Question about allopathic/osteopathic internship and entering PGY-2

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Spartyon

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Hi everyone,

I am finishing up my second year at MSUCOM and was wondering about how internship year is tied in to ACGME/osteopathic residencies. I plan to take both the USMLE and COMLEX and hope to pursue anesthesiology. If for example I don't match in the DO match and match in the MD match in a PGY-2 spot can I enter either a DO or MD intership for PGY-1? Does this depend on the program? Also if I flipped this scenario and matched into a PGY-1 year in the DO match am I obligated to enter this spot if I say matched into an MD PGY-2 spot and also matched PGY-1 MD. I know this may sound confusing but I'm trying to make sense of the whole intern year and trying to make sense of how to approach this. I haven't had the chance to talk to any upper class students and if someone who entered both matches could give me some advice I would greatly appreciate it. I know this may highly depend on the program and I couldn't find anything for this specific topic so my apologies for reposting if I did.

Cheers,
Spartyon
 
I'm a third year at MSUCOM and am interested in anesthesiology as well. I'll try to answer your question here, but feel free to PM me if you have further questions.

This whole process can be pretty confusing but I'll try to keep it simple. If you match in the DO match (PGY-1 or PGY-2) you get pulled from the MD match. If you either don't match or don't rank programs in the DO match and then match a PGY-1 spot in the MD match, you are set but may need to do "Resolution 42" do get AOA approval for an osteopathic internship. If you either don't match or don't rank programs in the DO match, then match a PGY-2 spot in the MD match, you can then scramble for a DO traditional intern year spot. This scenario allows you to get your osteopathic internship out if the way and still go to an ACGME program.

Again, PM be if you have other questions.
 
^^ I believe that is incorrect.. ACGME programs do not give credit for an osteopathic internship.

If you match into an advanced ACGME program, find an ACGME internship.

All of the DO anesthesia programs are now linked. You match into the program and that is where you do your intern year as well as residency.
 
actually it is program specific. i interviewed at one ACGME program that said that they would in fact give credit for an osteopathic internship if, hypothetically, i matched into their advanced program and was unable to match into an ACGME prelim or TY. also, i know a classmate of mine is doing an osteopathic internship (PGY-1) with an advanced ACGME position (PGY2-4) in another specialty. it really depends on the program, no matter what field. you can ask during the interview, or you can email the program coordinator or PD and ask ahead of time. hope that helps.

also, Ferrismonk made an important point. from my understanding, if you match into a DO internship (PGY-1), you will automatically get pulled from the ACGME CATEGORICAL programs (not advanced, i THINK??). in my case, because i ranked ACGME categorical programs, i could not rank a DO internship bc if i indeed matched into that internship, then i would be pulled from my ACGME categorical programs (one of which was my top choice). if i had matched into a DO internship, i was told that i could still match into ACGME advanced positions, but i would not be allowed to rank prelim or TYs by themselves in the ACGME match bc that would be a violation (i would end up with 2 internships if i matched ACGME prelim/TY). however, i am not 100% sure about this. since i went ACGME anyways, i never found out for sure. your best bet would be to ask the AOA national matching service or nrmp to make sure because this is really important to find out.
 
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sashIMI said:
actually it is program specific. i interviewed at one ACGME program that said that they would in fact give credit for an osteopathic internship if, hypothetically, i matched into their advanced program and was unable to match into an ACGME prelim or TY. also, i know a classmate of mine is doing an osteopathic internship (PGY-1) with an advanced ACGME position (PGY2-4) in another specialty. it really depends on the program, no matter what field. you can ask during the interview, or you can email the program coordinator or PD and ask ahead of time. hope that helps.

also, Ferrismonk made an important point. from my understanding, if you match into a DO internship (PGY-1), you will automatically get pulled from the ACGME CATEGORICAL programs (not advanced, i THINK??). in my case, because i ranked ACGME categorical programs, i could not rank a DO internship bc if i indeed matched into that internship, then i would be pulled from my ACGME categorical programs (one of which was my top choice). if i had matched into a DO internship, i was told that i could still match into ACGME advanced positions, but i would not be allowed to rank prelim or TYs by themselves in the ACGME match bc that would be a violation (i would end up with 2 internships if i matched ACGME prelim/TY). however, i am not 100% sure about this. since i went ACGME anyways, i never found out for sure. your best bet would be to ask the AOA national matching service or nrmp to make sure because this is really important to find out.
Click to expand...

Which program is that?
 
I think most will credit if you matched advanced and need a TRI to satisfy intern year. I dont know about those who scrambled TRI adn are trying to find advanced residency.
 
I know of several students who did osteopathic aoa ty year, and acgme pgy2 radiology.

I was under the impression that you could match just aoa ty year and not be pulled from the allo. match, this might be a false impression though.
 
redrumi said:
I know of several students who did osteopathic aoa ty year, and acgme pgy2 radiology.

I was under the impression that you could match just aoa ty year and not be pulled from the allo. match, this might be a false impression though.
Click to expand...

you're only pulled from categorical, not advanced progs.
 
categorical = intern year + residency years at one program (i.e. PGY1-PGY4 for anesthesia)
advanced = you do intern year elsewhere, then go to your matched residency program to do your residency (i.e. PGY2-PGY4 for anesthesia)
 
Doctor4Life1769 said:
categorical = intern year + residency years at one program (i.e. PGY1-PGY4 for anesthesia)
advanced = you do intern year elsewhere, then go to your matched residency program to do your residency (i.e. PGY2-PGY4 for anesthesia)
Click to expand...

Thank you Doctor4Life1769. I am still a little confused though. So there are some advanced programs that offer categorical spots while some do not? Let me use radiology for example. Are there programs where if I were to match they would allow me to PGY1-5 at the same program while at others I may have to do PGY-1 at one place and then PGY2-5 at another. And if the latter is the case when you apply for the match, how do you do it? Do you apply for radiology or do you apply for a prelim year and then enter the match again the next year applying for radiology?
 
HappyDO said:
Thank you Doctor4Life1769. I am still a little confused though. So there are some advanced programs that offer categorical spots while some do not? Let me use radiology for example. Are there programs where if I were to match they would allow me to PGY1-5 at the same program while at others I may have to do PGY-1 at one place and then PGY2-5 at another. And if the latter is the case when you apply for the match, how do you do it? Do you apply for radiology or do you apply for a prelim year and then enter the match again the next year applying for radiology?
Click to expand...

You apply for both. Or, you can just apply radiology and try to scramble into a prelim year. I wouldn't just roll prelim (much riskier).
 
HappyDO said:
Thank you Doctor4Life1769. I am still a little confused though. So there are some advanced programs that offer categorical spots while some do not? Let me use radiology for example. Are there programs where if I were to match they would allow me to PGY1-5 at the same program while at others I may have to do PGY-1 at one place and then PGY2-5 at another. And if the latter is the case when you apply for the match, how do you do it? Do you apply for radiology or do you apply for a prelim year and then enter the match again the next year applying for radiology?
Click to expand...

the majority of rads programs are PGY 2-5 advanced programs in which you apply this app cycle for a prelim or transitional year CONCURRENTLY along with the advanced rads program. the prelim/TY year would start (in your case) in july 2012 (PGY-1), and the advanced programs you apply to would start july 2013 (PGY 2-5). when you put in your rank list, you list advanced programs alongside the prelim/TY you want and you'll match into both (ideally) at the same time come march 2012.

there are a handful of 5-year categorical rads programs nationwide. hope this helps.

forgot to add, the above applies to ACGME rads only. i think most (if not all) of the osteopathic rads programs are categorical...
 
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sashIMI said:
the majority of rads programs are PGY 2-5 advanced programs in which you apply this app cycle for a prelim or transitional year CONCURRENTLY along with the advanced rads program. the prelim/TY year would start (in your case) in july 2012 (PGY-1), and the advanced programs you apply to would start july 2013 (PGY 2-5). when you put in your rank list, you list advanced programs alongside the prelim/TY you want and you'll match into both (ideally) at the same time come march 2012.

there are a handful of 5-year categorical rads programs nationwide. hope this helps.

forgot to add, the above applies to ACGME rads only. i think most (if not all) of the osteopathic rads programs are categorical...
Click to expand...

Interested in IM?
 
Doctor4Life1769 said:
awesome. buddy of mine matched radiology, too!
im doing anesthesiology (acgme)... looks like we matched into the best specialties ever. 👍
Click to expand...

congrats, that's awesome!! seriously...can't spell ROAD without those 2, right? hope that still applies by the time we finish residency 😉
 
sashIMI said:
congrats, that's awesome!! seriously...can't spell ROAD without those 2, right? hope that still applies by the time we finish residency 😉
Click to expand...

:laugh:

thanks, so glad it's all worked out 👍

you plan on doing a fellowship? my buddy said MSK was hot... i'm considering either peds maybe cardiac... but not sure at the moment. where u headin for residency?
 
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Do you have to do a Intership with Osteopathy

Ferrismonk said:
I'm a third year at MSUCOM and am

interested in anesthesiology as well. I'll try to answer your question here, but feel free to PM me if you have further questions.

This whole process can be pretty confusing but I'll try to keep it simple. If you match in the DO match (PGY-1 or PGY-2) you get pulled from the MD match. If you either don't match or don't rank programs in the DO match and then match a PGY-1 spot in the MD match, you are set but may need to do "Resolution 42" do get AOA approval for an osteopathic internship. If you either don't match or don't rank programs in the DO match, then match a PGY-2 spot in the MD match, you can then scramble for a DO traditional intern year spot. This scenario allows you to get your osteopathic internship out if the way and still go to an ACGME program.

Again, PM be if you have other questions.
Click to expand...
 
So what are the names of the ACGME programs that will accept an AOA intern year?
 
bigDinLV said:
So what are the names of the ACGME programs that will accept an AOA intern year?
Click to expand...

uhh there's probably a whole bunch and no comprehensive list that anyone has compiled...like i said before, it varies from program to program, and varies from specialty to specialty. you have to ask during the interview. if you take a look at various DO matchlists from this year or past years, you can see if someone happens to be doing an AOA TRI (if they divulge it) + ACGME advanced program. for example i know of 2 ppl doing ACGME advanced PM&R (mayo, something in north carolina) with AOA internships.
 
sashIMI said:
uhh there's probably a whole bunch and no comprehensive list that anyone has compiled...like i said before, it varies from program to program, and varies from specialty to specialty. you have to ask during the interview. if you take a look at various DO matchlists from this year or past years, you can see if someone happens to be doing an AOA TRI (if they divulge it) + ACGME advanced program. for example i know of 2 ppl doing ACGME advanced PM&R (mayo, something in north carolina) with AOA internships.
Click to expand...


Ok, what programs?
 
bigDinLV said:
Ok, what programs?
Click to expand...

umm...did you read my post? 😕 i just mentioned 2. there are thousands of ACGME residency programs in the US. call them yourself or research the rest because i don't have a list, and i don't think anyone has a list.
 
sashIMI said:
umm...did you read my post? 😕 i just mentioned 2. there are thousands of ACGME residency programs in the US. call them yourself or research the rest because i don't have a list, and i don't think anyone has a list.
Click to expand...


I guess I didn't see that. Never knew Mayo accepted an AOA internship.
 
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