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deleted1111261
So is your face
I agree with your basic point. Medicare and SS are not in trouble. These are matters of will, not ledgers. Nobody is not going to fund the best thing that the gvt does for the general public, which is to provide a low baseline income to avoid catastrophic poverty in the elderly (common before SS) and healthcare for the elderly. (I think GWB attempted some reform at SS and got hammered years back. Red county America loves SS.)what solvent means
I agree with your basic point. Medicare and SS are not in trouble. These are matters of will, not ledgers. Nobody is not going to fund the best thing that the gvt does for the general public, which is to provide a low baseline income to avoid catastrophic poverty in the elderly (common before SS) and healthcare for the elderly. (I think GWB attempted some reform at SS and got hammered years back. Red county America loves SS.)
Money is mostly make believe.
I don’t disagree. I think @OTN making a very valid point - this was not the goal of the program and some sort of skin in the game for high earners is not unreasonable.
I don't understand.We have 8.5% yoy inflation for reason like Medicare solvency.
We have 8.5% yoy inflation for reasons like Medicare solvency.
The USA is in terrible, terrible financial shape right now, the magnitude of which I don't believe most Americans understand. We have not only $30 trillion in debt, but a total of $170 trillion of unfunded obligations. As long as we remain the world's reserve currency we have a better shot at being ok, but that is by no means guaranteed. If we lose our status as the world's reserve, then we likely would go into a sovereign debt crisis, at which point we would be truly in very bad shape.
No doubt about it.another thing I would like to add is that this conversation has devolved into being about the 'poor' and 'rich' - but the insurance system is absolutely, royally ****ed, even for all us rich people with 'great' insurance plans.
The only reason most of us don't know or care is we haven't had to navigate the health care system or gotten ridiculous amounts of bills for made up things like 'out of network' when we get taken to the hospital via ambulance and have to stay in an ICU.
THAT should be our focus, IMO. the system is designed to NOT work.
If this happens, there will be much bigger fish to fry, like probably war.
until that happens, there's not a lot of real reason to worry about it too much, other than the fact that it makes for a nice infographic for folks who want to pretend that the USA economy is like a household's.
but there are more clear and present solutions to balancing things than 'let's cut basic necessities'
cut defense budget, increase capture from the ultra-rich, cut health care costs (ie, get to the root of the evil, rather than making the average American have to pay more and more and more)What would you like to cut? Keep in mind that as the debt grows and interest rates rise the percentage of the national budget that will go to service that debt will continue to increase.
Tell OTN and medgator to pay their fair share! No reason I should be sharing a tax bracket with these rich folks!
Disliking personal responsibility has unfortunately become a political issue between the parties.... And it's funny how that shook outExactly! If everyone has to buy, then it works.
cut the defense budget and/or raise taxes on the rich are the tells of someone who has never actually looked at federal government obligations/revenue and what it would take to make it solvent.cut defense budget, increase capture from the ultra-rich, cut health care costs (ie, get to the root of the evil, rather than making the average American have to pay more and more and more)
@RickyScott has posted in detail about the fact that under the current system, insurance companies have no desire to cut costs.
cut the defense budget and/or raise taxes on the rich are the tells of someone who has never actually looked at federal government obligations/revenue and what it would take to make it solvent.
Effective tax rates for higher income w-2 earners are among the highest in the country....i assure you I'm paying my fair share.Tell OTN and medgator to pay their fair share! No reason I should be sharing a tax bracket with these rich folks!
Really? The F35 is the poster child of what is wrong with defense spendingcut the defense budget and/or raise taxes on the rich are the tells of someone who has never actually looked at federal government obligations/revenue and what it would take to make it solvent.
Effective tax rates for high wage w-2 earners are the highest in the country....i assure you I'm paying my fair share. Plenty of fat to go after.... Real estate giveaways thanks to the last guy, carried interest loophole for the hedge fund whales etc
There's fat everywhere in the government. But say cut it to zero (including the VA bennies?). Will it balance the budget? Surely the rest of the world will follow suit and we can all sing imagine or kumbaya or some such as everyone hugs it out. We're not living in a Francis Fukuyama end of history fairy tale.Really?
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Chart Pack: Defense Spending
A selection of key charts on defense spending in the United States.www.pgpf.org
Medgator in the loophole club where he doesn’t pay taxes!yeah the medgators of the world or any of us W2 folks aren't really the target.
Sure, but where is value based metrics when it comes to defense spending? What are we getting for the trillions that are behind dumped in? The F35 was ****ing atrociousThere's fat everywhere in the government. But say cut it to zero (including the VA bennies?). Will it balance the budget? Surely the rest of the world will follow suit and we can all sing imagine or kumbaya or some such as everyone hugs it out. We're not living in a Francis Fukuyama end of history fairy tale.
Medicare is a societal good and important social safety net, but let’s not it it twisted. It’s also a massive corporate bailout that allows private insurers the ability to not even think about the highest utilizers of health care during the most expensive time of utilization. It allows these insurers to team the lower utilizing young.
Privatization of profits and socialization of risk and all.
I’m definitely not opposed at this point.sounds like a fantastic argument for single payer system!
No doubt. LCS a disaster. Low intensity conflicts of dubious value across a range of countries (most of which not authorized by congress). The list goes on. All for reorganization and realignment. Given all that, what makes anyone think that a government involvement in healthcare or retirement would be any less full of boondoggles and scandal and waste is beyond me.Sure, but where is value based metrics when it comes to defense spending? What are we getting for the trillions that are behind dumped in? The F35 was ****ing atrocious
I've come full circle to it.... M4A may be the best compromise since we couldn't get RomneyCare to work.I’m definitely not opposed at this point.
Lets do the thought experiment...a truly free market health care system. Hell, lets go full Milton Friedman and get rid of credentialing.what makes anyone think that a government involvement in healthcare
Mostly the gvt creates wealth for already rich people by printing cash. The easy cash and low interest rates of the past 15 years probably contributed greatly to wealth disparity. Debt/GDP for US still far off many global north countries. Debt can go away. Whole countries can default and walk away from debt and what happens? Other countries figure out how to get something when renegotiating terms of debt and allowing for credit to again be established. (In 2008 many fairly well to do folks just defaulted on properties etc. cause it was the best thing to do if they didn't need lots of credit going forward).
I agree it's the prices stupid with healthcare. This is not a mystery. There are some uniquely American problems where solutions have been found elsewhere. Yes, docs will make less.
We don't need people to work longer or harder. Among the myths that are becoming obvious is the myth of productivity. We have long moved past a notion of objective value (the work you put in ) for setting prices. The add revenue from a stupid podcast recapping Office episodes would dwarf all of all salaries. Objective value is limited to a few things (food, housing, healthcare, transportation, sustainability) with most of our economy predicated on totally subjective things. We don't need 68 y/o remote workers.
We do need young people. Open those flood gates to the immigrants!
Lets do the thought experiment...a truly free market health care system. Hell, lets go full Milton Friedman and get rid of credentialing.
First, can the patients tell good value? NO. They're not waiting around to see who has the most 90 year old primary care patients or comparing lumpectomy scars.
Second, could small scale practitioners compete? NO. Consolidation would be even more rampant. Rare ownership physicians with mostly ownership bankers/private equity types selling lowest cost, plausible to the public health care. Huge advertising budgets. Lots of chiropractors, alternative medicine and snake oils. MDACC name would be on everything.
Direct markets just aren't for this sort of thing. Market forces already making our lives as docs more miserable.
If I worked in a free market this is what I would do.
1. Fire 70% of the staff.
2. Bill what I could but less than the competition. Use the cheapest machine possible while promoting it as the best.
3. Market brand name products left and right. "Gators alligator skin cream".
4. Spend lots of time on local TV/radio.
Logical and well thought out.There is no "myth of productivity." Productivity is everything in an economy, especially as it relates to trading with other economies. The value of the dollar is directly related to the productivity of the citizens of the United States, and as as result developing that productivity and allowing it to support the dollar is mission critical. Allowing the US to default on its debt would be catastrophic for at least a generation, if not permanently. What would the interest rate on T bills be if that happened? How much of the US budget would need to be put towards debt servicing, given the extraordinarily high interest rates that would be needed to get anyone to invest in a country who recently defaulted? What would those interest rates mean to consumer borrowing in the economy? The answers to those questions are not pretty.
Prices have never been related to "a notion of objective value" or whatever that means. The price is what the market will bear. You could put an enormous amount of work into a product, but if no one wants to buy it, then the value is zero.
IF we create a monopsony on purpose in the healthcare industry (which single-payer healthcare is designed to do), it will, by design, underpay providers, requiring them to accept below-market value for their services. I'm all for universal care, I just want a multitude of payers in order to protect both patients and providers.
Finally, if recent world events haven't convinced anyone that defense spending isn't necessarily wasteful, then I'm not sure what more can be said. If the F35 is so bad, then what is Germany doing?
Buying yesterday's tech., then I'm not sure what more can be said. If the F35 is so bad, then what is Germany doing?
Quick question... how is this different from the current reality of massive (though not UK etc) levels government involvement? Think you're pinning the tail on the wrong donkey. Maybe need to watch more Uncle Milton videos.Lets do the thought experiment...a truly free market health care system. Hell, lets go full Milton Friedman and get rid of credentialing.
First, can the patients tell good value? NO. They're not waiting around to see who has the most 90 year old primary care patients or comparing lumpectomy scars.
Second, could small scale practitioners compete? NO. Consolidation would be even more rampant. Rare ownership physicians with mostly ownership bankers/private equity types selling lowest cost, plausible to the public health care. Huge advertising budgets. Lots of chiropractors, alternative medicine and snake oils. MDACC name would be on everything.
Direct markets just aren't for this sort of thing. Market forces already making our lives as docs more miserable.
If I worked in a free market this is what I would do.
1. Fire 70% of the staff.
2. Bill what I could but less than the competition. Use the cheapest machine possible while promoting it as the best.
3. Market brand name products left and right. "Gators alligator skin cream".
4. Spend lots of time on local TV/radio.
Buying yesterday's tech.
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Lane Koch: F-35 a $1.5 trillion boondoggle
When a consumer spends top dollar on a new home or car, they want everything to be perfect. Those can be some of the most expensive purchases the average Americanwacotrib.com
Meanwhile, China has already beat us to hypersonic missiles with a fraction of the budget. Value-based warfare. No different than healthcare.
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Hypersonic-Missile Delay Puts U.S. Further Behind Russia and China
The first U.S. hypersonic weapon will be delayed for as long as a year under a new schedule, even as lawmakers protest that the Pentagon is lagging behind in a new technology that Russia has already used in Ukraine and China has demonstrated in a space launch.www.bloomberg.com
I didn't mean that productivity isn't a thing. There are things (and ideas and ad revenue) produced. What I meant is the myth of personal productivity, or in other words, that there is a strong correlate between labor and productivity. (This is what all old school economists presumed). This is decoupled more and more and more and more....in other words, an equal (or greater amount) of productivity can occur with less labor. You can tell what employment markets are absolutely booming, because they are the rare jobs where this decoupling is next to impossible. (elder care, nursing, direct service jobs). We could produce plenty (maybe even more) with less employment. It may be more sustainable (less travel, less consumption). I'm thinking UBI baby! It is interesting to me that there seems to be good hiring for soft information based jobs as well?"myth of productivity."
I agree, but I'm also not sure that this is even possible. We have foreign and domestic debt. None of our lenders are interested in us defaulting. Just pointing out that the debt is just contractual of course, and can disappear (or be renegotiated). Might want to check out Japan's debt/GDP ratio. Nobody wants them to default either. Canada's is not far from hours. Russia's is very low.Allowing the US to default on its debt would be catastrophic for at least a generation
Market value... who the hell knows. More docs, less market value. More linacs, less market value. Less fractions, less market value. What is the real cost of a fraction of appropriately QA'd XRT? More importantly, how cheaply could MDACC administer such a thing? The market value with unregulated providers would undoubtedly be lower than presently negotiated insurance rates and even medicare.IF we create a monopsony on purpose in the healthcare industry (which single-payer healthcare is designed to do), it will, by design, underpay providers, requiring them to accept below-market value for their services.
I'm fine with defense spending being high (although I'm sure it can be cut in half just like health care spending). Research budget could be much higher.Finally, if recent world events haven't convinced anyone that defense spending isn't necessarily wasteful, then I'm not sure what more can be said.
I'm fine with increasing the defense budget if Lockheed and Raytheon can show me they aren't dumping more down a rabbit hole. As much as people complain about wasteful healthcare spending, wasteful defense spending gets a free pass quite often. How much defense spending is going towards cyber these days?I'm fine with increasing the defense budget to catch up in hypersonic missile tech, no problem there.
Hahah. No! No! No! I’m just kidding !Lock him up…I mean make him pay!
Sorry, I digress but for real, companies like Halliburton, Merck, United Healthcare are all able to capitalize big and it’s not like the govt is trying to help. I’m not saying we need to shut down capitalism but there is such a huge gap between the 1% and the 0.1%, much less the bottom 99%. People like Musk, Gates, OTN, and medgator need to give more!
Buying yesterday's tech.
![]()
Lane Koch: F-35 a $1.5 trillion boondoggle
When a consumer spends top dollar on a new home or car, they want everything to be perfect. Those can be some of the most expensive purchases the average Americanwacotrib.com
Meanwhile, China has already beat us to hypersonic missiles with a fraction of the budget. Value-based warfare. No different than healthcare.
![]()
Hypersonic-Missile Delay Puts U.S. Further Behind Russia and China
The first U.S. hypersonic weapon will be delayed for as long as a year under a new schedule, even as lawmakers protest that the Pentagon is lagging behind in a new technology that Russia has already used in Ukraine and China has demonstrated in a space launch.www.bloomberg.com
Russia has already used them in Ukraine... No reason to doubt China in that regard.The problem is I don't believe China. So much fraud when it comes to this stuff.
Also, in general, they replicate tech that we developed and just use cheaper parts.
Look at Russia right now, they have quite a bit of equipment that doesn't work. They supposedly spend a lot on military budget.