Hi guys. I'm 1st year ap/cp resident. Really want to do dermpath after residency. So, I thought that it will make sense to start building CV from the first year. I would really appreciate an input about the strategy how to increase the chances of getting a spot in dermpath. Many thanks to everyone!
Q about Dermpath
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Like any other subspecialty, basically. Get involved in dermpath research ASAP, try to get on case reports and papers with derm faculty, try to rotate on dermpath ASAP and make a good impression, do a few away rotations at places where you might have a shot at landing a fellowship. For some reason, dermpath is still competitive even though the job market is tough right now.
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Not that you can change it at this point, but your best chance is if you have dermpath fellowship spot(s) at your institution. Internal candidates have a massive advantage for fellowship spots. If not, I think away rotations are one's next best option. Show the program what they'd be getting, and you also get to see what you're signing up for. Most anyone can fake it for a day, not a month.
D
deleted314957
You won't like my reply, but since you are pretty new to the game you may seriously consider going into/switching to a derm residenency ( I know- maybe hard and a pain in the ass) and THEN doing derm path. Over the long haul it will almost certainly be ecnomically better.
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Not at all. Many Dermatopathology fellowships take one Derm-trained fellow and one Path-trained fellow.
Derm residencies take their own, and most derm applicants have more impressive credentials than path ones.
However, to disagree with you, I suspect the OP would have a better chance at getting in as a path resident than at switching to dermatology, though I would put my money on neither.
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I know of some programs that are about equal path and Derm trained. I also know of several that are Derm trained heavy. Can't say I know of any that are path trained heavy. That's not to say they're not out there.
I think program directors really try to pick the best candidate regardless of training. However, as someone mentioned, Derm trained often have more impressive baseline stats/apps.
Another thing to consider: As also mentioned, dermpath job market is sorta tight right now. Program directors want to see their trainees get jobs without problems. It's likely easier for a Derm trained person to get a job. I just started my last year of Derm, and I get emails from Derm job recruiters about 3 or 4 times a week. After my fellowship training, if I don't land a full time dermpath gig, I shouldn't have a problem getting at least a Derm clinic job with hopefully dermpath sign out part of the time (what I actually want to start out with anyway). If a path trained person doesn't find a dermpath job, is it equally as easy for them to land something path related?
I think program directors really try to pick the best candidate regardless of training. However, as someone mentioned, Derm trained often have more impressive baseline stats/apps.
Another thing to consider: As also mentioned, dermpath job market is sorta tight right now. Program directors want to see their trainees get jobs without problems. It's likely easier for a Derm trained person to get a job. I just started my last year of Derm, and I get emails from Derm job recruiters about 3 or 4 times a week. After my fellowship training, if I don't land a full time dermpath gig, I shouldn't have a problem getting at least a Derm clinic job with hopefully dermpath sign out part of the time (what I actually want to start out with anyway). If a path trained person doesn't find a dermpath job, is it equally as easy for them to land something path related?
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Definitely be a gunner at unknown slide sessions especially dermpath related ones. Be outgoing and dress sharp. The small things make the difference if you want to do dermpath as all the applicants are intellectually the most elite from pathology or derm.
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Unless there are significant regulatory changes, at least profitable portion of dermatopathology will become an arena for dermatology-DPs.
Pathology, as configured in the US, is a bottom feeding specialty, i.e., it gets what other do not want. It is a fact that our miserably incompetent and selfish Academic dons do not realize.
I am skeptical that "impending shortage" will significantly improve job market, mainly because I am confident that our Leadership will find a way to "screw" it up somehow, someway, as they have done it over last 3 decades plus. My advice to those wishing to go into DP, do it in addition to some other sub-specialty as a fall back.
Derm has a better professional standing than most other physician specialties, which explains why it is so competitive.
Pathology, unfortunately, as a low professional standing among physician specialties, and its competitiveness reflects that fact.
Competitiveness in my opinion has very little to do with the type of work being done by any particular specialty. It all has to do with professional factors.
If one is interested in dermpath, one should really try hard in medical school to match derm. Pathology is not the way to do it.
Pathology, unfortunately, as a low professional standing among physician specialties, and its competitiveness reflects that fact.
Competitiveness in my opinion has very little to do with the type of work being done by any particular specialty. It all has to do with professional factors.
If one is interested in dermpath, one should really try hard in medical school to match derm. Pathology is not the way to do it.
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Ha, don't you mean they think they are intellectually the most elite? I guess to them, perception is reality.
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I definitely agree with this post. We had one path trained fellow in the dermpath program where I trained last year who has been unable to find a job and is presently unemployed. He went to med school in the US and has an impressive CV but only managed to secure one (unsuccessful) job interview.member: 544540 said:
The main problem with dermpath is that dermatologists are free to sign out their own cases and can choose to only send the difficult cases to a dermatopathologist. Until that changes, we are bottom-feeders as Turtle mentioned.
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jp123ok- You posted the following last year (July 4, 2013 to be exact):
I've been a member on SDN for a long time Pathwrath, a lot longer than you. The thing that I have learned is that there is a small but vocal group of 'attendings' who enjoy scaring people regarding the pathology job-market. Why? Who knows. The field of pathology does attract some odd people, so it's no great surprise that some of them would find their way onto this forum. What I find funny about this situation though is that many of these people do not even claim to be pathologists. I wish more of the pathologists who enjoy their jobs would speak up like on this thread:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=985736&page=2
And just for the record, less than one week into my fellowship and I've already been approached by a private practice group with a job offer. I had to tell them that I've already accepted another job... The departing dermpath fellows told me that they were constantly being approached with job offers. Maybe the answer for all the malcontents on this forum is to do a dermpath fellowship like me.
As far as the business of pathology having deteriorated in recent times, yeah maybe for some, but certainly not for all. I got to know three private practice dermpath groups quite well as a result of networking during residency and fellowship and all three are expanding at a healthy rate. Interestingly, each is using a different method to attract new business. Maybe dermpath is different to other areas in path, or maybe the vocal 'Doom and Gloom' crowd on this forum are all just a bunch of noisy losers with poor marketing skills ...
We're all entitled to change our minds. Would you agree you sound drastically different?
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Yes, I have changed my views drastically after seeing my colleague's struggles during the past year. There is no getting around it; the job market for path trained dermatopathologists is horrendous at present.
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Since we're throwing anecdotes around, I was the path-trained dermpath at my fellowship and my co-fellow was derm trained. He ended up never finding a dermpath job and is doing just clinical derm, I landed a dermpath/surgpath job doing mostly surgpath. A lot depends on geography and other variables, not just path vs derm.
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Your fellow derm-DP has an option of (a) reading his own and office colleagues' slides, (b) pre-selecting cases to read and (c) read whenever he wishes. This is the most profitable portion of DP nowadays.
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Technically he does, but realistically he doesn't. The job he took does no in-house pathology, it is all sent to an outside lab. He actually does no dermpath, just clinical derm. But he seems content to leave it that way, so doesn't matter much to me.
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Likely a sign of someone "satiated".
The job market is tight for everyone (not just dermpath), but path-trained dermpaths still have great opportunities if they are willing to diversify and signout general surgpath, cyto, and have CP duties with general path groups. General groups are still looking for derm boarded members, but they need to do everything if they want a piece of the pie.
I got a great job coming out of 1 fellowship with a general path group making >300K starting with partnership track, doing half derm, half everything else. You have to be willing and able to do more than your subspecialty. The days of cashing out doing dermpath only- either path or derm trained- are long over for our generation, but you can still make a decent living and good yearly salary. These jobs exist but don't offer great long term security. The best and most stable financial setups are back with these partner-track path groups.
I got a great job coming out of 1 fellowship with a general path group making >300K starting with partnership track, doing half derm, half everything else. You have to be willing and able to do more than your subspecialty. The days of cashing out doing dermpath only- either path or derm trained- are long over for our generation, but you can still make a decent living and good yearly salary. These jobs exist but don't offer great long term security. The best and most stable financial setups are back with these partner-track path groups.
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