Rad Onc???

[ShaveBiopsy]

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I everyone, I'm considering going into rad onc but am not 100% sure what the speciality entails since I haven't done an elective...I'm considering it bc lifestyle is very important to me (im a female and want to have a family and spend time with them) and i think working with cancer patients is rewarding (i know not much interaction in rad onc but heme onc is too demanding of a lifestyle) what do you have to like in order to like rad onc and be good at it. i'm also considering derm. I'm jr AOA, step 1 250s, state school.

 

[arthurdent]

First off, with a name like shavebiopsy, it makes me think you have derm in mind and rad onc is another lifestyle specialty that you might use as a backup.

what to make of this?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=598213

 

[Pewl]

I everyone, I'm considering going into rad onc but am not 100% sure what the speciality entails since I haven't done an elective...I'm considering it bc lifestyle is very important to me (im a female and want to have a family and spend time with them) and i think working with cancer patients is rewarding (i know not much interaction in rad onc but heme onc is too demanding of a lifestyle) what do you have to like in order to like rad onc and be good at it. i'm also considering derm. I'm jr AOA, step 1 250s, state school.

I'd argue that there is quite a bit of patient interaction in rad onc.

Rad onc is all about the research. Before you apply you should get some rad onc research and publications in.

 

[IndyXRT]

If you think that radiation oncologists lack for patient contact, then you really don't know much about the specialty. Rad onc is primarily a patient care specialty. You have to want to take care of cancer patients. If you are simply looking for a lifestyle specialty, then I think dermatology will be more to your liking.

 

[deleted4401]

No need to judge anyone ... whatever anyone's motives are for choosing their specialty doesn't mean they will be a lesser physician. You can love money/lifestyle and still be an excellent rad-onc. Still gotta see patients, read the texts/literature, and pass your boards.

The money is really solid per hour in dermatology and it's good in rad-onc, too, but I think the work is more emotionally challenging in rad-onc, half the cases are palliative. In derm, much is elective and sort of trivial in a medical sense. If you can divorce yourself from the emotionally challenging component of oncology, then maybe it won't be as hard for you. I've found it hard to do that. Both have a lot of patient contact, maybe a little more in derm because you will pack 6 patients into an hour to crank out the RVUs.

In any case, from your old posts, it sounds like you are concerned you won't match into derm since you didn't get great/lots of interviews. Derm is a bit harder to match into than rad-onc, but it isn't that much easier. The board scores/AOA will not be as helpful, but one rad-onc publication could put you in play.

Also consider allergy, radiology, nuc med, anesthesia, optho if the lifestlye consideration is a large part of your decision making.

The only concern I have is that rad-onc has this technical component (physics/treatment planning) and the challenging patients (constant death and dying) that people may not like once they get into it.

Well, once match happens, you'll figure out if you have to make the choice ...
S

 

[IndyXRT]

In my experience (limited though it is), I have found that students who seek out rad onc as one of several possible lifestyle fields tend not to enjoy it very much. It turns out that (properly) taking care of cancer patients can be hard work and require more hours than one was hoping to spend. It tends to be people who truly want to care for cancer patients that flourish in rad onc. I realize this is a generalization and that there are certainly exceptions. Still, for what it's worth, I think the OP might be disappointed with our field.

 

[MHotep]

Also consider allergy, radiology, nuc med, anesthesia, optho if the lifestlye consideration is a large part of your decision making.S

I think people equate lifestyle with overnight call during residency and fellowship. Most of the medicine subspecialties are clinic based and you have a pretty decent lifestyle [lifestyle = ($$$ x hapiness)/workhours]. Medical oncology work hours are not that much different than in radiation oncology (especially in academic medicine). In private practice money is good, and will stay good as long as they can charge for chemotherapy...just imagine if internists could bill everytime someone took lisinopril or metformin.

 

[ShaveBiopsy]

thanks for the posts...yes going back to other posts that i've written on this board...i've applied for derm this year as well as medicine prelims...my main issue right now is that i don't have many derm interviews and i have decided not to rank my IM prelims bc i dont want to do internal medicine...i think it would be better not to enter the match and try to figure out what i want to do that this point...i like derm but its not the only thing i can see myself doing...i am now trying to figure out other lifestyle friendly frields that i might be interested in...i didn't like physics much in college...does this mean i won't like radonc?

 

[medgator]

i am now trying to figure out other lifestyle friendly frields that i might be interested in...i didn't like physics much in college...does this mean i won't like radonc?

You work with physicists. That being said, you will need to master some basic physics for your boards. Your responsibility is the clinical care and management of your patients. While rad onc is certainly a "lifestyle" specialty, that's pretty much where the similarity with dermatology ends.

I love the field of rad onc and the patients I get to work with, and while the lifestyle is nice, it's certainly not the prime reason I dig it. Derm, on the other hand, would bore me to tears to the point where I would consider plenty of other fields first, perhaps even those with a worse lifestyle.

Ultimately, you have to do what you like. While derm programs focus on the numbers and AOA status quite a bit, my feeling is that this is less so in rad onc. People are looking for evidence of your dedication and interest in the field, which would be more apparent by your record of research in the field rather than what you scored on step I etc.

 

[MHotep]

i am now trying to figure out other lifestyle friendly fields that i might be interested in

IMHO most specialties are lifestyle friendly if you don't mind your incoming capping around $250K. Everyone has a very different understanding of the level of income that is comfortable. I think that people flock to dermatology because on average you work 45 hours per week and you get paid $200K+ a year. Well, pathology is quite similar with absolutely no patient contact, no internship, and getting into residency is not competitive. (With your scores you are easily looking at a top tier program...if you have done any kind of research.) Many of the women in my class who have families considered pathology. The difference is that in pathology your salary will cap in the $200K's; in derm you can (and likely will) succumb to the dark side (call me judgmental if you like) and make a lot more.

 

[nod]

there is nothing wrong with picking a specialty due to life style concerns. during my early years in med school, i flipped through a residency catalogue, circled the "easier" lifestyle ones, and then started eliminating them one by one.

i agree with above that you have to like rad onc for a lot more than the life style. we have a lot of patient contact, we see patients almost every day. we follow many of our patients for years after they finish treatment. many of our patients do eventually die of cancer, so emotionally you have to be able to handle that. i found it rewarding to work with cancer patients, i felt like they really had a problem and really needed my help. derm seemed trivial to me (not all of derm, but i felt much of derm was not exactly life or death, and i could not really sit there and pretend to care about many of their problems).

i also think you cannot hate physics. you do not have to love it or even like it, but you have to be able to tolerate it and learn more about it to pass your boards.

good luck with your decision. a good friend of mine is now doing derm, and she only had 1 interview when she applied, and she ended up matching into that program. so all you need is one.

 

[medgator]

i found it rewarding to work with cancer patients, i felt like they really had a problem and really needed my help. derm seemed trivial to me (not all of derm, but i felt much of derm was not exactly life or death, and i could not really sit there and pretend to care about many of their problems).

Exactly how I feel about rad onc vs. derm.

 

[ShaveBiopsy]

yes i also feel like much of derm is trivial...although i really do enjoy the more serious medical dermatology...what is a good way to get involved with research??

 

[nod]

for research, your home program is your best bet, if you have one. i would contact them, say you are considering rad onc, follow them around for a few days, and then talk about research if you are truly interested. most of us in here love rad onc, but it is not for everyone. 🙂

 

[mikedc813]

there is nothing wrong with picking a specialty due to life style concerns. during my early years in med school, i flipped through a residency catalogue, circled the "easier" lifestyle ones, and then started eliminating them one by one.

i agree with above that you have to like rad onc for a lot more than the life style. we have a lot of patient contact, we see patients almost every day. we follow many of our patients for years after they finish treatment. many of our patients do eventually die of cancer, so emotionally you have to be able to handle that. i found it rewarding to work with cancer patients, i felt like they really had a problem and really needed my help. derm seemed trivial to me (not all of derm, but i felt much of derm was not exactly life or death, and i could not really sit there and pretend to care about many of their problems).

i also think you cannot hate physics. you do not have to love it or even like it, but you have to be able to tolerate it and learn more about it to pass your boards.

This was essentially how I went about deciding what field to go into. Don't think that choosing a field partially based on lifestyle is wrong or evil. It's a legitimate factor, but most importantly you have to do something that interests you.

 

[NPR]

i agree with above that you have to like rad onc for a lot more than the life style. we have a lot of patient contact, we see patients almost every day. we follow many of our patients for years after they finish treatment. many of our patients do eventually die of cancer, so emotionally you have to be able to handle that. i found it rewarding to work with cancer patients, i felt like they really had a problem and really needed my help. derm seemed trivial to me (not all of derm, but i felt much of derm was not exactly life or death, and i could not really sit there and pretend to care about many of their problems).

It's actually for the same reason why I found derm so appealing. Different strokes for different folks.

Being involved in palliative care and end-of-life issues are not my strong suits.

 

[medgator]

Being involved in palliative care and end-of-life issues are not my strong suits.

A fair amount of what we do (I'd say >50% at academic places) is definitive/curative.

While we are involved in patients who have incurable diagnoses, we aren't in-patient hospice physicians. Generally these issues are handled by medical oncologists and palliative care physicians.

 

[NPR]

A fair amount of what we do (I'd say >50% at academic places) is definitive/curative.

While we are involved in patients who have incurable diagnoses, we aren't in-patient hospice physicians. Generally these issues are handled by medical oncologists and palliative care physicians.

ahhh i see