Question for aprogdirector

[Ischemia]

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Hello,

Do programs review transcripts and Dean's letters? The Dean's letter seems to contain all that the transcript contains (ie, 3rd and 4th year grades), so why bother with the transcript?

The reason I'm asking is because my transcript just went out with an error on it (HP for subinternship instead of H). It was corrected several hours later, but many programs (too many to email) downloaded the transcript with the HP. I will ask my school Monday morning to correct this by uploading the revised trasncript with the H, but many schools have still seen the HP. The Dean's letter will have the H. I'm applying to very competitive programs and am really concerned that this will significantly hurt my chances.

Would love to hear your thoughts.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Do programs review transcripts and Dean's letters? The Dean's letter seems to contain all that the transcript contains (ie, 3rd and 4th year grades), so why bother with the transcript?

You'd think so, wouldn't you? Sadly, you'd be wrong.

In addition, since transcripts come out immediately, we look at them while dean's letters are not yet available.

The reason I'm asking is because my transcript just went out with an error on it (HP for subinternship instead of H). It was corrected several hours later, but many programs (too many to email) downloaded the transcript with the HP. I will ask my school Monday morning to correct this by uploading the revised trasncript with the H, but many schools have still seen the HP. The Dean's letter will have the H. I'm applying to very competitive programs and am really concerned that this will significantly hurt my chances.

As long as it is fixed quickly, it really won't matter. The new transcript will replace the old, and we won't likely notice the difference.

If you are really worried about it, you can email Progam Admins after the transcript is fixed and alert them that there was an error on your original transcript and a new one has been uploaded. It's probably overkill, but if it makes you sleep better at night....

 

[Hard24Get]

It was corrected several hours later, but many programs (too many to email) downloaded the transcript with the HP.

How could it be too many to email? It's cut and paste... 😕

 

[Ischemia]

Aprog, thanks for the advice.

Too many to email because I am applying for very competitive specialty and many programs (> 30) downloaded it already. It's not really too many to email...could be done, just didn't want to. Probably will though.

 

[mlw03]

wow - that's crazy data in the article aProg linked. i wonder how residency directors responded to it, and if there were any repurcussions against dean's who were found to be habitually omitting negative data about applications.

 

[supereagles]

I had the same problem...A pass rather than honors was added to my transcript but was corrected 10 days later with a new uploaded transcript after it had already been downloaded by virtually all the programs I applied to. I still wake up at night with nightmares about this:scared

 

[Ischemia]

I had the same problem...A pass rather than honors was added to my transcript but was corrected 10 days later with a new uploaded transcript after it had already been downloaded by virtually all the programs I applied to. I still wake up at night with nightmares about this:scared

Did you bother emailing the programs? Have you heard about interviews?

 

[supereagles]

Did you bother emailing the programs? Have you heard about interviews?

Did not email them because I felt that this might draw some negative attention to it. I am also applying in a competitive specialty that is notorious for giving out interviews after looking at the deans letter. None of my friends applying for the same specialty have received interviews so I am not freaking out yet. Did you end up emailing the schools and any replys yet?

 

[Ischemia]

Did not email them because I felt that this might draw some negative attention to it. I am also applying in a competitive specialty that is notorious for giving out interviews after looking at the deans letter. None of my friends applying for the same specialty have received interviews so I am not freaking out yet. Did you end up emailing the schools and any replys yet?

Didn't want to draw attention to it either, but it was a rather significant error that I feel could possibly kill my application. Did email schools - about half had already downloaded it. Response was varied. Some said "make note of it in your file," others said "new transcript has been downloaded," others said "shows up as H."

I don't know. Maybe some programs never printed it so the only thing they can see is the updated one with the H. Maybe others will keep both transcripts in the file with the email directing them to change.

This sucks. No good way to handle it. My specialty doesn't give interview invites until after Dean's letters also. The Dean's letter contains the correct grade. Guess we'll see.

 

[supereagles]

Didn't want to draw attention to it either, but it was a rather significant error that I feel could possibly kill my application. Did email schools - about half had already downloaded it. Response was varied. Some said "make note of it in your file," others said "new transcript has been downloaded," others said "shows up as H."

I don't know. Maybe some programs never printed it so the only thing they can see is the updated one with the H. Maybe others will keep both transcripts in the file with the email directing them to change.

This sucks. No good way to handle it. My specialty doesn't give interview invites until after Dean's letters also. The Dean's letter contains the correct grade. Guess we'll see.

Yeah I might also do that. My question is who do you email..do you email the program director? On the "track application" section...I have two transcripts uploaded and I have no idea which got printed. It might be a problem emailing 50+ schools but I am rather concerned that this might be an application killer but on the other hand I do not want to complicate issues.

How many days in between for both of your transcripts to be uploaded..maybe this would determine how long it takes before materials are printed out. I know I might be trying to over-rationalize but I am sure you understand....

 

[Ischemia]

Yeah I might also do that. My question is who do you email..do you email the program director? On the "track application" section...I have two transcripts uploaded and I have no idea which got printed. It might be a problem emailing 50+ schools but I am rather concerned that this might be an application killer but on the other hand I do not want to complicate issues.

How many days in between for both of your transcripts to be uploaded..maybe this would determine how long it takes before materials are printed out. I know I might be trying to over-rationalize but I am sure you understand....

I searched out each program's website and tried to find a coordinator. When I couldn't find one by email, I called the department and asked for the coordinator. Overall, I emailed about 40 programs this way, having not found 3 or 4 people to contact.

The grade came in friday as incorrect, was uploaded to ERAS one hour before it was changed. Programs downloaded it over the weekend and this morning until the grade was fixed and a new transcript uploaded. I hope the correct transcript is printed. This is really a pretty terrible thing.

 

[DadofDr2B]

You'd think so, wouldn't you? Sadly, you'd be wrong.

In addition, since transcripts come out immediately, we look at them while dean's letters are not yet available.



As long as it is fixed quickly, it really won't matter. The new transcript will replace the old, and we won't likely notice the difference.

If you are really worried about it, you can email Progam Admins after the transcript is fixed and alert them that there was an error on your original transcript and a new one has been uploaded. It's probably overkill, but if it makes you sleep better at night....

I note the report on suppression of information by the Deans was published in 1999. I hope this problem has been corrected.

Would you just ignore a Dean's letter that had continually suppressed negative information? Are there any sanctions?

 

[NotAProgDirector]

I note the report on suppression of information by the Deans was published in 1999. I hope this problem has been corrected.

Would you just ignore a Dean's letter that had continually suppressed negative information? Are there any sanctions?

In my recent experience, this has become less common, but it still happens. Most schools tell me it was a "mistake" -- "hey, we forgot that he failed that class...".

Some schools, esp DO and carib schools, this is a serious problem. A great recent example: I was sent an application from St Georges, one of the "big 4" carib schools. Student had finished rotations in 2004 but grad in 2007, now looking for residency. Delay was because had trouble passing Step 2 -- failed multiple times over several years, finally passed. Dean's letter didn't mention anything about this (nor the multiple failures on transcript), simply told me that he was an "excellent candidate".

 

[Options]

In my recent experience, this has become less common, but it still happens. Most schools tell me it was a "mistake" -- "hey, we forgot that he failed that class...".

Some schools, esp DO and carib schools, this is a serious problem. A great recent example: I was sent an application from St Georges, one of the "big 4" carib schools. Student had finished rotations in 2004 but grad in 2007, now looking for residency. Delay was because had trouble passing Step 2 -- failed multiple times over several years, finally passed. Dean's letter didn't mention anything about this (nor the multiple failures on transcript), simply told me that he was an "excellent candidate".

That is aggravating for students to hear as well. I go to AUC.. one of the other caribbean schools and my school does not edit anything from our deans letter. I had an otherwise flawless application this year and they still added one comment from IM stating I was an "average medical student". There needs to be some sort of requirement for the school to state whether they edit or do not edit the deans letter.

 

[Hard24Get]

That is aggravating for students to hear as well. I go to AUC.. one of the other caribbean schools and my school does not edit anything from our deans letter. I had an otherwise flawless application this year and they still added one comment from IM stating I was an "average medical student". There needs to be some sort of requirement for the school to state whether they edit or do not edit the deans letter.

There is. They say whether they don't edit, edit for length or grammar, and/or edited for content. The problem is when some schools edit out bad comments that are not a pattern for "length", and other schools don't. Honestly, my school edits for length, and some bad comments get filtered out, but so do some great ones. I don't think anyone will care about that one comment in an unedited dean's letter.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

AUC's MSPE (Dean's Letter) clearly states "Some comments from evaluators include:"

It's not clear that it's all-inclusive

 

[Options]

AUC's MSPE (Dean's Letter) clearly states "Some comments from evaluators include:"

It's not clear that it's all-inclusive

Good point... another reason to standardize the language on the deans letter. So now my deans letter looks as if they edit comments when they don't and still there is a questionable comment on there.. great.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

another reason to standardize the language on the deans letter

Ask and ye shall receive.

I have no idea why carib schools do not use this, it would help immensely

 

[Faebinder]

Ask and ye shall receive.

I have no idea why carib schools do not use this, it would help immensely

Mm...I can tell you why they dont use it. Suppose they did an honest mspe... and student #300 from their school was... well lets put it frankly, average in everything.

He applied to your program and another person from country XXX lets say applied to your program and their MSPE was pretty much BS. You will look at the MSPE and conclude that student is no good.. he is just average... look at the other guy and can't conclude a thing about him from it. Whom do you think you are more likely to recruit? The one who is average or the one you can't conclude anything about from their MSPE?

The answer is clear to me... You would take your chance on the second knowing that the first is average while the second might be a "diamond". Hence it's not in their favor to have a good mspe unless their students are garaunteed matching... which is probably why DO schools also dont use em and even some allopathic schools dont use that format fully.

In order to have a good system, you must start by refusing to allow applicants without an MSPE letter with the format required. That would require all residency PDs to agree to this, and we know that wont happen.