Proctor calling the time too early?

[Jugador75]

This is something that absolutely infuriates me. Some people, myself included probably, have studied for over 1,000 hours for this test, and then the proctor cuts you short of time because they are too stupid to tell time? What the hell is this? This is absolutely absurd.

I call for immediate action! Everyone who has ever had this happen to, or who knows of anyone who this ever happened to, please post a reply in this thread. Put your name (if you are comfortable with that) test center, test date, and how short time was called. Hopefully Tweetie Bird will get this information to the right people in order to minimize this horrific act. Proctors should have digital stopwatches and that should solve the problem relatively simply.

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[Chronotropic]

Wow. How did they tell time? With a regular watch? I thought all proctors were supposed to have similar timing devices. Since the MCAT is so anal about everything else you figure they would be especially anal when it comes to something like time. You definately need to tell someone about this. Especially if you lost more then 5 minutes.

I had a similar experience on test day. During our first writing section the proctor did not anounce that 5 min were left but instead anounced that 3 min were remaining. Was not that big of a deal since it was the writing section and most of us were taking a nap at the time. But if this had been verbal I would of been furious. It's really sad when the test takers put all this effort into preparing for this test and the proctors go in their and give a half ass effort.

 

[phatty925]

my proctor jipped us of about 45 seconds in the verbal section. i was done by that time, but that could've let others who weren't finished answer one more question.
during the verbal section, as if it wasn't stressful enough when they gave us the 45 min. and 5 min. reminders, the proctor called 45 min. remaining when there was 46 minutes and 30 sec. left.
that made me mad and i went up to the proctor afterwards and she said we were going by HER time and not mine, although we all had accurate timers. she was using her regular wrist watch that looked about 50 years old.
i really think aamc should provide digital timers for proctors. think about it-- the question that you don't get to answer b/c you are cut one minute short could be that question that makes the difference between a 9 and a 10.
btw, i took mine at Boston College...i don't know the proctor's name. it was room # 235.

 

[Jugador75]

Thanks Phatty. Hey Danswu, the proctor didnt cut you guys short on time right? He/she just anounced 3 minutes left instead of 5 - correct? Just want to clarify.

Other people please speak up!!

 

[Chronotropic]

Originally posted by Jugador75
Thanks Phatty. Hey Danswu, the proctor didnt cut you guys short on time right? He/she just anounced 3 minutes left instead of 5 - correct? Just want to clarify.

Other people please speak up!!

Yes that is right. She was chatting with the other proctor and was not paying attention to the time. Not a major problem but since we have to depend on the proctors official time rather then any time we keep it can cause problems.

 

[nero]

our proctor made a mistake, i think said 5 minutes when there were 10 or soemthing like tat....some how screwd us out of five minutes, but all of us in an auditorium of like 200 people yelled, no that's wrong, it shoudl be 10...........she realized her mistake and corrected it............i'm with the above posster, i wold've been so angry had i studied my butt off all summer and been screwed out of time for finishing the test.............definitely contact aamc if that happened, and atelast get a letter from them acknowledging this happend, so you can send it to med schosols........

nero

 

[Jugador75]

I don't think AAMC is going to send med schools a letter admitting that time was called too early. The only way you could prove that to them would be if they contacted other people in the room and asked them, and they confirmed it. And I don't think AAMC would take the effort to do that.

I think the solution is to bring this problem to the attention of AAMC so that it doesnt happen again for Christ's sake. Keeping the time seems like such a simple thing - I wouldnt have thought that this would be one of the biggest obstacles to doing well on the mcat!!

 

[Sammarai]

I agree with Jug, it is not about getting a letter to take with you to the interview to explain your scores. It is about helping prevent this mistake in the future.

 

[limit]

My proctor forgot a timer and used the wall clock!!!

First, they never announce the exact time they start, so you're always off by 30 seconds there. Then, every "time left" announcement was off by at least 2-3 minutes!! "5 minutes left", and then 3 minutes later "pencils down". I agree with the above poster, this is preposterous. We've invested months of time, sweat, and blood, and some of us $1000's on prep courses and review material. This is really uncalled for.

 

[Diogenes]

I think all of the proctors should have to have synchronized atomic clocks that are accurate to the femtosecond.

Either that or everyone should stop spending so much time and energy and money on MCAT prep. That way there won't be as much to lose when the proctors make timing mistakes. Also it would free up all that extra time to volunteer at soup kitchens and pet puppy dogs and bathe the great unwashed.

 

[shamthis]

Jugs, over 1000 hours?

 

[limit]

Originally posted by Diogenes
I think all of the proctors should have to have synchronized atomic clocks that are accurate to the femtosecond.

Either that or everyone should stop spending so much time and energy and money on MCAT prep. That way there won't be as much to lose when the proctors make timing mistakes. Also it would free up all that extra time to volunteer at soup kitchens and pet puppy dogs and bathe the great unwashed.

Your suggestions are apathetic and imbecilic. Furthermore, you appear to lack judgement and realism. Hence, your opinions are worthless and you should not be listened to. If you can't favorably contribute to a serious discussion, don't try to undermine those that can. On behalf of everyone, **** you.

 

[Sammarai]

My point exactly!

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by limit


Your suggestions are apathetic and imbecilic. Furthermore, you appear to lack judgement and realism. Hence, your opinions are worthless and you should not be listened to. If you can't favorably contribute to a serious discussion, don't try to undermine those that can. On behalf of everyone, **** you.

Nice. Don't have an anxiety attack waiting for your scores.


Look, you've complained that there is too much invested for such a high risk. So you can either decrease the risk or decrease the investment. If you are really interested in minimizing the potential loss, you will decrease the risk (by better timing procedures and mechanisms) AND decrease the investment (by studying less and not doing prep courses).

 

[limit]

Originally posted by Diogenes

Nice. Don't have an anxiety attack waiting for your scores.

Perhaps.

Originally posted by Diogenes

Look, you've complained that there is too much invested for such a high risk. So you can either decrease the risk or decrease the investment. If you are really interested in minimizing the potential loss, you will decrease the risk (by better timing procedures and mechanisms) AND decrease the investment (by studying less and not doing prep courses).

Unfortunately, that's a very bleak one-sided solution. It's an improper admission of responsibility, where in fact the root of the problem is the organization, or lack thereof, of an efficient team of proctors who can do their job correctly. That's the main point that everyone here is trying to make, whereas your suggestion is analogous to telling the victim of a crime, "you shouldn't have been there at that particular time". 50,000 students can't be wrong, we're doing our job in that we're preparing to the best of our abilities, and exhausting our arsenal of perparation techniques, be it expensive prep courses or whatever. We're still performing an overwhelming amount of work.

I say we hold the proctors accountable for their actions. How difficult is it to announce (within a few seconds margin of error) the exact starting time, the exact 45-minute-remaining mark, and the exact 5-minute-remaining mark? All it requires is a timer and for one of the two proctors to be half alert. I propose we add an incentive. One mistake on announcement, if verified by overwhelming complain, is an automatic loss of a job, no discussion. Holding the proctors to a high standard will actually allow the MCAT to have more esteem. But I see that's too unrealistic, we should instead tell 50,000 students not to prepare as meticulously because the proctors will have a full totalitarian control over time. I'm not talking about being off by 15-20 seconds here and there, I guess everyone makes mistakes and that can be acceptable. But my proctors were off by minutes! If one administration is providing 85 minutes while another provides 83, how can we call this a statistically valid exam?

 

[Kry]

Originally posted by limit


I guess you're right about that



Unfortunately, that's a very bleak one-sided solution. It's an improper admission of responsibility, where in fact the root of the problem is the organization, or lack thereof, of an efficient team of proctors who can do their job correctly. That's the main point that everyone here is trying to make, whereas your suggestion is analogous to telling the victim of a crime, "you shouldn't have been there at that particular time". 50,000 students can't be wrong, we're doing our job in that we're preparing to the best of our abilities, and exhausting our arsenal of perparation techniques, be it expensive prep courses or whatever. We're still performing an overwhelming amount of work.

I say we hold the proctors accountable for their actions. How difficult is it to announce (within a few seconds margin of error) the exact starting time, the exact 45-minute-remaining mark, and the exact 5-minute-remaining mark? All it requires is a timer and for one of the two proctors to be half alert. I propose we add an incentive. One mistake on announcement, if verified by overwhelming complain, is an automatic loss of a job, no discussion. Holding the proctors to a high standard will actually allow the MCAT to have more esteem. But I see that's too unrealistic, we should instead tell 50,000 students not to prepare as meticulously because the proctors will have a full totalitarian control over time. I'm not talking about being off by 15-20 seconds here and there, I guess everyone makes mistakes and that can be acceptable. But my proctors were off by minutes! If one administration is providing 85 minutes while another provides 83, how can we call this a statistically valid exam?

Nice post.

 

[Tweetie_bird]

Got questions/concerns? We've got your back.

Go to my thread about "MCAT Administration problems? Read this."

Hope it helps.

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by limit

Unfortunately, that's a very bleak one-sided solution. It's an improper admission of responsibility, where in fact the root of the problem is the organization, or lack thereof, of an efficient team of proctors who can do their job correctly. That's the main point that everyone here is trying to make, whereas your suggestion is analogous to telling the victim of a crime, "you shouldn't have been there at that particular time". 50,000 students can't be wrong, we're doing our job in that we're preparing to the best of our abilities, and exhausting our arsenal of perparation techniques, be it expensive prep courses or whatever. We're still performing an overwhelming amount of work.

It is not a one-sided solution at all. There are very clearly 2 sides to it. One side is better timing procedures and mechanisms -- that's the proctor side. The other side is not setting yourself up to "lose" so much -- that is the student side. Very clearly 2 sides. That crime analogy is seriously flawed. In fact, it is totally inapplicable as you have worded it. I'm not telling the crime victim that they shuold not have been there at that time. I'm telling them that a) we could do something about the criminals in the first place but one cannot completely eradicate criminals and b) one should not have so much to lose if the criminals do strike. The MCAT is not the make or break thing that so many people make it out to be. The difference of 1 on a section will not determine whether or not you get into med school.

 

[limit]

Originally posted by Diogenes


It is not a one-sided solution at all. There are very clearly 2 sides to it. One side is better timing procedures and mechanisms -- that's the proctor side. The other side is not setting yourself up to "lose" so much -- that is the student side. Very clearly 2 sides. That crime analogy is seriously flawed. In fact, it is totally inapplicable as you have worded it. I'm not telling the crime victim that they shuold not have been there at that time. I'm telling them that a) we could do something about the criminals in the first place but one cannot completely eradicate criminals and b) one should not have so much to lose if the criminals do strike. The MCAT is not the make or break thing that so many people make it out to be. The difference of 1 on a section will not determine whether or not you get into med school.

Your solution does indeed appear lop-sided. You keep saying that students should do something. No, they shouldn't. Why should we change our preparation to suit the incompetence of hired proctors? The problem lies entirely (100%) with the administration of the exam, the students aren't at fault, it is unfair to ask them to do something other than top notch preparation.

We may not be able to eradicate criminals, but we can reduce crime by punishing the criminals (ie, accountability).

A difference of 1 point per section translates to 3 points per exam. So, you are implying that a 24 compared to a 27, and a 27 compared to a 30 have no effect on a med school applicant's competitiveness?

An MCAT may or may not be make or break (personally, I feel it is), but it is still the most important exam of a pre-med's undergraduate career (can you think of a more important exam?). Why should it not be held to the highest possible regard by the administrators?

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by limit


Your solution does indeed appear lop-sided. You keep saying that students should do something. No, they shouldn't. Why should we change our preparation to suit the incompetence of hired proctors? The problem lies entirely (100%) with the administration of the exam, the students aren't at fault, it is unfair to ask them to do something other than top notch preparation.

We may not be able to eradicate criminals, but we can reduce crime by punishing the criminals (ie, accountability).

A difference of 1 point per section translates to 3 points per exam. So, you are implying that a 24 compared to a 27, and a 27 compared to a 30 have no effect on a med school applicant's competitiveness?

An MCAT may or may not be make or break (personally, I feel it is), but it is still the most important exam of a pre-med's undergraduate career (can you think of a more important exam?). Why should it not be held to the highest possible regard by the administrators?

I don't really want to argue about this, but it is actually your position that presents a one-sided solution. You have said that the only solution is greater control and accountability in regards to the timing. You may not like the other method of reducing potential loss, but it does exist. That you choose to ignore it as a way of reducing potential loss is your choice, but it is your "solution" that is one-sided, not mine.

I think criminals should be punished, and I think proctors should be accountable. I never said otherwise. Read carefully; I never said otherwise.

And one point different on A section is different than one point different on EACH section. Those are two completely different things. Again, please read my posts carefully. One point different on a section won't make or break you.

The test administrators should be held to a high standard. But the test-takers also should learn to deal with it when life throws you a curve. It's part of life.

And since you asked, I can think of a test more important than the MCAT -- any final exam in any class (required for graduation) worth enough to cause a failing grade. Because if you don't complete your bachelors, you can't matriculate (at least at the schools I got into).

 

[Jugador75]

I agree with Diogensis on one point and one point only. The crime analogy is flawed. Having said that, Diogensis your original point is so absurd that if you actually believe what you wrote, then that just makes it worse. I don?t believe that you are stupid. I think you are just trying to get a rise out of people and get some attention. I have read your posts in other threads and they are nothing but sarcasm! Why don?t you try to actually contribute to this site once in a while? If you can?t do that then don?t say anything at all.

As for your actual point, or lack thereof, you are saying that people should give up their hopes and dreams of becoming a physician, or at least their dreams of doing well on the mcat and therefore getting into a top med school, simply because of the possibility that they will have a proctor that can?t keep track of time? That hardly seems like a solution. I can illustrate its faults with one simple example: suppose that people spend less time preparing, and then on TOP of that they have an idiot proctor. Then they?re really screwed.

What you are telling everyone, diogensis, is that life sucks so there?s no point in trying or caring too much about anything. This is only what lazy and pessimistic people say. Certainly not the kind of person looking to become a doctor.

 

[Kry]

There's a hint of bitterness in the air.

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by Kry
There's a hint of bitterness in the air.

 

[limit]

I dont see a point in continuing this arguement, but I'll agree with all of what Jugador has said.

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by Jugador75
I agree with Diogensis on one point and one point only. The crime analogy is flawed. Having said that, Diogensis your original point is so absurd that if you actually believe what you wrote, then that just makes it worse. I don?t believe that you are stupid. I think you are just trying to get a rise out of people and get some attention. I have read your posts in other threads and they are nothing but sarcasm! Why don?t you try to actually contribute to this site once in a while? If you can?t do that then don?t say anything at all.

As for your actual point, or lack thereof, you are saying that people should give up their hopes and dreams of becoming a physician, or at least their dreams of doing well on the mcat and therefore getting into a top med school, simply because of the possibility that they will have a proctor that can?t keep track of time? That hardly seems like a solution. I can illustrate its faults with one simple example: suppose that people spend less time preparing, and then on TOP of that they have an idiot proctor. Then they?re really screwed.

What you are telling everyone, diogensis, is that life sucks so there?s no point in trying or caring too much about anything. This is only what lazy and pessimistic people say. Certainly not the kind of person looking to become a doctor.

Who's this diogensis guy?

My meaningful posts may be less common than my frivilous ones, but they exist. Mostly in pre-allo.

The "fault" you illustrate in my "solution" is tangential to the point of that solution. It is therefore not a fault of that solution. That solution was NOT the way to do well. That solution was the way to lose the least. The more you prepare, the more you lose by having a bad proctor. I never said this "solution" would result in the highest possible scores -- I said it would minimize the potential loss due to bad proctoring.

And actually what my much-veiled point was was that people should not spend so much time worrying about things that are beyond their control. Do the best you can with the circumstances you find yourself in; through acceptance you should find some mental peace.

And you can take your judgments about "the kind of person looking to become a doctor" and shove them up your ass.

 

[Jugador75]

Originally posted by Diogenes


Who's this diogensis guy?

My meaningful posts may be less common than my frivilous ones, but they exist. Mostly in pre-allo.

The "fault" you illustrate in my "solution" is tangential to the point of that solution. It is therefore not a fault of that solution. That solution was NOT the way to do well. That solution was the way to lose the least. The more you prepare, the more you lose by having a bad proctor. I never said this "solution" would result in the highest possible scores -- I said it would minimize the potential loss due to bad proctoring.

And actually what my much-veiled point was was that people should not spend so much time worrying about things that are beyond their control. Do the best you can with the circumstances you find yourself in; through acceptance you should find some mental peace.

And you can take your judgments about "the kind of person looking to become a doctor" and shove them up your ass.

Haha! well I'll agree with that. But what you said originally is quite different (at least everyone has interpretted it as such) from what you are saying now. What you said originally was that everyone should just "minimize their loses" by studying less. Worrying about the matter afterwards - I agree - is rather frivolous, although it can help others, and that is the reason I started this thread to begin with. But when you say that one feasible solution is just to throw in the towel and not give your best effort, this is where I, and most people on this site, will disagree with you to the death!

 

[Jugador75]

One other thing I thought of when I was in the bathroom taking a huge dump. While perhaps some of us should spend less time worrying about the mcat, you should DEFINITELY spend less time criticizing people for worrying about the mcat!

I don't think anyone will disagree with me there.

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by Jugador75
One other thing I thought of when I was in the bathroom taking a huge dump. While perhaps some of us should spend less time worrying about the mcat, you should DEFINITELY spend less time criticizing people for worrying about the mcat!

I don't think anyone will disagree with me there.

I agree with that.

 

[Jugador75]

Hey Sharky,

Was your proctor just dumb, or did he actually say "I'm going to give all of you an extra 5 minutes because I got laid last night and I'm in a generous mood" ?

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

Diogenes, stop being a smart ass.

 

[jot]

Diogenes, stop being a smart ass.

 

[DW]

Originally posted by Ryo-Ohki
Diogenes, stop being a smart ass.

oh, ryo ohki. people in glass houses shoudn't throw stones

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by DW


oh, ryo ohki. people in glass houses shoudn't throw stones

Yeah, I seem to remember an extraordinarily facetious post by ryo ohki about AA.


Also people in glass houses have their bathroom in the basement.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

What I see here is a little kid who is trying to get everyone to like him.

Guess what? Self-aggrandizing yourself with that stupid soup kitchen suggestion while pouring salt on that guy's wound is being a smart ass.

Nobody likes you when you act that way. Grow up.


Got a problem with my sacrasitic comment? Take it up on that post. Otherwise stop being an ass on this post. The guy was wronged. period.

 

[Diogenes]

Originally posted by Ryo-Ohki
What I see here is a little kid who is trying to get everyone to like him.

Guess what? Self-aggrandizing yourself with that stupid soup kitchen suggestion while pouring salt on that guy's wound is being a smart ass.

Nobody likes you when you act that way. Grow up.


Got a problem with my sacrasitic comment? Take it up on that post. Otherwise stop being an ass on this post. The guy was wronged. period.

If I wanted everyone to like me, wouldn't I be kissing everyone's ass and telling them that "oh, yes, this is the biggest miscarriage of justice I have ever heard about"? Did the proctor mess up? Absolutely. Is that something that should be avoided? Yes. Is it that big of a deal? No it isn't. The dude isn't going to go from being accepted at all the top 10 schools to being a homeless vagrant because some proctor said "45" instead of "50" and then corrected the mistake later. Dealing with less-than-perfect circumstances is part of life.

 

[Mr. Z]

I guess calling someone an ass is acceptable here. Strange rules

 

[Jugador75]

Diogensis - who is the "guy that got wronged" ? I hope you're not referring to me. I didnt even take the mcat on saturday. I'm not taking them until april. I just want to make sure this kind of thing doesnt keep happening.

Let's just end it at that shall we? PM if you want to talk about this anymore. I don't think anyone wants to hear anymore from you (or from me, for that matter) about this. The end.

David

 

[Diogenes]

sorry jugador, that was a refernce to the other thread on a similar topic where there was also a heated discussion in which I ought not to have participated.

 

[Ryo-Ohki]

Everyone who had problems concerning the MCAT adminstration please refer to Tweetie_bird's post.