Preliminary residency position

[orangeman25]

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So I was looking at a general surgery program in the Chicago area and it had a couple DOs as PGY-1s. They were all in the preliminary category. So after one year of surgical training, where do these residents go? Will the home institution take them on for the completion of a GS residency or do they apply again for a new speciality?

 

[hallowmann]

So I was looking at a general surgery program in the Chicago area and it had a couple DOs as PGY-1s. They were all in the preliminary category. So after one year of surgical training, where do these residents go? Will the home institution take them on for the completion of a GS residency or do they apply again for a new speciality?

They may already have an advanced position lined up that requires a pre-lim surgery year, they might be applying for advanced positions elsewhere now, they may be applying to another PGY1 position or different residency, and it's probably likely that 1-2 might stick around if the program likes them or has openings.

Attrition is something like 20% in residency. Most will leave for another program or different residency altogether, but some just don't make it. As a result a lot of places might pull people from the TRIs and pre-lim spots, so a 1yr program might turn into a categorical program. That said, it's a risk, and most people prefer not to take that risk. Alternatively, they might just need a pre-lim surgery for an advanced position they've already matched into.

 

[SLC]

Gen surg get hit hard (comparatively) by attrition. So those prelim spots have an ok chance of turning into categorical somewhere. That or as hallowmann said, it could be a prelim year before going on to some other surgical sub specialty. Many residencies require these types of things; if you look at IM programs, many also have prelims, many of which are going on to things like Anesthesia, Optho, Neuro, Derm etc.

I'm shocked how many Gen surg residents are out on the FM trail this year. Switching specialties, even late, happens more than I realized.

 

[costales]

OP is a troll.

 

[orangeman25]

OP is a troll.

-.- no I'm not

 

[hallowmann]

Gen surg get hit hard (comparatively) by attrition. So those prelim spots have an ok chance of turning into categorical somewhere. That or as hallowmann said, it could be a prelim year before going on to some other surgical sub specialty. Many residencies require these types of things; if you look at IM programs, many also have prelims, many of which are going on to things like Anesthesia, Optho, Neuro, Derm etc.

I'm shocked how many Gen surg residents are out on the FM trail this year. Switching specialties, even late, happens more than I realized.

Its crazy. I was really surprised when I was told 1 in 5 people leave their program or even their field. Honestly as someone who's undecided, it really freaks me out. As far as gen surg goes, it probably doesn't help that pre-lim surg and PGY1 gen surg is the worst year ever, or so I've heard.

 

[ChrisGriffen]

OP did recently post that he was considering going carib over DO, so I think troll.

 

[meliora27]

So I was looking at a general surgery program in the Chicago area and it had a couple DOs as PGY-1s. They were all in the preliminary category. So after one year of surgical training, where do these residents go? Will the home institution take them on for the completion of a GS residency or do they apply again for a new speciality?

Did you see any DO's as PGY-2's? That may help you answer your question.

 

[orangeman25]

Did you see any DO's as PGY-2's? That may help you answer your question.

No I didn't see any 🙁

 

[meliora27]

No I didn't see any 🙁

Perhaps you can ask upperclassman at your school if they have any friends they can put you in touch with who have recently done a surg prelim year or are currently in hr midst of it and you can get a lot better insight from them.

 

[orangeman25]

OP did recently post that he was considering going carib over DO, so I think troll.

For the average pre med who hasn't dissected through SDN, I assure you, going Carib over DO is really not that surprising. I know several classmates who decided to go to carib because they didn't really know anything about DO. And if you're interested in FM, IM, peds it doesn't really make a huge difference.

But anyways, that is so off topic. This is actually a good thread and it raises the point of whether or not gen surg preliminary spots are worth pursuing as a DO.

 

[a runner]

It's doubtful that most of those PGY1s don't have an advanced position lined up somewhere.

Go read the radiology forums, there are plenty of US MDs and DOs who can't get a TY and choose prelim surgery over prelim medicine for their intern year.

Most interns in prelim spots have an advanced spot also (except maybe carib students).

 

[hallowmann]

...But anyways, that is so off topic. This is actually a good thread and it raises the point of whether or not gen surg preliminary spots are worth pursuing as a DO.

Honestly, unless you're aiming for surgery and you don't match, I'd do a TRI long before I'd touch pre-lim surgery. From what I hear everyone hates it (even more so than everyone hates internship in general) and interns get rough treatment.

Now if you have an ACGME advanced position lined up and you can't find a pre-accredited TRI, pre-lim med, or TY spot, then you might have to do pre-lim surg, but make sure it fulfills the PGY1 requirements for your advanced position.

 

[a runner]

Unfortunately with the current set up, if you're going for ACGME radiology or anesthesiology you can't take a TRI in the AOA match because even though most ACGME positions in these specialties are advanced starting in PGY2, there is a chance you could match a categorical spot that integrates the intern year.

For most DO's (and especially IMGs), TY's are a long shot unless you're open to all locations. That leaves prelim medicine, prelim surgery, or trying to get a post-match TRI. Post match TRI sounds the best, but by then the locations are limited I think. I guess many people go prelim medicine, but the good ones can be pretty competitive like TY's, and what if you hate medicine?

 

[W19]

What is the different between TRI and preliminary medicine?

 

[a runner]

Prelim medicine is a 1 year PGY1 spot within an ACGME IM residency program. Most of the people in them are going onto an advanced position.

TRI is an osteopathic 1 year AOA PGY1 position. Most of these don't get filled in the match, but after the ACGME match a lot of them get filled.

It seems to me that TRI's have less call and tend to be more outpatient.