Questions re applying to MSWs as well as PhDs/PsyDs

[Mitch Warner]

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Hi all,

As someone applying to both doctoral programs and MSW programs, I'm very interested in hearing the opinions of practicing or aspiring doctoral-level therapists on a few questions I'm really struggling with. I'm guessing some other people applying to both doctoral programs and MSWs may have similar concerns.

1) As someone who is definitely interested in becoming a psychotherapist, I am preparing to apply to several MSW programs, in addition to the PhD and PsyD programs to which I've recently applied. (In my mid-30s with a mortgage, etc., I'm considering the MSW route for financial and time reasons.) Does anyone know which MSW programs in the Northeast are most clinically oriented? With a couple of notable exceptions, such as NYU, I'm having a hard time discerning from many schools' websites just how clinical their focus really is. And within that, again with the exception of NYU, I'm having a lot of trouble discerning programs' clinical orientations (I'm particularly interested in therapy that integrates psychodynamic thinking to a certain extent). Does anyone have any specific knowledge about this topic or know how to get it?

2) Should someone like me who wants to become a therapist really care how clinically oriented an MSW program is, or should I see any great MSW program as a means to an end? In other words, I'm well aware that to become a strong and qualified psychotherapist, I'd need several years of post-MSW clinical training and supervision, so how much would it really matter how clinical the MSW program itself is?

3) Finally, in preparing my MSW applications, I'm also trying to determine whether discussing my clear interest in psychotherapy in general and psychodynamics in particular (as I've done throughout my statements for Psy.D. programs, for example) would be the kiss of death for MSW programs. That is, do I need to essentially "pretend" that my focus is much more clearly on broader community/social/justice issues? As it happens, I care about all those things a great deal, but they're not the principal reaosn I'm going back to school.

The SDN community has been incredibly helpful at every turn, and I'm hoping I can go to that well once more for any advice any of you might have.

Many, many thanks,
Mitch

 

[dakwegmo]

I did some research at one time on MSW programs and found there are basically two approaches to the degree, one is Clinical training the other is Public Policy training. Check the websites, or email the programs to find out if they have different career tracks. As long as the program offers a clinical track, or is primarily clinical in it's focus, then you should get a pretty solid foundation as a clinician. One thing to look for is whether they prepare you for licensure as an LCSW, or provide outcomes data for LCSW licensing of their graduates.

If you're having to pretend you're interested in community/social/justice issues you should make sure you aren't applying to one of the public policy tracks, because these don't really provide you the training to be a therapist.

Lastly, I want to add that a MSW is an excellent degree if you want to primarily do therapy. It's probably the most versatile degree you can get as far as career options after graduation, it usually only takes two years to get, and frequently can be earned part time, or during non-traditional hours. Since time and money are a big concern it might be the ideal degree for you. With a MSW and LCSW you can be earning more money, sooner than most Ph.D's in Clinical Psychology.

There are definitely drawbacks, but if you're interested in therapy the MSW is the way to go.

 

[doctorpsych]

I did some research at one time on MSW programs and found there are basically two approaches to the degree, one is Clinical training the other is Public Policy training. Check the websites, or email the programs to find out if they have different career tracks. As long as the program offers a clinical track, or is primarily clinical in it's focus, then you should get a pretty solid foundation as a clinician. One thing to look for is whether they prepare you for licensure as an LCSW, or provide outcomes data for LCSW licensing of their graduates.

If you're having to pretend you're interested in community/social/justice issues you should make sure you aren't applying to one of the public policy tracks, because these don't really provide you the training to be a therapist.

Lastly, I want to add that a MSW is an excellent degree if you want to primarily do therapy. It's probably the most versatile degree you can get as far as career options after graduation, it usually only takes two years to get, and frequently can be earned part time, or during non-traditional hours. Since time and money are a big concern it might be the ideal degree for you. With a MSW and LCSW you can be earning more money, sooner than most Ph.D's in Clinical Psychology.

There are definitely drawbacks, but if you're interested in therapy the MSW is the way to go.

ok, to my knowledge, MSW start at about mid to low 30's, when they get their LCSW, they get in the 40's, and most that I know top off in the 50's... if they stay in the clinical route. unlicensed psychologists usually start in the 40-50's. Once licensed, they start in mid 60-70's. I know someone who was offered 70's as a newly licensed psychologist. These positions are all salaried. If you go into private practice and do other things such as neuropsych testing, forensic evals, consulting, and med management (with additional training), the potential income for psych is very good. (+100k).

so SW route, shorter training, able to work sooner, but $ capped; psych route, longer training, will have to wait to get paid, but higher $ potential.