Question of the Century: Which schools are pass/fail with no internal rankings?

[Transformers]

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This thread definitely has been addressed before but Im not sure how in depth...heres the question:

Question:
Ignoring those schools that have Honors, High Pass, Pass, and Fail (why? because these are just A,B,C,D essentially), which medical schools in the top 50 usnews rankings are strictly Pass/Fail all 4 years (or perhaps even the first 2 years)...?

Thanks guys...Im not looking for peoples judgement that the first two preclinical years aren't important gradewise for residency...i get that point, ive heard it before...and im not really looking for a debate about whats better or not...im sure some schools may keep a tab secretly and these rankings may come up somehow in the dean of the med school's letter when you are applying to residency programs...but strictly (i know YALE is one of them), which schools are Pass/Fail during at least the preclinical years...or even better, all 4 years?

...I brought up this issue and im not embarrassed by it or not, and im not trying to make any shortcuts in life...i just realize the greater significance that grades will have when you apply to residencies; its just that at P/F schools, correct me if im wrong, the guy who gets that 71% Pass mark on an exam is essentially (on paper) equal to that guy who gets a 95% on the same exam...although that 95% dude will be much more prepared for Step 1 USMLE

 

[ChubbyChaser]

UCLA is the only one i know of....perhaps CCLM.

I actualy think Yale has grades 3rd and 4th year.

 

[Law2Doc]

This thread definitely has been addressed before but Im not sure how in depth...heres the question:

Question:
Ignoring those schools that have Honors, High Pass, Pass, and Fail (why? because these are just A,B,C,D essentially), which medical schools in the top 50 usnews rankings are strictly Pass/Fail all 4 years (or perhaps even the first 2 years)...?

Thanks guys...Im not looking for peoples judgement that the first two preclinical years aren't important gradewise for residency...i get that point, ive heard it before...and im not really looking for a debate about whats better or not...im sure some schools may keep a tab secretly and these rankings may come up somehow in the dean of the med school's letter when you are applying to residency programs...but strictly (i know YALE is one of them), which schools are Pass/Fail during at least the preclinical years...or even better, all 4 years?

...I brought up this issue and im not embarrassed by it or not, and im not trying to make any shortcuts in life...i just realize the greater significance that grades will have when you apply to residencies; its just that at P/F schools, correct me if im wrong, the guy who gets that 61% Pass mark on an exam is essentially (on paper) equal to that guy who gets a 95% on the same exam...

I don't think you are going to find many more than the one or two mentioned. Almost all have honors or some form of ranking.

But it's moot. Because Step 1 is numerically scored, is given far far far more weight than any med school grade in terms of residency, and the guy who gets 95% throughout the first two years of med school is so far ahead in terms of prep for Step 1 than the guy who gets 71 that it's basically going to play out the same. (FWIW, most med schools make the passing line a 70% -- a D will result in needing to retake the class, so your 61% guy fails in med school).

 

[FutureScaresMe]

Stanford was purely P/F for all 4 years with no AOA or any other form of ranking students. I believe this has recently changed as of this next year with 3rd and 4th year clinicals, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[nic2017]

You can always use this website:

http://services.aamc.org/currdir/section1/grading1.cfm

You can search schools by how they grade students.

 

[CCLCMer]

perhaps CCLM.

CCLCM is completely P/F with no internal rankings for all five years, but I doubt this system is really what Transformers had in mind. We don't have any tests or grades at all, so it's not possible to beat the system the way he's describing where someone passing with a 71% looks the same on paper as someone passing with a 95%. Our program uses written evals that ask the evaluators (faculty and sometimes other students) to comment on how well your work meets the specific objectives of nine different competency standards. So if you're marginally meeting the requirements, the faculty and administration will know, and they will intervene if necessary. You might even have to remediate a whole block or clinical rotation if your work is too much below par. It happens.

Transformers, there is no free lunch, and you won't be able to beat the system like that even at a P/F school. Plus, no matter where you go to med school, your dean's letter will still speak to your overall performance as a student. You will for sure be judged on how hard you work, particularly for your clinical years when you're getting written evals. Those evals matter to some extent at any school, but they are especially important at a school like mine that doesn't use shelf exams and doesn't give any clinical grades except pass and fail.

 

[UVAbme2009]

UVa is strictly P/F the first two years. Although I believe there is some sort of internal ranking strictly for AOA.

 

[veaselhaufen]

I was told by UVA students that if the student chooses, his/her class rank can be revealed in the dean's letter.

Is Long Dong or anyone here who can explain the pass/fail all four years system at UCLA. How do they differentiate between students??

 

[VincentAdultman]

This thread definitely has been addressed before but Im not sure how in depth...heres the question:

Question:
Ignoring those schools that have Honors, High Pass, Pass, and Fail (why? because these are just A,B,C,D essentially), which medical schools in the top 50 usnews rankings are strictly Pass/Fail all 4 years (or perhaps even the first 2 years)...?

Thanks guys...Im not looking for peoples judgement that the first two preclinical years aren't important gradewise for residency...i get that point, ive heard it before...and im not really looking for a debate about whats better or not...im sure some schools may keep a tab secretly and these rankings may come up somehow in the dean of the med school's letter when you are applying to residency programs...but strictly (i know YALE is one of them), which schools are Pass/Fail during at least the preclinical years...or even better, all 4 years?

...I brought up this issue and im not embarrassed by it or not, and im not trying to make any shortcuts in life...i just realize the greater significance that grades will have when you apply to residencies; its just that at P/F schools, correct me if im wrong, the guy who gets that 71% Pass mark on an exam is essentially (on paper) equal to that guy who gets a 95% on the same exam...although that 95% dude will be much more prepared for Step 1 USMLE

This just seems so....un-american 🙁

 

[Podalarius]

To my knowledge, the only schools without AOA are UConn, CCLCM, Stanford, Yale, and HMS (I could be very wrong, any others?) - which means everywhere else ranks students, somehow.