Psychology PhD without Background?

[ronz32]

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[AcronymAllergy]

Hey everyone, I am currently an freshman med school student at a US medical school, and this year has been rough for me. I haven't performed well and am in jeopardy of being dismissed. I am doing all I can to stay in, but in the meantime I have recently discovered that I have a passion for psychology and neuropsych. If med school doesn't end up working out, what are the chances that I could be admitted to a graduate (presumably masters) level psychology program to both boost my psychology GPA and gain research experience for a PhD program. Will my med school record hinder me from admission? I am highly motivated, yet have had a few setbacks this year, but it my be for the best 😱 I am fully aware that I need to take the GRE first. Please let me know if you have any suggestions also as to how to break into the psych field otherwise.

You'd likely need to check on the pre-reqs for the individual master's programs you're interested in attending. They shouldn't be as stringent as those for med school, but I would think most will require some combination of psych coursework (usually bio/physio, social, cognitive, and/or developmental) along with intro stats and research methods. However, there may be some programs that have reduced or non-existent pre-reqs, I'm not sure.

As for your record hindering you--having attending medical school wouldn't per se; the rub will come in discussing "what went wrong," why you feel psychology is actually a good fit for you (rather than simply a fall-back option), and how you've addressed the difficulties that have unfortunately affected your academic performance this past year.

 

[ronz32]

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[Jegg]

Hey everyone, I am currently an freshman med school student at a US medical school, and this year has been rough for me. I haven't performed well and am in jeopardy of being dismissed. I am doing all I can to stay in, but in the meantime I have recently discovered that I have a passion for psychology and neuropsych. If med school doesn't end up working out, what are the chances that I could be admitted to a graduate (presumably masters) level psychology program to both boost my psychology GPA and gain research experience for a PhD program. Will my med school record hinder me from admission? I am highly motivated, yet have had a few setbacks this year, but it my be for the best 😱 I am fully aware that I need to take the GRE first. Please let me know if you have any suggestions also as to how to break into the psych field otherwise.

Personally, I would just get your act together and complete med school, and then do a psychiatry residency...

 

[Jegg]

I think if your interests are neuropsychology, you will find many more interesting options in the medical field than in clinical psychology where you will be fairly limited to certain activities (e.g. assessment, management, rehabilitation) as far as I can tell from the Wikipedia page.

 

[KillerDiller]

Thanks for the help. Another question: When looking for a masters program, what qualities of the program should I look for, to increase my chances of going PhD? I know getting an RA position is a great step during a masters, but are any of the programs better than others for helping students get to the next step?

If you are sure you eventually want a doctorate, try looking for general psych programs instead of practice-oriented programs. The former will get you the coursework and the research experience that Ph.D. programs will want to see. Also, look for programs that provide some funding.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think if your interests are neuropsychology, you will find many more interesting options in the medical field than in clinical psychology where you will be fairly limited to certain activities (e.g. assessment, management, rehabilitation) as far as I can tell from the Wikipedia page.

To say you'd be limited to "assessment, management, rehabilitation" in neuropsychology with a Ph.D. is sort of like saying you'd be limited to "medication management, therapy, and supervision" in psychiatry--the components you've listed are some of the key areas that neuropsychology focuses on, as well as the areas in which it can make unique contributions. It's true that you could go the neuropsychiatry or behavioral neurology route via med school, but the approaches and interests there are slightly different. If the OP is truly interested in neuropsych, which includes significant work in both physiological/neuroanatomical and cognitive/psychological processes, then a doctorate in clinical psych is pretty much the only (or at least the most efficient) way to get there.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

If you are sure you eventually want a doctorate, try looking for general psych programs instead of practice-oriented programs. The former will get you the coursework and the research experience that Ph.D. programs will want to see. Also, look for programs that provide some funding.

Very much agreed. Experimentally-oriented master's degrees would likely be your best bet, as they're the most likely to afford you the research opportunities you'll need to make yourself competitive for Ph.D. admissions.

 

[Jegg]

To say you'd be limited to "assessment, management, rehabilitation" in neuropsychology with a Ph.D. is sort of like saying you'd be limited to "medication management, therapy, and supervision" in psychiatry--the components you've listed are some of the key areas that neuropsychology focuses on, as well as the areas in which it can make unique contributions. It's true that you could go the neuropsychiatry or behavioral neurology route via med school, but the approaches and interests there are slightly different.

I'll stick by my original statement, rather than the straw man argument offered concerning psychiatry, that if you want to do neuropsych you will have more options available to you by taking the medical degree route rather than taking the clinical psychology route.

If the OP is truly interested in neuropsych, which includes significant work in both physiological/neuroanatomical and cognitive/psychological processes, then a doctorate in clinical psych is pretty much the only (or at least the most efficient) way to get there.

How is this markedly different from what I wrote (i.e. assessment, management, rehabilitation)?! 😕 Physiological/neuroanatomical and cognitive/psychological processes are some of the coursework elements behind the three things I listed.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I'll stick by my original statement, rather than the straw man argument offered concerning psychiatry, that if you want to do neuropsych you will have more options available to you by taking the medical degree route rather than taking the clinical psychology route.

What additional options are you proposing as being available via the med school route rather than the clinical psych route (this is not intended to be facetious, I'm genuinely curious)?

The psychiatry statement was meant, as you've gathered, to show that "only" doing assessment, management, and rehabilitation in neuropsych is essentially a huge chunk of what neuropsych actually is.

How is this markedly different from what I wrote (i.e. assessment, management, rehabilitation)?! 😕 Physiological/neuroanatomical and cognitive/psychological processes are some of the coursework elements behind the three things I listed.

It's not markedly different, and that's the point. The whole idea behind neuropsych is that it's a crossroads of sorts between neurophysiology and psychology, or put slightly differently, it focuses on the behavioral sequelae of neurological conditions. Thus, I would make the argument that your neuropsychology-related options are greater via the clinical psych route than the med school route, as psychometric assessment and principles are crucial components of neuropsychological practice and research.

 

[Jegg]

What additional options are you proposing as being available via the med school route rather than the clinical psych route?

All of medical neuroscience is available to you via the medical route (including neuropsychiatry), as opposed to only clinical neuropsychology via the clinical psychology route.

The psychiatry statement was meant, as you've gathered, to show that "only" doing assessment, management, and rehabilitation in neuropsych is essentially a huge chunk of what neuropsych actually is.

What are you doing with clinical neuropsychology that lies outside of assessment, management, and rehabilitation? I guess you can throw in research and teaching concerning those three elements also.

It's not markedly different, and that's the point. The whole idea behind neuropsych is that it's a crossroads of sorts between neurophysiology and psychology, or put slightly differently, it focuses on the behavioral sequelae of neurological conditions. Thus, I would make the argument that your neuropsychology-related options are greater via the clinical psych route than the med school route, as psychometric assessment and principles are crucial components of neuropsychological practice and research.

If someone pursues clinical psychology he or she is stuck doing clinical neuropsychology. If he or she pursues a medical degree, he/she has all different avenues of neurological studies that are still open to him/her if his/her interests drift before starting residency.

I think the medical route seems like a much better option for the OP whose interests do not seem congealed yet. If someone knows for certain that he or she wants to pursue clinical neuropsychology only and he/she has put a lot of thought and research into that decision, then it certainly makes sense to pursue that career, but if someone still isn't certain, throwing away a medical school career on a hunch and advice from people on a psychology forum does not seem prudent IMO. The OP will have more options to select from in the medical field. Considering that the OP is only considering his or her "passion" of psychology and neuropsych as an option if "med school doesn't end up working out," I don't think it is a well conceived plan.

Likewise, if the OP fails out of medical school, what makes the OP think that he or she can even complete a doctoral degree in clinical psychology?

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I think the medical route seems like a much better option for the OP whose interests do not seem congealed yet. If someone knows for certain that he or she wants to pursue clinical neuropsychology only and he/she has put a lot of thought and research into that decision, then it certainly makes sense to pursue that career, but if someone still isn't certain, throwing away a medical school career on a hunch and advice from people on a psychology forum does not seem prudent IMO. The OP will have more options to select from in the medical field. Considering that the OP is only considering his or her "passion" of psychology and neuropsych as an option if "med school doesn't end up working out," I don't think it is a well conceived plan.

I completely agree--clinical neuropsych is a much more "restricted," or at least narrowed, field in that sense when compared with medicine.

I also agree that the OP shouldn't toss a medical career out the window based on a whim and the advice of individuals not in medical school. If he/she is certain that what a neuropsychologist does is largely what he/she wants to do, then neuropsych would be the best way to achieve that goal. However, if there are still doubts, and/or if the OP isn't certain, then staying put would leave open the most options, especially given that since the OP opted to apply to med school in the first place, there's a high likelihood that many of his/her interests are in some way related to the practice of medicine rather than clinical psychology.

 

[CharmedDiamond]

Hey everyone, I am currently an freshman med school student at a US medical school, and this year has been rough for me. I haven't performed well and am in jeopardy of being dismissed. I am doing all I can to stay in, but in the meantime I have recently discovered that I have a passion for psychology and neuropsych. If med school doesn't end up working out, what are the chances that I could be admitted to a graduate (presumably masters) level psychology program to both boost my psychology GPA and gain research experience for a PhD program. Will my med school record hinder me from admission? I am highly motivated, yet have had a few setbacks this year, but it my be for the best 😱 I am fully aware that I need to take the GRE first. Please let me know if you have any suggestions also as to how to break into the psych field otherwise.

Look for a masters in general psych or experimental psych, occasionally listed at "theoretical Psych." Check out the course listings, make sure there are a lot of fundamental type classes (social, bio, learning, psychopath), and research/stats classes rather than therapy classes. These programs are harder to find but they do exist! It will vary from school to school whether you need pre-reqs, but if you rock the GRE and nail your personal statement, you should be okay.