Prelim PGY-1 applying to EM...obstacles?

[cbass1350]

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I did a general search and checked out the sticky but couldn't find an answer to my questions. A bit about myself: I am a U.S. IMG (carib) with good board scores and I am entering a prelim IM or Sx program this year. However, I am planning to apply to EM next year (I did not apply this year).

My question: is it true that prelim PGY-1's are generally looked upon as 'used goods' by PD's? Will this become a huge obstacle in me getting EM interviews next year?

What recommendations do you have for a prelim resident who wants to go into your specialty? I was thinking of trying to find some helpful EM attendings at my PGY-1 hospital for guidance and perhaps even letters. I know that this will be difficult since I will be swamped with my PGY-1 duties. However, I think that it might be possible if I am lucky enough to land a spot at a hospital with an active EM program. What are your thoughts regarding this decision? Do you know of anyone who has done it (applied and matched to EM after PGY-1 year)?

Thanks for the advice

 

[ndspider]

.,

 

[Apollyon]

I got more interviews when I was prelim IM than I did as a student (US Carib).

And props to the person above on getting it right about starting the funding clock.

 

[cbass1350]

ndspider, my initial plan was to go into surgery. While I was able to get a few surgery LoR's, I made the decision in favor of EM well after the rotation had ended and september was right around the corner (with no way to reschedule for an EM elective). Hence, I lost my chance of getting at least one LoR from an EM attending. In retrospect, I should have had enough forethought to try to get some EM LoR's during the rotation but it did not occur to me at the time.
I didn't want to apply to EM this year without at least one letter from an EM attending. So I figured I'll do either one year of prelim Sx or IM with the hope of meeting some cool EM people and getting some references. I had no idea that the prelim year did not count towards the total number of years that a resident could get funded. Thanks for clarifying that.

Apollyon, would you mind sharing how many programs you applied to and the number of interviews you got? How were your overall board scores?

Thanks guys for the advice and best of luck with the match

 

[Apollyon]

ndspider, my initial plan was to go into surgery. While I was able to get a few surgery LoR's, I made the decision in favor of EM well after the rotation had ended and september was right around the corner (with no way to reschedule for an EM elective). Hence, I lost my chance of getting at least one LoR from an EM attending. In retrospect, I should have had enough forethought to try to get some EM LoR's during the rotation but it did not occur to me at the time.
I didn't want to apply to EM this year without at least one letter from an EM attending. So I figured I'll do either one year of prelim Sx or IM with the hope of meeting some cool EM people and getting some references. I had no idea that the prelim year did not count towards the total number of years that a resident could get funded. Thanks for clarifying that.

Apollyon, would you mind sharing how many programs you applied to and the number of interviews you got? How were your overall board scores?

Thanks guys for the advice and best of luck with the match

The number of interviews was low compared to the applications. My board scores sucked.

 

[dmitrinyr]

I am currently a prelim in IM reapplying into EM as I did not match into EM last year.

I don't know whether some PD's look at you as "used goods" if you are a prelim IM or SX resident applying for another residency. What I do know is that I got more interviews this year than last year with no change in my board scores (I didn't take step 3 yet) and only having the fact that I am a prelim being different in my applicantion from last year.

It is true about the funding and many PDs probably take this into consideration when pondering how high to rank an applicant, but one year of funding is a lot different than if you have finished lets say an IM residency and now want to do an EM residency and therefore any EM program that will take you will not get any funding and they will have to think long and hard if you are worth it (and unfortunately, most of the time... you are not worth it regardless of your accomplishments)

Well, I'll know more on monday morning of whether a prelim year did anything. Good luck to all....

 

[ispic]

Hi,

I did a prelim year in Surgery at a place that has an EM program, got to know the PD and the residents and it worked out well. I am now finishing my "intern" year in EM. There's a couple of other folks here on my cycle that did the same thing since when we applied and scrambled in 2007, there were only 7 scramble spots available, ugh! Aside from the favorable "funding" issue, a prelim year gives you a lot of flexibility as where you're gonna end up. Leaving a categorical spot does not allow the best of vibes between you and the program and could create some animosity between you and the PD, that when interviews come around, might not be so supportive of letting you go on interviews...on the other hand, since during a prelim year, you're just general workforce, the program might be a little more amenable to taking time for interviews, etc...In my case, my PD was very supportive of me, wrote a letter of rec and I believe was a factor in my finding a spot in my local program. Hope this helps...

 

[ndspider]

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[Doctor Bob]

My question: is it true that prelim PGY-1's are generally looked upon as 'used goods' by PD's? Will this become a huge obstacle in me getting EM interviews next year?

What recommendations do you have for a prelim resident who wants to go into your specialty? I was thinking of trying to find some helpful EM attendings at my PGY-1 hospital for guidance and perhaps even letters. I know that this will be difficult since I will be swamped with my PGY-1 duties. However, I think that it might be possible if I am lucky enough to land a spot at a hospital with an active EM program. What are your thoughts regarding this decision? Do you know of anyone who has done it (applied and matched to EM after PGY-1 year)?

Yea, I did it. It's dependent on having a supportive PD during your intern year. Because they'll need to let you have time off for interviews, if possible rearrange your schedule to have your most EM-relevant rotations at the front of the year so you can talk about them on the interview circuit, and in the end write you a glowing PD-recommendation letter.

My program doesn't have an EM residency, but I did an elective block early on in my year (again, thanks to my PD) in the ED here and did my best to impress the docs. At the end of my rotation the attending I worked with the most put together a really nice LOR, got the other attendings in the department to add their names to it along with short blurbs of their own. Ended up being an 8 in 1 LOR.

On the interview trail I could talk about my trauma surgery rotation, my ortho surgery, my anesthesia rotation, my vascular surgery (I'm a surgical intern... 🙂) and how it all related to what I wanted to do. It made for easy transitions into the "so why do you want to do EM" questions.

But unless you're in a big city with lots of EM residencies close by, expect to need a lot of extra time off. I'm in a small town so I needed a lot of travel time to go to interviews and in the end it was more than the amount of leave time available to me. But my PD was nice enough to juggle the schedule around and then grant me some extra "administrative" time.

So in my mind your PD can make or break your attempt to reapply for EM. No, I don't think you're looked upon as used goods... if anything you're tested and they can have a better idea as to whether or not you'll do well.