Hi guys - So my question for you is this: Does the ABR Alternate Pathway for Rad Onc actually exist or only in writing? Do you know a single person who has become board certified through the Alternate Pathway? Per the ABR, only 14 people have applied and only 7 have become board certified.... since 1998! This seems like a huge red flag to me. I am from Europe and eligible for both the Alternate and Standard Pathways. Does anyone have any insight?
Rad Onc Alternate Pathway??
- Thread starter peach12
- Start date
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2019
- Messages
- 3,495
- Reaction score
- 14,488
How are you eligible for both? For the standard pathway, do you mean you're eligible to apply for (and complete) a US Residency Program?
It's my understanding you need to "declare" your intent to sit for boards via the Fellowship mechanism prior to completing the requisite 4 years. Do you mean you're eligible to declare, or you've already done this?
I personally don't know of any of the seven people who have utilized the Alternate Pathway. I wonder where 50% of the people who try, fail? Probably at oral boards?
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2002
- Messages
- 14,915
- Reaction score
- 8,847
Yes it does exist. I personally know two and I know two on the pathway currently.
The biggest challenge is to find a US institution who will sponsor you.
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2017
- Messages
- 5,013
- Reaction score
- 9,778
That’s so troubling.
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2014
- Messages
- 3,264
- Reaction score
- 6,612
In my experience the people who complete this are often very smart and qualified. It represents a tiny fraction of people. Plenty of trash places pumping out yearly 2-4 residents a year from a so called “respected institution”
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2017
- Messages
- 5,013
- Reaction score
- 9,778
They are very smart, but so are today’s grads from “trash” programs. Even if the program historically sucks, with everything from forums to lectures and Astro online, they still have access to better training than someone from a “good” program 15 years ago.
- Joined
- Aug 23, 2014
- Messages
- 3,264
- Reaction score
- 6,612
That is a fair point perhaps, but im just trying to highlight they represent a tiny portion of people in the workforce. They are not our “enemies” or what we should be focusing most of our energy on. The money is in the contraction and closure of trash programs, for which there are many, unfortunately. the ACGME requirements need to be updated significantly and force this for the good of our field. There is simply no excuse for these sorry excuses of “residencies” to exist in current climate. These are scut heavy zero education places.
This will have the most effect although not enough as @scarbrtj has shown in multiple posts in the past (even if you had zero new residents this would not be enough).
- Joined
- Oct 4, 2017
- Messages
- 5,013
- Reaction score
- 9,778
they are certainly not enemies, but departments that routinely use them for cheap fellowship and attending labor certainly are.
Thanks to everyone for the responses.
Neuronix -- Thanks for letting me know! So, if I understand correctly, you know two individuals who are in the Alternate Pathway and two who are actually Board Certified from it? Did these individuals have an international reputation and were therefore specially recruited by a US Institution?
elementaryschooleconomics -- I (believe I) qualify for both pathways, as I am board certified in Europe, took (and passed) all the USMLE Steps, and have an academic institution that is interested in sponsoring me. To my understanding, the aforementioned qualify me for the Standard Pathway as well. And I would rather go the route that is more "certain," per se. But it's a good question: I too wonder if those 50% who went through the Alternate Pathway but never became BC did not pass Orals, or, did the ABR prevent them from sitting for Boards at all? The latter would be more concerning to me.
Neuronix -- Thanks for letting me know! So, if I understand correctly, you know two individuals who are in the Alternate Pathway and two who are actually Board Certified from it? Did these individuals have an international reputation and were therefore specially recruited by a US Institution?
elementaryschooleconomics -- I (believe I) qualify for both pathways, as I am board certified in Europe, took (and passed) all the USMLE Steps, and have an academic institution that is interested in sponsoring me. To my understanding, the aforementioned qualify me for the Standard Pathway as well. And I would rather go the route that is more "certain," per se. But it's a good question: I too wonder if those 50% who went through the Alternate Pathway but never became BC did not pass Orals, or, did the ABR prevent them from sitting for Boards at all? The latter would be more concerning to me.
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2002
- Messages
- 14,915
- Reaction score
- 8,847
All were board certified in another country first. Varying levels of "reputation" among the four I'm talking about.
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2011
- Messages
- 8,619
- Reaction score
- 10,675
I'm still frustrated that this pathway exists to backdoor into an American attending job without having to repeat residency. Programs love it bc they get an attending on the cheap and can pay them fellow salary. Open in other specialties but other fields actually care about the future.
Aware of one person from a well respected institution who just finished his likely poorly paid indentured servitude and is now going on to become an attending at an academic institution in a major city (unclear if main or satellite). Not 100 percent sure he's on this exact path but nothing else makes sense given his timeline.
Aware of one person from a well respected institution who just finished his likely poorly paid indentured servitude and is now going on to become an attending at an academic institution in a major city (unclear if main or satellite). Not 100 percent sure he's on this exact path but nothing else makes sense given his timeline.
