Preceptor not allowing me time off for interviews?

[microshar88]

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Hi,
So to recap a little about me, I failed the COMLEX PE on my first attempt in the summer and retook it a couple months ago and found I passed. By the time I found I passed, I had to attend interviews in places that were out of state (which were very few to begin with considering how little interest people showed in me with my low board scores as well).

Anyhow, I did some calling around and I got a few interview invites in local places but the problem is that I now have to do my fourth year cores (critical care, EM etc.) The chill preceptor rotations that I scheduled (FM,IM outpatient) did not benefit me so much since I didn't have a lot of interviews those months. Now, come January, i'm getting interviews and I have a tough Pulm/CC rotation, I can't get time off as much. I was wondering if anyone had any advice for me? Should I request a leave of absence? I really feel like my school should be helping me with this rather than just say you can't take time off for interviews and you should just cancel. I'm a special situation considering I failed the PE and a lot of places didn't even touch my app until they saw the passing score to consider me.

Our school has a policy where you must send in rotation approvals 60 days in advance so i can't even do a rotation with someone (like my classmates dad who is a Ped's Hem/Onc doc.

Should I try confronting an official at my school like the associate dean or something? I feel like they should care more about me securing a residency position by garnering as many interviews as possible as opposed to just getting angry if I miss a few day of an outpatient rotation (which I have done several off by this point).

Thanks

 

[NurWollen]

Hi,
So to recap a little about me, I failed the COMLEX PE on my first attempt in the summer and retook it a couple months ago and found I passed. By the time I found I passed, I had to attend interviews in places that were out of state (which were very few to begin with considering how little interest people showed in me with my low board scores as well).

Anyhow, I did some calling around and I got a few interview invites in local places but the problem is that I now have to do my fourth year cores (critical care, EM etc.) The chill preceptor rotations that I scheduled (FM,IM outpatient) did not benefit me so much since I didn't have a lot of interviews those months. Now, come January, i'm getting interviews and I have a tough Pulm/CC rotation, I can't get time off as much. I was wondering if anyone had any advice for me? Should I request a leave of absence? I really feel like my school should be helping me with this rather than just say you can't take time off for interviews and you should just cancel. I'm a special situation considering I failed the PE and a lot of places didn't even touch my app until they saw the passing score to consider me.

Our school has a policy where you must send in rotation approvals 60 days in advance so i can't even do a rotation with someone (like my classmates dad who is a Ped's Hem/Onc doc.

Should I try confronting an official at my school like the associate dean or something? I feel like they should care more about me securing a residency position by garnering as many interviews as possible as opposed to just getting angry if I miss a few day of an outpatient rotation (which I have done several off by this point).

Thanks

Have you tried going in to speak with a dean/associate dean without being confrontational? Could you maybe talk them and see what advice they might have?

 

[microshar88]

Have you tried going in to speak with a dean/associate dean without being confrontational? Could you maybe talk them and see what advice they might have?

No but i will try that. maybe they will be sympathetic towards me.

 

[costales]

You could just ask your attending/chief resident for extra night/weekend hours to make up for your time off.

 

[racerwad]

You could just ask your attending/chief resident for extra night/weekend hours to make up for your time off.

The title of your thread states that your preceptor won't let you miss days, however, the body of your posts suggests that it's a school issue, rather than a preceptor. Is this correct? Sounds like Western...

Anyhow, I would just work it out with your preceptor and have them keep it between the two of you. I've done similar it hasn't been an issue (yet). In the ICU, it should be very easy to miss days since the unit is open 24/7 - you could just work weekends or nights to make up the time lost. I'm having to be more creative on my clinic-based rotations to make up missed days since they only work M-F 9-5.

I agree that it is in the school's interest to help you match since that is essentially what you're paying them for. Unfortunately, the reality does not seem to be this way for many DO schools.

 

[deleted480308]

I would drop the thought process that the school owes you extra consideration because you failed a test...offer to work every other waking that month for your preceptor in exchange for time to interview, they know you need to interview and most will work with you

 

[SLC]

Like others have said, offer to work whatever extra time you can to make up for it. Preceptors usually don't even take you up on the offer anyway, but it shows dedication. They all know you have to interview and will do their best to help you out.

I have been shocked at my schools response to this type of situation. But I get the picture that it may be a COCA issue more than a school issue in my school's case.

 

[Siggy]

The title of your thread states that your preceptor won't let you miss days, however, the body of your posts suggests that it's a school issue, rather than a preceptor. Is this correct? Sounds like Western...

HAHAHA... Western University, where what the school doesn't know won't hurt them. Granted, it's the school that gave me grief because I decided to fly home to be at my Mother's bedside when she died, but humanism only applies to the students, not the school (and, yes, I wish I was joking about this, but the school didn't even get around to approving my time off request until after I graduated).

 

[hallowmann]

You could just ask your attending/chief resident for extra night/weekend hours to make up for your time off.

This is the best option. It seems many DO schools have this policy, and people get around it by getting permission from their preceptor/attending to take the days and make them up in weekends and nights.

 

[costales]

Yep, that is one of the worst-kept secrets in med school. There is much willingness to help 4th years during interview season. The key is to be proactive, communicate and ask nicely. People know that the physical presence of 4th years is not indispensable to the functioning of a hospital.

 

[racerwad]

HAHAHA... Western University, where what the school doesn't know won't hurt them. Granted, it's the school that gave me grief because I decided to fly home to be at my Mother's bedside when she died, but humanism only applies to the students, not the school (and, yes, I wish I was joking about this, but the school didn't even get around to approving my time off request until after I graduated).

I'm sorry to hear that but I'm definitely not surprised. They also want a doctor's note prior to a doctor's appointment, followed by a doctor's note from said appointment. Good times.

 

[j4pac]

Agree with others:
1) Ask to work an additional shift or two to your attending...and if you are able to get coverage...get coverage.
2) If that fails, go to your Dean in a non-confrontational way

 

[as90]

is this part of Coca guidelines? this is horrendous, you get an interview, you go. no questions asked.

i will never cancel or re-schedule an interview no matter what the consequences are. it is getting harder and harder for us to match as DO's and we need all the interviews we can get. I know that the caribbean students sometimes take 20 interviews for psychiatry and IM specialties. Their schools don't blink an eye.

what you could do is maybe find a person who works in the group and try and work a shift with them when you have a free moment. on another note, if anyone knows, what will happen if you don't graduate on time (like end of may) because of this, could one dip into june and do some like extra shifts or something to make up that time? will a residency program wait for you by a month?

this is the way the real world works, this match system doesnt guarantee you squat. i'm just being honest. also, some specialties interview later than others. i know my school offers a radiology rotation where you can sit on your laptop and view slides with the radiologist. maybe ask around and find out.

#1 priority is to match. your school will not pay your loans after you graduate, you need to make sure you get the best you can in this rotten system.

 

[deleted480308]

is this part of Coca guidelines? this is horrendous, you get an interview, you go. no questions asked.

i will never cancel or re-schedule an interview no matter what the consequences are. it is getting harder and harder for us to match as DO's and we need all the interviews we can get. I know that the caribbean students sometimes take 20 interviews for psychiatry and IM specialties. Their schools don't blink an eye.

what you could do is maybe find a person who works in the group and try and work a shift with them when you have a free moment. on another note, if anyone knows, what will happen if you don't graduate on time (like end of may) because of this, could one dip into june and do some like extra shifts or something to make up that time? will a residency program wait for you by a month?

this is the way the real world works, this match system doesnt guarantee you squat. i'm just being honest. also, some specialties interview later than others. i know my school offers a radiology rotation where you can sit on your laptop and view slides with the radiologist. maybe ask around and find out.

#1 priority is to match. your school will not pay your loans after you graduate, you need to make sure you get the best you can in this rotten system.

this is very bad advice....blowing off your rotation duties against orders is not a good plan. You still have to graduate

 

[as90]

yes, and the school will find a way for you to make missed days up.

 

[microshar88]

thanks guys the preceptor is a sweetheart, who has been nice. i am not alone on the rotation though and a few of my classmates are on the rotation with me (they are done with their interviews because they were for different specialties), i am actually worried about one of them ratting me out to my school more than i am about the preceptor. one of them is a real blabber mouth and can't keep anything to herself, she would literally tell everyone in our tiny class. I don't go to western by the way. but i was under the impression that if the preceptor is ok with it, then no need to worry.

 

[Siggy]

Remember, you don't need approval to not show up on days your preceptor tells you you don't have to be there. Granted, it's much easier for the 24/7 rotations (essentially most hospital based rotations) than the M-F 9-5 office based rotations.

 

[costales]

Remember, you don't need approval to not show up on days your preceptor tells you you don't have to be there.

^ That is #1 high yield right there. If your attending/preceptor agrees you don't have to show up and your paperwork is in order, is your school's attendance clerk going to challenge or overrule them? Hell no.

 

[serimeri]

HAHAHA... Western University, where what the school doesn't know won't hurt them. Granted, it's the school that gave me grief because I decided to fly home to be at my Mother's bedside when she died, but humanism only applies to the students, not the school (and, yes, I wish I was joking about this, but the school didn't even get around to approving my time off request until after I graduated).

My jaw dropped when I read your post. Even in residency, you get emergency leave. What would happen if a student had an surgical emergency or was in a car crash? Would the school not make any allowances? This is totally bizarre and inhumane from my point of view. Life happens and we are not perfect. We are paying a hefty price for this type of treatment? I get preparing us for residency, but does this really make us better physicians?

 

[Siggy]

My jaw dropped when I read your post. Even in residency, you get emergency leave. What would happen if a student had an surgical emergency or was in a car crash? Would the school not make any allowances? This is totally bizarre and inhumane from my point of view. Life happens and we are not perfect. We are paying a hefty price for this type of treatment? I get preparing us for residency, but does this really make us better physicians?

I honestly don't know what the school would do. I'm happy I'll never have to find out.

 

[gators21]

thanks guys the preceptor is a sweetheart, who has been nice. i am not alone on the rotation though and a few of my classmates are on the rotation with me (they are done with their interviews because they were for different specialties), i am actually worried about one of them ratting me out to my school more than i am about the preceptor. one of them is a real blabber mouth and can't keep anything to herself, she would literally tell everyone in our tiny class. I don't go to western by the way. but i was under the impression that if the preceptor is ok with it, then no need to worry.

I don't know where to start with this post
1) Screw your classmates. Look out for yourself. If anyone "tells on you" for looking out for your career, you take them out back of the hospital and beat the living piss out of them. Don't even tell them you are taking the day off. It's none of their business
2) Just tell your preceptor you need the days off for the interview. Try to make it as short a leave as possible. Like don't plan on touring the city for a couple days. Fly in the night before after working your shift and leave the night of the interview. That way you only miss one day. Did this for 14 interview, not one had a problem
3) Don't go in and ask timidly if it is ok for a day off because of blah blah blah. Go in and tell them flatly that you will be missing the day for an interview. Don't give them a bunch of whiny excuses, just tell them you are taking the day off. Screw them they already have done this, they will understand.
This is your career. Don't let anyone keep you from getting the best shot you can at a match

 

[as90]

I don't know where to start with this post
1) Screw your classmates. Look out for yourself. If anyone "tells on you" for looking out for your career, you take them out back of the hospital and beat the living piss out of them. Don't even tell them you are taking the day off. It's none of their business
2) Just tell your preceptor you need the days off for the interview. Try to make it as short a leave as possible. Like don't plan on touring the city for a couple days. Fly in the night before after working your shift and leave the night of the interview. That way you only miss one day. Did this for 14 interview, not one had a problem
3) Don't go in and ask timidly if it is ok for a day off because of blah blah blah. Go in and tell them flatly that you will be missing the day for an interview. Don't give them a bunch of whiny excuses, just tell them you are taking the day off. Screw them they already have done this, they will understand.
This is your career. Don't let anyone keep you from getting the best shot you can at a match

I agree with this post, we are DO's we cannot be timid otherwise, we will be walked all over in this field. Get rid of the timidness and put some confidence in yo self.