Public Service Loan Forgiveness and Private practice associated programs

[ewil1478]

Does anyone know if the Public Service Loan Forgiveness program apply to programs that are affiliated with a hospital, but managed through a private practice (i.e. Integris Baptist, EVMS, Beumont, etc) ?

I have tons of med school debt like most people and would love to be rid of it in ten years.

If you don't know about the program check this out:

http://www.studentaid.ed.gov/repay-...harts/public-service#what-kinds-of-employment

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[a runner]

The PSLF and IBR combination is something I've talked to a number of people about and done a bit of research. There are a lot of good threads on SDN in various places.

To answer your question: no, working for a private practice will not count towards PSLF, no matter where you actually do your work, regardless of whether it's a non-profit hospital. Even some academic positions are employed through private groups that contract with the medical school. It is hard to find a position in medicine that qualifies for PSLF (psychiatry seems to be an exception), especially for specialties.

There are some places that will actually qualify and you have to find out who is actually paying/employing you. Good places to look: many academic positions are employed by the university/medical school, VA, Indian Health Services, military civilian jobs (?), actual military service, prison systems. Not sure how many of these places hire radiologists, but your best bet is probably the VA or academics.

Or you could just keep doing fellowships until you hit 10 years of post-graduate training...

 

[ewil1478]

But doing residency through a university program that is part of a private practice hospital would count, correct?

 

[Baller MD]

Or you could just keep doing fellowships until you hit 10 years of post-graduate training...

Can you give more details regarding this?

 

[a runner]

But doing residency through a university program that is part of a private practice hospital would count, correct?

I haven't done enough research to claim that every single residency program that exists in the US would count towards PSLF, but it seems likely that the ACGME would require employers of residents to be not-for-profit (just like the LCME requires this of medical schools). Even private hospitals are usually non-profit; few have for-profit status, and those that do are unlikely to host residency programs. Even if they do, it's not certain that the hospital itself is the employer of the resident. In fact, most residencies are affiliated with multiple hospitals.

Let me give an example. Residents at the University of Kansas School of Medicine - Wichita residencies are employed by either the Wichita Center for Graduate Medical Education (WCGME) if they're located in Wichita or the Salina Health Education Foundation (SHEF) if they're located in Salina. Both of these are non-profit foundations. I'd assume that most residency programs have similar arrangements, so it's pretty safe to say that all internships, residencies, and fellowships will be counted towards PSLF. But when it comes time to interview and rank, I'd make sure with that particular program that the actual employer is a non-profit.

 

[a runner]

Can you give more details regarding this?

It was half in jest...

But... I suppose it would be possible to tack on 5 years of fellowships after you complete your radiology residency. Just do a two year neuroradiology fellowship, then an IR fellowship, then a pediatric fellowship, then an MSK one and you're set.

On the serious side, I don't know if this is actually possible. I doubt it's ever been done, but you never know. I don't see any reason why you couldn't keep doing fellowships.

 

[frader]

5 fellowships??

 

[a runner]

5 fellowships??

To dismiss > $1m in loans... sure!

 

[gurudoc]

I haven't done enough research to claim that every single residency program that exists in the US would count towards PSLF, but it seems likely that the ACGME would require employers of residents to be not-for-profit (just like the LCME requires this of medical schools). Even private hospitals are usually non-profit; few have for-profit status, and those that do are unlikely to host residency programs. Even if they do, it's not certain that the hospital itself is the employer of the resident. In fact, most residencies are affiliated with multiple hospitals.

Let me give an example. Residents at the University of Kansas School of Medicine - Wichita residencies are employed by either the Wichita Center for Graduate Medical Education (WCGME) if they're located in Wichita or the Salina Health Education Foundation (SHEF) if they're located in Salina. Both of these are non-profit foundations. I'd assume that most residency programs have similar arrangements, so it's pretty safe to say that all internships, residencies, and fellowships will be counted towards PSLF. But when it comes time to interview and rank, I'd make sure with that particular program that the actual employer is a non-profit.

From my research, residents at Drexel in Philadelphia are actually employed by Hahnemann University Hospital which is a for profit hospital and unless someone can convince me otherwise, I do not see a shred of evidence anywhere to suggest that residents and fellows at this institution are eligible to count the years spent here towards PSLF.

 

[a runner]

From my research, residents at Drexel in Philadelphia are actually employed by Hahnemann University Hospital which is a for profit hospital and unless someone can convince me otherwise, I do not see a shred of evidence anywhere to suggest that residents and fellows at this institution are eligible to count the years spent here towards PSLF.

You're absolutely right. Straight from Drexel's residency webpage (http://www.drexelmed.edu/Home/ResidenciesFellowships.aspx):

"Please note that residents are employed by and insured by the hospital; they are not employees of Drexel University College of Medicine."

You're also right about the hospital (which is owned by Tenet Healthcare Corp., traded on NYSE) being for profit. You've proved that there are residencies that would not count towards PSLF and underscored the point of how important it is to research this and consider it when choosing where to attend interviews and during ranking.