it won't. You need to work for the good of humanity. Everyone deserves a piece.


Condescending, maybe I am. I work hard for my money, I payed my own way through my education, I worked while I was in school, I will be paying loans for probably 5-10 more years. I have not had a week off from work in 3 years. I already give 35% of every penny I earn to uncle sam. Whether the taxes are raised 1% or 5 %, I AM TIRED OF GIVING MORE MONEY TO THE GOVERNMENT. Obama's economic plan will do nothing to help the unemployment rate. If anything it will hurt it. Jobs stimulate an economy, not checks in the mail in April to Mr. couch potato courtesy of those putting in 50 hours a week .

I offer my apologies if I have come across arrogant and condescending. If I hurt anyones feelings with my winnie the pooh comment, please forgive me, it was uncalled for. But, im not going to edit it out...

 

[DrJeff]

I think we are talking about overhead costs and runnning a business. The thread is about raising the fees for dental services performed. Have you performed any dental services for a fee that you have set based on running your business? I dont think Im calling anyone names, Im expressing how I feel during this discussion. There are practicing dentists on this board (some for over 3 and 4 years, and this is your "minority" conservative views) tell you that there will be an impact with Obamas economic philosophy. All I keep hearing from dental students is no it won't. You need to work for the good of humanity. Everyone deserves a piece.


Condescending, maybe I am. I work hard for my money, I payed my own way through my education, I worked while I was in school, I will be paying loans for probably 5-10 more years. I have not had a week off from work in 3 years. I already give 35% of every penny I earn to uncle sam. Whether the taxes are raised 1% or 5 %, I AM TIRED OF GIVING MORE MONEY TO THE GOVERNMENT. Obama's economic plan will do nothing to help the unemployment rate. If anything it will hurt it. Jobs stimulate an economy, not checks in the mail in April to Mr. couch potato courtesy of those putting in 50 hours a week .

I offer my apologies if I have come across arrogant and condescending. If I hurt anyones feelings with my winnie the pooh comment, please forgive me, it was uncalled for. But, im not going to edit it out...

Well said Ocean.

(how long until I accused of doing some lewd acts to you again now? )

 

[kevin512]

But i'll tell you one thing. If i'm EVER bitching about my tax burden for the income I make over 250k a year; I, personally (note i said personally) feel as though i should be ashamed of myself because I belong in that fortunate, albeit earned, group that has to worry about such a thing. I've seen with my own eyes human suffering throughout the world (loved ones included) and trust me, dr jeff, our worries are trivial in perspective; and if an increased tax debt causes me to lose sleep, I've lost my grasp of the big picture.

rkam, if you have been to a "3rd world country" then you know Americans are privileged beyond many peoples wildest dreams. You talk about suffering people aboard and your extensive experiences (mostly likely in Eastern Europe) but fail to see that people in middle class live a beautiful life. I for one have not seen anyone ever walk in an Emergency room with cholera shooting out of their butt. BUT you bet I have seen that in the ghetto of India. People in America are lazy and if you want to support them give you money away, but DONT ask me too.

O yeah, did you pay your taxes last year? I assume you are in 35% bracket... did you take extra "patriotic stride" and give an extra 15% or more to charity... I don't think so.

 

[kappa505]

I'm sorry but you come across as extremely condescending; typical for dentist, right?

Ocean, did you not read the headlines? The democrat won. If you think liberal views are irrational, you're accusing the majority of Americans as irrational; and surely you didnt mean that. Just face it, your economic views are in the minority as with all the rest the conservatives on this board. History will prove who's right in the end, making this conversation and many immaterial. It just seems so silly for you to resort to name calling when YOU are apparently the one in the wrong on this issue according to national consensus.

So according to that logic, Nazi Germany was RIGHT. I believe that Hitler was elected under similar circumstances.

 

[kappa505]

rkam, if you have been to a "3rd world country" then you know Americans are privileged beyond many peoples wildest dreams. You talk about suffering people aboard and your extensive experiences (mostly likely in Eastern Europe) but fail to see that people in middle class live a beautiful life. I for one have not seen anyone ever walk in an Emergency room with cholera shooting out of their butt. BUT you bet I have seen that in the ghetto of India. People in America are lazy and if you want to support them give you money away, but DONT ask me too.

O yeah, did you pay your taxes last year? I assume you are in 35% bracket... did you take extra "patriotic stride" and give an extra 15% or more to charity... I don't think so.

Nice in your faces post.

 

[diplo123]

Your taxes under his plan will be lower than under Reagan. They're Clinton levels if you make over 250k. It will help the middle class by focusing on small businesses, which drive our economy for the most part. Just relax folks, you'll do fine.

how much will he raise them (taxes) then?
bush's policies????who has the majority in congress...democrats...who inacted mandatory sub-prime loans..democrats...i dont think you understand the significance of this president...it's veto power and how obama will not use it since he will not need it....
i now understand how little you democrats know about our gov't....you might have a 22AA on your DAT but im sure you have never read our constitution considering you think bush comes up with all of the legislation in our country.

the only reason the republicans are worried now is the simple fact that the democrats might be able to push whatever they want into legislation...not that obama is going to wave a wand and magically make things happen like you think bush did.

 

[bigstix808]

 

[DrReo]

I'm not going to argue with you on this point because I think its valid. You only prove this: that deep down everyone is selfish. Perhaps, its human nature. While, we're in school we're liberal, once we get out in the real world; we're fiscally conservative. it only makes sense.

But i'll tell you one thing. If i'm EVER bitching about my tax burden for the income I make over 250k a year; I, personally (note i said personally) feel as though i should be ashamed of myself because I belong in that fortunate, albeit earned, group that has to worry about such a thing. I've seen with my own eyes human suffering throughout the world (loved ones included) and trust me, dr jeff, our worries are trivial in perspective; and if an increased tax debt causes me to lose sleep, I've lost my grasp of the big picture.

250k? That was a while ago. They have creeped to 200k. Oh yeah, to stick with being consistant, Bidden stated 150k a week ago.

 

[DrReo]

McCain will have to lower his definition of rich to those making over $4.5 million.

 

[rkamsterdam]

rkam, if you have been to a "3rd world country" then you know Americans are privileged beyond many peoples wildest dreams. You talk about suffering people aboard and your extensive experiences (mostly likely in Eastern Europe) but fail to see that people in middle class live a beautiful life. I for one have not seen anyone ever walk in an Emergency room with cholera shooting out of their butt. BUT you bet I have seen that in the ghetto of India. People in America are lazy and if you want to support them give you money away, but DONT ask me too.

O yeah, did you pay your taxes last year? I assume you are in 35% bracket... did you take extra "patriotic stride" and give an extra 15% or more to charity... I don't think so.

More like in your feces post!

I've travelled extensively throughout europe and asia. You're right with the little money I made, I barely had to pay taxes at all . But i can assure you that if someone offered me 250k with a stipulation to work as hard as i could, I would have been willing to pay higher taxes on that 50k.

 

[rkamsterdam]

screw it! The truth is I wanna be rich, too. D*amnit.

 

[lotexigeus]

Let's look at the bright side, at least we will have a president who can give a speech without getting laughed at.

 

[kappa505]

Let's look at the bright side, at least we will have a president who can give a speech without getting laughed at.

I laugh at him when he speaks, his cheeks get all filled with air like he is blowing up a balloon.

 

[kappa505]

screw it! The truth is I wanna be rich, too. D*amnit.

 

[DrReo]

I went to an Obama lying fest. They introduced Obama in a such manner: "One of the greatest presidents of all time was Abraham Lincoln. He, in fact, had only two years of experience. Just like Lincoln, Barack Obama ...."

We laugh before Obama even speaks...

 

[lotexigeus]

to each their own. I laugh at Bush because he sounds like an idiot when he gives a speech. I never found myself laughing when Mccain or Obama gave a speech, i actually listened to what they had to say. Palin, that's a whole other bag of worms.

The bias is strong in this thread.

 

[DrJeff]

to each their own. I laugh at Bush because he sounds like an idiot when he gives a speech. I never found myself laughing when Mccain or Obama gave a speech, i actually listened to what they had to say. Palin, that's a whole other bag of worms.

The bias is strong in this thread.

Just think about it this way. In your careers, you'll have way more patients that have the mannerisms of President Bush and Governor Palin than of President Elect Obama. Think about it

 

[kappa505]

to each their own. I laugh at Bush because he sounds like an idiot when he gives a speech. I never found myself laughing when Mccain or Obama gave a speech, i actually listened to what they had to say. Palin, that's a whole other bag of worms.

The bias is strong in this thread.

The bias was strong in this election.

 

[lotexigeus]

Just think about it this way. In your careers, you'll have way more patients that have the mannerisms of President Bush and Governor Palin than of President Elect Obama. Think about it

I'll be Bush's and Palin's friend all day, they would be a lot more fun to hang out with. (Even though Obama would kick my ass in a game of basketball).

I don't want to see people like that take leadership roles that affect millions of people. think about it

 

[lotexigeus]

The bias was strong in this election.

word, both sides pretty much made me sick to my stomach.

 

[lotexigeus]

Just think about it this way. In your careers, you'll have way more patients that have the mannerisms of President Bush and Governor Palin than of President Elect Obama. Think about it

btw, are you in-between patients or about to head to the golf course?


back to biochem for me.

 

[DrJeff]

btw, are you in-between patients or about to head to the golf course?


back to biochem for me.

Done with my patients. Still have 3 hygienists making $$ for me for the next 1/2 hour or so though today

 

[QCkid]

I'm sorry but you come across as extremely condescending; typical for dentist, right?

Ocean, did you not read the headlines? The democrat won. If you think liberal views are irrational, you're accusing the majority of Americans as irrational; and surely you didnt mean that. Just face it, your economic views are in the minority as with all the rest the conservatives on this board. History will prove who's right in the end, making this conversation and many immaterial. It just seems so silly for you to resort to name calling when YOU are apparently the one in the wrong on this issue according to national consensus.

Yes, and we're all in big trouble as their are getting to be more and more people in this country that think the world owes them a living.

 

[anamod]

Crown prices will not change under Obama, that's just a propaganda!
First of all Obama isn't going to raise your taxes in 2009, and he won't in most of 2010, because Bush's tax cuts expire at the end of that year. At current rates, raising taxes on high earners would have little negative economic impact and would bring in more money for the government.

Both Bush and Clinton were simply reacting to fiscal problems (just like Obama is now) created during the Reagan years. Just as any tax increases that Obama implements a couple of years down the road would be necessitated in part by his predecessor's unwillingness to take fiscal policy seriously.

So stop thinking like a dentist on this issue for once, and look at the economic challenge facing the country as a whole. If economy improves at national level, then dentists will benefit from it.

I raised mine more than I normally would 2 weeks ago due to writing on the wall that Obama would be elected. So don't tell me crown prices didn't go up because of who got elected. I would have raised all me fees also if McCain was elected but not as much as Obama.

 

[anamod]

You made my point for me. This can only happen in America because this is a country where your hard work can lead you to success. If you remove the incentive for hard work (high earnings) and spread the wealth like a socialist society you are no longer America.

No one paid for school for me. I did it all on loans. So no I don't feel bad for *most* of our country because they could have done the same thing.

This is exactly how I feel. If you told me I could only make 65,000 a year as a dentist I would have never gone into this profession. Call me selfish but that amount of money does not cover my headaches of dealing with staff and pain in the butt patients.

 

[1992Corolla]

I do get that people go into dentistry to help people, but don't play the altruism game here and say that it is noble to give away half of your income to help others out.

Everyone knows they shadowed a dentist in high school, saw the dentist drive away in a fast car to a nice house with a yard big enough for a John Deere. We also realized that the Dr. in said discussion went to school for 8+ years, worked hard, and most likely he went through school when Carter was president and interest rates were 18% (My forshadowing of what will happen under Obama and his dem congress-->you heard it here!). They worked harder than the average middle class american and should therefore be compensated more.

So stop with the 'I joined dentistry to give back to those who need help financially'. I am ALL for helping people out. I would much rather give 10% of my income after taxes to charities I deem important, or give out dental care to those who need it...NOT give it to the government and let them figure the best way to use my money. I don't care if it is going to Clinton, Bush1 or Bush2 or Obama. I want to choose where my money goes, they should not have the right to pick for me.

If the plumber down the street wants to earn more money, he should work harder, go back to school, open a business and hire a team of plumbers, etc. He should not simply get a tax refund for being middle class because he supposedly did not have the same upbringing than I did.

I am a scoutmaster for innercity boys in Philly. It is a bad situation they come from. Not one of my scouts comes from a 2 parent home, the schools they go to have very tight security, they get jumped, they have little money, etc, etc. I don't have to travel the world to see that there is suffering. HOWEVER, I stress to each one of these boys that they have a choice to get good grades or get bad grades. They have a choice to stay in school or not. Guess what? They all realize this. They know the options. It's not like because they live off of north broad in philadelphia that they can't go to dental school like me or anyone else.

I recenty came bck from an outreach grad school fair for temple dental. Did you know that if you graduate from cheney college in cheney, PA with a 3.0 and get into dental school at Temple that there is a full ride scholarship for you? The options are out there. The willpower is not.

Sure there are exceptions for everything, these are my observations. New taxes go to what? Public schools that already suck? Medicaid is sure a winner! /sarcasm Medicare works fine too. Welfare? All are run by the federal government and nothing run by the federal government seems to work properly. Free enterprise and hard work is what this country was founded upon (I'll keep the other thing it was founded on out of the discussion - GOD) and that is the way it should remain. Land of opportunity - not land of share the wealth.

Ben the D3...
and no I will not respond, just bored. Last post.

 

[1992Corolla]

I lied, one more comment.
Im not giving amounts, but each year I donate some of my student loans to charities that I know won't waste the money. I don't pay taxes, so it is not a write off. I do believe in helping people. If someone came into my office and had no cash and had a life threatening veneer issue then we would work something out.

I also run websites for non profit organizations. Programs like this are waaaaaaaaaaaay better than taxing small businesses up to 50% because they worked hard to be innovative or provide a professional service, etc.

 

[youngmc27]

I do get that people go into dentistry to help people, but don't play the altruism game here and say that it is noble to give away half of your income to help others out.

Everyone knows they shadowed a dentist in high school, saw the dentist drive away in a fast car to a nice house with a yard big enough for a John Deere. We also realized that the Dr. in said discussion went to school for 8+ years, worked hard, and most likely he went through school when Carter was president and interest rates were 18% (My forshadowing of what will happen under Obama and his dem congress-->you heard it here!). They worked harder than the average middle class american and should therefore be compensated more.

So stop with the 'I joined dentistry to give back to those who need help financially'. I am ALL for helping people out. I would much rather give 10% of my income after taxes to charities I deem important, or give out dental care to those who need it...NOT give it to the government and let them figure the best way to use my money. I don't care if it is going to Clinton, Bush1 or Bush2 or Obama. I want to choose where my money goes, they should not have the right to pick for me.

If the plumber down the street wants to earn more money, he should work harder, go back to school, open a business and hire a team of plumbers, etc. He should not simply get a tax refund for being middle class because he supposedly did not have the same upbringing than I did.

I am a scoutmaster for innercity boys in Philly. It is a bad situation they come from. Not one of my scouts comes from a 2 parent home, the schools they go to have very tight security, they get jumped, they have little money, etc, etc. I don't have to travel the world to see that there is suffering. HOWEVER, I stress to each one of these boys that they have a choice to get good grades or get bad grades. They have a choice to stay in school or not. Guess what? They all realize this. They know the options. It's not like because they live off of north broad in philadelphia that they can't go to dental school like me or anyone else.

I recenty came bck from an outreach grad school fair for temple dental. Did you know that if you graduate from cheney college in cheney, PA with a 3.0 and get into dental school at Temple that there is a full ride scholarship for you? The options are out there. The willpower is not.

Sure there are exceptions for everything, these are my observations. New taxes go to what? Public schools that already suck? Medicaid is sure a winner! /sarcasm Medicare works fine too. Welfare? All are run by the federal government and nothing run by the federal government seems to work properly. Free enterprise and hard work is what this country was founded upon (I'll keep the other thing it was founded on out of the discussion - GOD) and that is the way it should remain. Land of opportunity - not land of share the wealth.

Ben the D3...
and no I will not respond, just bored. Last post.

Amen that is all that needs to be said.

 

[rkamsterdam]

I’m torn with this particular issue. Of course, I, like everyone else in this profession, have chosen the profession of dentistry partly because the lifestyle and earning potential are attractive. So no, of course I am not completely altruistic in my pursuit of a dental degree; Altruism is not a human quality. But, I am also choosing the profession because it makes me feel good to help others. I think this is an ideal that most young dental students subscribe to.
It seems to me after noting responses from this board that somewhere along the way in your career that the former reason for choosing dentistry greatly overshadows the latter. I know by nature of our chosen career we cant help but play an intergral role in many lives on a daily basis, but none the less the majority of thread topics have much to do with taxes, money, etc and little describing the positive effect you’ve had on a patient. Also, I think that the fact that a majority of dentists are conservatives is kinda contradictory. By nature, dentists help others and are financially rewarded for their efforts, no doubt. But when it comes to a percentage of their personal income – hell no! even if that money could go the overall benefit of this country and its own people. (Just to get off track for a sec – we’re wasting billions in the middle east – and those who voted for john mccain seem not to care about this, I mean why not invest a small portion of this money in our own citizens- it makes sense to me). Now, I’m not sure if raising taxes is the way to go here, I’ll admit that. But the main point of this post is that there is a problem in America with equal opportunity especially among America’s poor (the fact that we have such a large amount of poor is shameful, IMO). And its easy for us to say that they’re lazy, they had the choice to do well in school, blah blah blah (this way it allows us to feel guiltless when we see them begging on the street); But that’s not the truth. They don’t have supportive parents who make sure they do their homework, get good grades, help you with studying, etc which I’m sure most of you out there including myself had. There is a cultural divide, here, and something must be done, I think. Those innercity kids don’t have the same opportunities as you, corolla. Its really not hard to see that. I really just want people to realize this when they go out there and make a good living for themselves as dentists. These are our neighbors, these are our patients; they aren’t lazy and no good (but even those that are deserve help – this is what separates us from lower mammals- this is why those who don’t have money/insurance are still treated in the ER) And as responsible dentists/ human beings it should be in our nature to help those in need, and there are plenty in need in our country. What exactly should be done about it, I don’t know; but I’m willing as I feel others should be to spend some of my time and money into helping those in an unfortunate situation.

 

[kevin512]

rkam,

It seems to me that you think that the American Dream is dead. I think you are dead wrong.

My father came to America with nothing. My mother came here with a Dental Degree and wasn't allowed to practice is Louisiana because she was foreign born. My parents did not start off on this "level plain" you speak of and have grown to be very successful in this nation which I have much patriotism for now. In addition, they never thought it was right to take money from someone and give it to them because they were less fortunate (they lived in a mobile home for 6 years). Might I add that they did not know the culture or people here.

For the little black boy in the mobile home park, I would curse at him if he said the American Dream was dead.

After cursing I might still have the gusto to lift my finger and point to the Obama signs that litter his dirt road subdivision.

 

[swartz23]

I'm sorry but you come across as extremely condescending; typical for dentist, right?

Ocean, did you not read the headlines? The democrat won. If you think liberal views are irrational, you're accusing the majority of Americans as irrational; and surely you didnt mean that. Just face it, your economic views are in the minority as with all the rest the conservatives on this board. History will prove who's right in the end, making this conversation and many immaterial. It just seems so silly for you to resort to name calling when YOU are apparently the one in the wrong on this issue according to national consensus.

The majority of Americans are irrational.

 

[kappa505]

I’m torn with this particular issue. Of course, I, like everyone else in this profession, have chosen the profession of dentistry partly because the lifestyle and earning potential are attractive. So no, of course I am not completely altruistic in my pursuit of a dental degree; Altruism is not a human quality Feels good to be truthful to yourself doesn't it. But, I am also choosing the profession because it makes me feel good to help others. I think this is an ideal that most young dental students subscribe to.
It seems to me after noting responses from this board that somewhere along the way in your career that the former reason for choosing dentistry greatly overshadows the latter. I know by nature of our chosen career we cant help but play an intergral role in many lives on a daily basis, but none the less the majority of thread topics have much to do with taxes, money, etc and little describing the positive effect you’ve had on a patient. That's because topics like missions trips to third world countries are not thought, self belief challenging topics. Also, I think that the fact that a majority of dentists are conservatives is kinda contradictory. By nature, dentists help others and are financially rewarded for their efforts, no doubt. But when it comes to a percentage of their personal income – hell no! even if that money could go the overall benefit of this country and its own people. (Just to get off track for a sec – we’re wasting billions in the middle east – and those who voted for john mccain seem not to care about this, I mean why not invest a small portion of this money in our own citizens- it makes sense to me).Teach a man to fish and he has not excuse for being hungry, give a man a fish and you will see him tomorrow with a hungry friend. Now, I’m not sure if raising taxes is the way to go here, I’ll admit that. But the main point of this post is that there is a problem in America with equal opportunity especially among America’s poor (the fact that we have such a large amount of poor is shameful, IMO) Especially when there are so many programs and help already in place. And its easy for us to say that they’re lazy, they had the choice to do well in school, blah blah blah (this way it allows us to feel guiltless when we see them begging on the street); But that’s not the truth. They don’t have supportive parents who make sure they do their homework, get good grades, help you with studying, etc which I’m sure most of you out there including myself had. There is a cultural divide, here, and something must be done, I think. Thats why we need to start teaching people to be responsible for their own actions. Also, how can we close the cultural divide when so many different cultures cling to their teachings even when they are detrimental to their success. Those innercity kids don’t have the same opportunities as you, corolla. Its really not hard to see that. Or they choose not to see those opportunities that do exist. I really just want people to realize this when they go out there and make a good living for themselves as dentists. So we can feel obligated to pay more than our fair share? These are our neighbors, these are our patients; they aren’t lazy and no good (but even those that are deserve help not a free ride– this is what separates us from lower mammals- this is why those who don’t have money/insurance are still treated in the ER) And as responsible dentists/ human beings it should be in our nature to help those in need, and there are plenty in need in our country. People in our country dont need, they WANT. What exactly should be done about it, I don’t know; but I’m willing as I feel others should be to spend some of my time and money into helping those in an unfortunate situation. This is where I begin to question who you think that you are to say that you FEEL I SHOULD spend some of my time and money. Think about the time that you would be able to retire if you were not working 1/2 of the year for free. Think about how much time you could spend with your children, wife, husband, parents, fishing, working out, reading a book. To see your money go to a wasteful government, even if they spend on things that you believe in it is still going to be wasteful. You need to ask yourself how many of these unfortunate people have over 100,000 in debt, or if any of them ever took a chance on themselves. Using words like unfortunate take all the choice out of situations, making humans helpless and irresponsible for the outcome of their lives, I dont agree with that mindset at all, it is for losers and criminals. I need to replace the clutch on my jeep, how about you pay for half? I will let you off free for the labor since I will be doing it. I am unfortunate because I somehow ended up with a car the breaks, I dont recall picking it out, or handing over the money, it fell from the sky. HELP ME

 

[kappa505]

rkam,

It seems to me that you think that the American Dream is dead. I think you are dead wrong.

My father came to America with nothing. My mother came here with a Dental Degree and wasn't allowed to practice is Louisiana because she was foreign born. My parents did not start off on this "level plain" you speak of and have grown to be very successful in this nation which I have much patriotism for now. In addition, they never thought it was right to take money from someone and give it to them because they were less fortunate (they lived in a mobile home for 6 years). Might I add that they did not know the culture or people here.

For the little black boy in the mobile home park, I would curse at him if he said the American Dream was dead.

After cursing I might still have the gusto to lift my finger and point to the Obama signs that litter his dirt road subdivision.

These people make the best Americans. Thank your parents for not relying on fortune and making the educated CHOICE to come to America. You inherited their good decision. My father lives in a mobile home .

 

[swartz23]

I’m torn with this particular issue. Of course, I, like everyone else in this profession, have chosen the profession of dentistry partly because the lifestyle and earning potential are attractive. So no, of course I am not completely altruistic in my pursuit of a dental degree; Altruism is not a human quality. But, I am also choosing the profession because it makes me feel good to help others. I think this is an ideal that most young dental students subscribe to.
It seems to me after noting responses from this board that somewhere along the way in your career that the former reason for choosing dentistry greatly overshadows the latter. I know by nature of our chosen career we cant help but play an intergral role in many lives on a daily basis, but none the less the majority of thread topics have much to do with taxes, money, etc and little describing the positive effect you’ve had on a patient. Also, I think that the fact that a majority of dentists are conservatives is kinda contradictory. By nature, dentists help others and are financially rewarded for their efforts, no doubt. But when it comes to a percentage of their personal income – hell no! even if that money could go the overall benefit of this country and its own people. (Just to get off track for a sec – we’re wasting billions in the middle east – and those who voted for john mccain seem not to care about this, I mean why not invest a small portion of this money in our own citizens- it makes sense to me). Now, I’m not sure if raising taxes is the way to go here, I’ll admit that. But the main point of this post is that there is a problem in America with equal opportunity especially among America’s poor (the fact that we have such a large amount of poor is shameful, IMO). And its easy for us to say that they’re lazy, they had the choice to do well in school, blah blah blah (this way it allows us to feel guiltless when we see them begging on the street); But that’s not the truth. They don’t have supportive parents who make sure they do their homework, get good grades, help you with studying, etc which I’m sure most of you out there including myself had. There is a cultural divide, here, and something must be done, I think. Those innercity kids don’t have the same opportunities as you, corolla. Its really not hard to see that. I really just want people to realize this when they go out there and make a good living for themselves as dentists. These are our neighbors, these are our patients; they aren’t lazy and no good (but even those that are deserve help – this is what separates us from lower mammals- this is why those who don’t have money/insurance are still treated in the ER) And as responsible dentists/ human beings it should be in our nature to help those in need, and there are plenty in need in our country. What exactly should be done about it, I don’t know; but I’m willing as I feel others should be to spend some of my time and money into helping those in an unfortunate situation.

I would challenge everyone with some thoughts.
Giving unconditional financial assistance to the economically needy is not helpful. In fact, a long term dependency develops and the recipient becomes crippled, unable to ever reach their full potential... and their kids, and their kids' kids, etc.

Furthermore, throwing money at a problem is the easy way out. Perhaps our government officials are the lazy ones. They don't have a real answer, but they can't just do nothing; so they convince us that giving more money is helpful, and we love 'em for it.

In addition to re-learning the meaning of "no", our country needs to think long term when suggesting policy reform. Lastly, those who really want to make a difference need to step into community leadership roles as mentors offering to individuals relationship and character growth, not a free ride. Keep your money and make a real investment.

 

[diplo123]

I agree with you 100%. People shouldn't be getting a free living with other's money for doing nothing. The thing is, nobody, not Barack, or anybody in power, is saying we should or will do this. All he's saying is that he's going to give a little tax relief to the middle class, and return the over 250k crowd to pre-bush tax levels. I know it's a bummer, but most employment comes from small businesses under 250k and they need to be stimulated to make jobs.

This will mean more people who get cosmetic dentistry and things like that. Everything will be fine, I hope.

I would challenge everyone with some thoughts.
Giving unconditional financial assistance to the economically needy is not helpful. In fact, a long term dependency develops and the recipient becomes crippled, unable to ever reach their full potential... and their kids, and their kids' kids, etc.

Furthermore, throwing money at a problem is the easy way out. Perhaps our government officials are the lazy ones. They don't have a real answer, but they can't just do nothing; so they convince us that giving more money is helpful, and we love 'em for it.

In addition to re-learning the meaning of "no", our country needs to think long term when suggesting policy reform. Lastly, those who really want to make a difference need to step into community leadership roles as mentors offering to individuals relationship and character growth, not a free ride. Keep your money and make a real investment.

 

[USU24]

nevermind

 

[Istr8nthem]

I know it's a bummer, but most employment comes from small businesses under 250k and they need to be stimulated to make jobs.

I beg to differ! This is 100% false.

 

[lotexigeus]

*most people who have jobs get paid less than 250K*

 

[RooRoo1]

Barack has done a number on you guys. The number you hear quoted over and over is 250,000 income. That is HOUSEHOLD income. The individual income is 160,000. This is highest tax bracket now. (Edit: When Obama becomes president)

Also, I would like to state that nothing is stopping anyone from donating their time to help those that are less fortunate. What I don't understand about democrats is that they want the government to force everyone else to do something and then maybe they will to. You are allowed to give more in taxes then you owe. You are allowed to work for 50,000 dollars as a dentist and give the rest in free care. But, liberals never do and never will. Fits with the study that showed Republicans are more generous to charity that came out last year. PUT YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR MOUTH IS. I AM NOT JOKING. I AM NOT USING HYPERBOLE. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO MAKE 160,000 as a dentist. Give away the money in free care.

And to the person who states that he gave some of his loan money to charity last year. That is the most outlandish, stupid thing I have EVER heard on so many levels.

 

[DrReo]

Barack has done a number on you guys. The number you hear quoted over and over is 250,000 income. That is HOUSEHOLD income. The individual income is 160,000. This is highest tax bracket now. (Edit: When Obama becomes president)

Also, I would like to state that nothing is stopping anyone from donating their time to help those that are less fortunate. What I don't understand about democrats is that they want the government to force everyone else to do something and then maybe they will to. You are allowed to give more in taxes then you owe. You are allowed to work for 50,000 dollars as a dentist and give the rest in free care. But, liberals never do and never will. Fits with the study that showed Republicans are more generous to charity that came out last year. PUT YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR MOUTH IS. I AM NOT JOKING. I AM NOT USING HYPERBOLE. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO MAKE 160,000 as a dentist. Give away the money in free care.

And to the person who states that he gave some of his loan money to charity last year. That is the most outlandish, stupid thing I have EVER heard on so many levels.

I stated in one of the threads how Obama donates less than 2% of his income while Biden dontated 700 dollars. Practice what you preach.

 

[swartz23]

And to the person who states that he gave some of his loan money to charity last year. That is the most outlandish, stupid thing I have EVER heard on so many levels.

I agree. I think one level looks like this - BO makes his current income from taxes. So he is really only giving back the money that he took in the first place.

Everybody remember, the government's only income is made by levying taxes on its citizenry.

 

[swartz23]

I agree with you 100%. People shouldn't be getting a free living with other's money for doing nothing. The thing is, nobody, not Barack, or anybody in power, is saying we should or will do this. All he's saying is that he's going to give a little tax relief to the middle class, and return the over 250k crowd to pre-bush tax levels. I know it's a bummer, but most employment comes from small businesses under 250k and they need to be stimulated to make jobs.

This will mean more people who get cosmetic dentistry and things like that. Everything will be fine, I hope.

I commented above that giving unconditional financial assistance to the economically needy is not helpful. In fact, a long term dependency develops and the recipient becomes crippled, unable to ever reach their full potential... and their kids, and their kids' kids, etc. I know you think I meant those at or below the poverty line, but what if I meant the middle class?

Furthermore, I suggested that throwing money at a problem is the easy way out and our politicians lack any better ideas or the need to come up with any because we'll vote 'em back in anyway.

My concept transcends just one socioeconomic class or entity. For example, if we swoop in to loan the auto industry a bunch of money out of fear, we are ignoring the underlying problem, and it will crop up again and again and again... in 15 years, 10 years, 5 years.

 

[swartz23]

I agree with you 100%. People shouldn't be getting a free living with other's money for doing nothing. The thing is, nobody, not Barack, or anybody in power, is saying we should or will do this. All he's saying is that he's going to give a little tax relief to the middle class, and return the over 250k crowd to pre-bush tax levels. I know it's a bummer, but most employment comes from small businesses under 250k and they need to be stimulated to make jobs.

This will mean more people who get cosmetic dentistry and things like that. Everything will be fine, I hope.

Is this a false assumption? Correct me if I'm wrong, but when I see someone use "Bush" in explanations or arguments I can't help but get the impression that it would not have mattered who was running against BO. I get the feeling that you would have voted BO even if he was campaigning against a dog.

This makes one appear a little prejudiced and close-minded. To me, it gives the appearance that someone is less of a thinker and more of a follower. Sorry if this is not the case.

 

[OceanDMD]

Subject: OBAMA'S PLUMBING PROBLEMS



Barack Obama discovers a leak under his sink, so he calls Joe the
Plumber to come and fix it. Joe drives to Obama's house, which is
located in a very nice neighborhood and where it's clear that all the
residents make more than $250,000 per year. Joe arrives and takes his
tools into the house. Joe is led to the room that contains the leaky
pipe under a sink. Joe assesses the problem and tells Obama, who is
standing near the door, that it's an easy repair that will take less
than 10 minutes. Obama asks Joe how much it will cost.


Joe immediately says, "$9,500."


"$9,500?" Obama asks, stunned. "But you said it's an easy repair!"


"Yes, but what I do is charge a lot more to my clients who make more
than $250,000 per year so I can fix the plumbing of everybody who makes
less than that for free," explains Joe. "It's always been my philosophy.
As a matter of fact, I lobbied government to pass this philosophy as
law, and it did pass earlier this year, so now all plumbers have to do
business this way. It's known as 'Joe's Fair Plumbing Act of 2008.'
Surprised you haven't heard of it, Senator."


In spite of that, Obama tells Joe there's no way he's paying that much
for a small plumbing repair, so Joe leaves.


Obama spends the next hour flipping through the phone book looking for
another plumber, but he finds that all other plumbing businesses listed
have gone out of business. Not wanting to pay Joe's price, Obama does
nothing. The leak under Obama's sink goes unrepaired for the next
several days.
A week later the leak is so bad that Obama has had to put a bucket under
the sink. The bucket fills up quickly and has to be emptied every hour,
and there's a risk that the room will flood, so Obama calls Joe and
pleads with him to return.


Joe goes back to Obama's house, looks at the leaky pipe, and says "Let's
see ? this will cost you about $21,000."


"A few days ago you told me it would cost $9,500!" Obama quickly fires
back.


Joe explains the reason for the dramatic increase. "Well, because of the
'Joe's Fair Plumbing Act,' a lot of rich people are learning how to fix
their own plumbing, so there are fewer of you paying for all the free
plumbing I'm doing for the people who make less than $250,000. As a
result, the rate I have to charge my wealthy paying customers rises
every day.


"Not only that, but for some reason the demand for plumbing work from
the group of people who get it for free has skyrocketed, and there's a
long waiting list of those who need repairs. This has put a lot of my
fellow plumbers out of business, and they're not being replaced. Nobody
is going into the plumbing business because they know they won't make
any money. I'm hurting now too , all thanks to greedy rich people like
you who won't pay their fair share."


Obama tries to straighten out the plumber: "Of course you're hurting,
Joe! Don't you get it? If all the rich people learn how to fix their own
plumbing and you refuse to charge the poorer people for your services,
you'll be broke, and then what will you do?"


Joe immediately replies, "Run for president, apparently."

Courtesy of Sean Hannity

 

[ObliqueRidge]

I agree with you 100%. People shouldn't be getting a free living with other's money for doing nothing. The thing is, nobody, not Barack, or anybody in power, is saying we should or will do this. All he's saying is that he's going to give a little tax relief to the middle class, and return the over 250k crowd to pre-bush tax levels. I know it's a bummer, but most employment comes from small businesses under 250k and they need to be stimulated to make jobs.

This will mean more people who get cosmetic dentistry and things like that. Everything will be fine, I hope.

please show me where most employment comes from small businesses making under 250K b.c. you have been sucked into the media trap on that one. And yes you hope for stuff, but hope only gets you elected president so far.

 

[denner]

The majority of Americans are irrational.

^
this

 

[DestinedDentist]

Come on, you guys! It all comes down to collectivism vs. individualism. American traditional individualism is what has made this country great.

 

[chibipinkbunny]

I think that equal opportunity to acheive that american dream does not exist. That's why i choose the side that I'm on. Sure, you can give me some examples of those who rose to prominance from the ghettos, but its rare and exceptional.

It angers me that the republicans have resorted to using scare tactics like socialism. We're america still, guys. It's as silly to call democrats socialist as it is to call republicans fascist. (and maybe I have point with all those puritanistic social restrictions and loss of civil liberties y'all want to force among the americans people)

Lol, you sure its just Republicans thinking this country is headed towards socialism. I have quite a few liberal friends who have acknowledged this trend, and felt it was for the best actually. My sister's communistic/socialistic boyfriend from Poland also feels we're strongly headed towards socialism. No, I'm not making this up, her boyfriend is a self declared Marxist. He also thinks its for the best. So yeah, its not just conservatives and Republicans using scare tactics. When someone says they are going to, "spread the wealth," I believe them. How much closer to a definition of socialism do you need?

 

[krstfrb]

Lol, you sure its just Republicans thinking this country is headed towards socialism. I have quite a few liberal friends who have acknowledged this trend, and felt it was for the best actually. My sister's communistic/socialistic boyfriend from Poland also feels we're strongly headed towards socialism. No, I'm not making this up, her boyfriend is a self declared Marxist. He also thinks its for the best. So yeah, its not just conservatives and Republicans using scare tactics. When someone says they are going to, "spread the wealth," I believe them. How much closer to a definition of socialism do you need?

I have to agree with you on this one... it's not just Republicans who think we are headed toward socialism... it's ignorant people in general who have no clue that America is traditionally capitalist with governmental regulations (the socialism part) that works on a sliding scale when related to taxation. The actual issue is not whether we become socialist or not, but whether the "rich" should be taxed at a higher rate or not. Technically, the government not allowing Google and Yahoo to merge is socialist. Antitrust lawsuits against Microsoft is socialist. It is preventing the monopolization of wealth and allowing it to be "spread" across numerous other companies. I don't hear too much whining about that though. I guess its all relative huh? America will never be purely capitalist OR socialist. It never has been.