Raise GPA vs. Harder Courses

[BobbyBeavis]

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Hello, I am currently at a ~3.5 Overall GPA and a ~3.2 Science GPA. I was planning to get all A's this semester, (besides in Orgo II, probably around a B) but I underestimated Genetics and will probably get a B.

So it is around registration time for next semester, and it is looking like I will take Vertebrate Physiology, Organic Lab, Comparative Vertebrate Anatomy, and Botany. Now, I was wondering with my mediocre GPA, should I take some Upper Division Biology courses that are relatively easier than the above courses, or try to stick with the tougher courses and get average grades in them?

In the upcoming semesters I would have something along the lines of Physics, Histology, Biochem, etc.

Thank you very much!

 

[Papasmurf1234]

Just take the core basic sciences and maybe the 'recommended' ones. Other than that, take the easier classes. Dental schools won't question your motive if you took an "easier" upper div sci class vs a "harder" one. They honestly will not know as the difficulty in each class is highly variable depending on who is teaching it.

 

[sjv]

Just take the core basic sciences and maybe the 'recommended' ones. Other than that, take the easier classes. Dental schools won't question your motive if you took an "easier" upper div sci class vs a "harder" one. They honestly will not know as the difficulty in each class is highly variable depending on who is teaching it.

Agreed, take what you need to complete the required and recommended requirements, the harder classes won't benefit you unless you receive a high grade in them.

 

[BobbyBeavis]

Hey guys, thanks for the responses.

I spoke with my Pre-Health advisor today, and he recommended that I pick up another minor (for instance, in Psychology) so I don't have to have crazy semesters. He believes in me that I can pull up my GPA, but thinks that it would be of best interest to slowly rise it up instead of taking the gamble of taking full out upper-division classes in hopes to get A's in them. I do not have much leeway because I finished my liberal arts requirements early on in schooling.

For instance, instead of taking the Comparative Vertebrate Physiology as stated in my original post, I would take an easier Psychology course.

He also recommended that I pick up some research, as I do not have any under my belt so far.

Don't really have any questions anymore, just posting to let people in this predicament get some ideas. If you all have any comments, I'm all ears (or eyes?)

Thanks!

 

[teriyaki]

Hey guys, thanks for the responses.

I spoke with my Pre-Health advisor today, and he recommended that I pick up another minor (for instance, in Psychology) so I don't have to have crazy semesters. He believes in me that I can pull up my GPA, but thinks that it would be of best interest to slowly rise it up instead of taking the gamble of taking full out upper-division classes in hopes to get A's in them. I do not have much leeway because I finished my liberal arts requirements early on in schooling.

For instance, instead of taking the Comparative Vertebrate Physiology as stated in my original post, I would take an easier Psychology course.

He also recommended that I pick up some research, as I do not have any under my belt so far.

Don't really have any questions anymore, just posting to let people in this predicament get some ideas. If you all have any comments, I'm all ears (or eyes?)

Thanks!

Focus on science classes, you need to raise it up. Your overall gpa is good enough, along with raising sgpa, ogpa should rise to decent stat. You are not far from dental school, GL

 

[stomatology]

Focus on science classes, you need to raise it up. Your overall gpa is good enough, along with raising sgpa, ogpa should rise to decent stat. You are not far from dental school, GL

His advisor probably agrees with that, but he is smart in saying that it's wiser to take 1-2 science classes in a semester and get A's, than attempt to take 4 and get B's.

 

[BobbyBeavis]

His advisor probably agrees with that, but he is smart in saying that it's wiser to take 1-2 science classes in a semester and get A's, than attempt to take 4 and get B's.

Spot on.

Focus on science classes, you need to raise it up. Your overall gpa is good enough, along with raising sgpa, ogpa should rise to decent stat. You are not far from dental school, GL

I wish I could, but I am not sure if I could pull it off. I am proud of myself for taking Calculus and Organic Chemistry at the same time (after having to early withdraw from Calc the semester prior) and passing both, with a B and B+, respectively. But as the advisor stated, it would be of best interest to steadily rise the GPA instead of taking the gamble. He also said that Social Psychology is considered a science gpa course?? Not 100% sure on that, but I'll take his word.

Furthermore, I think I may have to pick up a part time job to help pay for the DAT study materials, the DAT Test, and then later on with applications. I was planning on applying early this Summer and taking the DAT near July, but I was talked out of this plan from one of my peers at the Pre-Dental Society. I now plan on still taking the DAT at the end of July, but then applying the next year (after graduation) so I can apply on the first batch and hopefully get in. I'd continue working my future job and have that pay for the interview/application expenses.

I really appreciate the encouraging words, though. I have been reading these boards for some time now, and it seems as it is hard to come about!

Thanks you all.

 

[slm266]

Minor is psych is worthless and a waste of money. Just buckle down and make the grades... Take as many of the recommended classes for dental school (micro, histology, pathology, advanced physiology, maybe nutrition. Anything that'll count towards science GPA. Psych won't. maybe a 2nd language like Spanish.

 

[stomatology]

I agree with your advisor. We all have to start somewhere and raising a GPA is hard. I'm so happy you passed your Organic Chem 2 and Calculus classes, but you really need to get A's from here on out to raise your GPA. Do the math, a 3.33 (B+) isn't going to help raise your sGPA much. You really need to focus on how to get those 4.0's as much as you can. And you need to make a smart schedule to do it. Please don't take offense to this, but if your school has a study skills tutor, I would go to a session by them in order to improve study skills. Additionally, focus on your goals and study smarter.

Once you get comfortable with taking science classes and the type of effort that is required to get A's, you can probably take more science classes at a time than what you're starting out with, but you need to make sure you have the structure to do well down first (in terms of study skills, knowing how you learn best, time management, etc). Slow and steady wins this race.

Btw, Social Psychology does NOT count as science. However, Biopsychology, Cognitive Psychology, Neuropsychology, Brain & Behavior, and Psychopharmacology not only count as science, they count as biology classes. These specific classes are pretty heavily science-based, which is why they fall under the biology umbrella. If you like neuroscience, you might enjoy these classes!

I've attached the 2014 AADSAS Course List for reference. 🙂

 

[stomatology]

Minor is psych is worthless and a waste of money. Just buckle down and make the grades... Take as many of the recommended classes for dental school (micro, histology, pathology, advanced physiology, maybe nutrition. Anything that'll count towards science GPA. Psych won't. maybe a 2nd language like Spanish.

As I said in my post, a bunch of neuropsych classes do count as biology, no matter what the department.

I found neuropsych interesting, so I've taken a few of these. They definitely weren't a walk in the park at my school, and were basically biology courses. Hey, at least I'll be ready when neuroanatomy rolls around in dental school! 👍

 

[slm266]

May wanna double check to see if aadsas lets you count psychology as science GPA. 3 years ago I thought I remember that it didn't , or maybe that was TAMDSAS

I'd say take a light semester (10 credits) of science classes and do well. If you can't, you might wanna rethink the way you study/your priorities.

 

[stomatology]

slm266, I attached the 2013-2014 ADEA AADSAS Course Subjects in my post to the OP if you're interested in taking a look, though I doubt you would be since it's not actually relevant to you anymore. 😉 In it, the courses I've mentioned are included under Biology with a notation of (Any Dept.), so it doesn't matter what department they are offered in. I wouldn't be surprised if that has changed over the past 3 years or if TAMDSAS does it differently.

Out of curiosity, how would one be able to take pathology, histology, and the more "medical" sciences while in undergrad? At my school those are only offered to the professional students through their professional schools. And I haven't heard of anyone being able to take A&P for example, unless it was taken through the Nursing School/Dept. There are some courses like Physiology or Immunology in the Bio Dept offered in alternate years, but not the others. 🙁

 

[hunterx2]

raise your GPA, of course. The difficulty of courses is subjective, but your GPA is a hard number and is objective.

Do not minor in psych. It's a waste of your time.

 

[stomatology]

Do not minor in psych. It's a waste of your time.

Again, if he can find the right psych courses, it will count as Biology under the 2013-2014 AADSAS Course List, even if it was taken in the Psych Dept.

This is too much of a blanket statement. If you don't believe me, I have attached the course list above. Look at it. The psych courses I am referring to have (Any Dept.) next to them.

 

[BobbyBeavis]

Again, if he can find the right psych courses, it will count as Biology under the 2013-2014 AADSAS Course List, even if it was taken in the Psych Dept.

This is too much of a blanket statement. If you don't believe me, I have attached the course list above. Look at it. The psych courses I am referring to have (Any Dept.) next to them.

I will continue to do what I have been advised by the Pre-Health administration, but will search for some courses that are psychology/biology.

I have been to many workshops on note taking, studying tactics, time management, etc. What they told me was what I was already doing, so I didn't really build any skills. My first semester, which is probably what hindered my GPA, I was still adjusting as everyone else does, but where I have changed is my leisure time. I realize the future is better than the modern, so I can easily miss out on the "best superbowl" to study for my Orgo test last semester. And no, I do not party... ever. I had a lot of fun in High School so I don't really care about the "college experience".... this is my future!

I'd hate to say this is the best effort I can put forth, but unfortunately it may be. I was frightened thinking about my upcoming schedules, but thinking of having a Psychology course (which is still recommended for some D-Schools) to lean back on makes the future brighter. I also only need 2 more Psych classes to pick up for a minor, and I am on a full scholarship anyhow so I am not necessarily wasting money. The way I see it now, is that cool, I can impress them with taking a bunch of hard classes. But then I risk getting poor grades and then they won't even take a LOOK at my application.

Oh, and inb4 "you aren't made for Dental School". Haven't received any negative comments yet but they are to be expected!

Thanks again for the input!

 

[slm266]

slm266, I attached the 2013-2014 ADEA AADSAS Course Subjects in my post to the OP if you're interested in taking a look, though I doubt you would be since it's not actually relevant to you anymore. 😉 In it, the courses I've mentioned are included under Biology with a notation of (Any Dept.), so it doesn't matter what department they are offered in. I wouldn't be surprised if that has changed over the past 3 years or if TAMDSAS does it differently.

Out of curiosity, how would one be able to take pathology, histology, and the more "medical" sciences while in undergrad? At my school those are only offered to the professional students through their professional schools. And I haven't heard of anyone being able to take A&P for example, unless it was taken through the Nursing School/Dept. There are some courses like Physiology or Immunology in the Bio Dept offered in alternate years, but not the others. 🙁

Looks like you're right. Psychology courses count towards non-science GPA, but Biopsychology would count. I have the feeling that those 2 courses he needs for the minor will not be Biopsychology.

At my university I didn't have a problem taking micro, tissue biology with lab (histology), pathophysiology, advanced phys, gross anatomy with human cadaver lab...all as just a bio major.

This is not admission's first rodeo. They look at your course load and can tell when people are taking classes to pad a GPA. 1/2 way thru the game a predent picks up psych minor only means one thing. I don't think it's sound advice that the OP is getting from a pre-health advisor, but they must not think that you can do it like I do. But again I guess if it's 2 easy classes go ahead. I'd rather take 2 classes that count towards science GPA which is weighted more than overall GPA. I'd rather have 3.4 sci /3.5 overall than 3.3 sci/3.6 overall.

Take classes that will prepare you for the DAT, for dental school, and a career in dentistry. Worthless minors often delay the cycle that you apply in by a year than if you just buckled down and took your bios and chems straight thru, took DAT and applied. Competition has only been increasing with every year...

Anyways it sounds like OP has made up their mind.

 

[stomatology]

Take classes that will prepare you for the DAT, for dental school, and a career in dentistry. Worthless minors often delay the cycle that you apply in by a year than if you just buckled down and took your bios and chems straight thru, took DAT and applied.

How many science courses would you recommend people take per semester?

 

[BobbyBeavis]

Looks like you're right. Psychology courses count towards non-science GPA, but Biopsychology would count. I have the feeling that those 2 courses he needs for the minor will not be Biopsychology.

At my university I didn't have a problem taking micro, tissue biology with lab (histology), pathophysiology, advanced phys, gross anatomy with human cadaver lab...all as just a bio major.

This is not admission's first rodeo. They look at your course load and can tell when people are taking classes to pad a GPA. 1/2 way thru the game a predent picks up psych minor only means one thing. I don't think it's sound advice that the OP is getting from a pre-health advisor, but they must not think that you can do it like I do. But again I guess if it's 2 easy classes go ahead. I'd rather take 2 classes that count towards science GPA which is weighted more than overall GPA. I'd rather have 3.4 sci /3.5 overall than 3.3 sci/3.6 overall.

Take classes that will prepare you for the DAT, for dental school, and a career in dentistry. Worthless minors often delay the cycle that you apply in by a year than if you just buckled down and took your bios and chems straight thru, took DAT and applied. Competition has only been increasing with every year...

Anyways it sounds like OP has made up their mind.

I really wish I could do this, but with my track record so far, I don't even think I could. The best I could pull off was all B's, and the only time I had a 4.0 was when I dropped below 12 credit hours (after the early withdraw from Calc)

With Vert Phys, Orgo Lab, Botany, and Comparative Vert Anatomy... I could see myself getting 2 A's and 2 B's at best. If I swapped out the Comparative Vert Anatomy for a Psychology, I think that I could pull off 3 science A's.

Would you still recommend all the sciences? I mean... I think advice from an actual Dental Student is better than a health adviser who isn't necessarily specialized for dental advice.

Thanks again

 

[slm266]

It's been a while but I think I was taking 3-4 science classes with maybe 1 non science general class towards my major. If you're worried about not being to handle a lot a might stick to just 12 credits. If possible I wouldn't take those plant courses unless if it's an easy A.

Eventually you just have to find it in you to do better which will require more effort and probably more efficient studying. Better to make the changes now than flunk out D1 year of DS when you're taking 22 hrs of science/dental. If you're working a job you might have to cut back on the hrs or just quit seeing your friends as often or quit video games. Start recording lectures with your laptop or phone and going over it at home. You can listen to it at 1.5-2x playback with VLC player. Join study groups and teach concepts to others before exams.

 

[dentalWorks]

Hello, I am currently at a ~3.5 Overall GPA and a ~3.2 Science GPA. I was planning to get all A's this semester, (besides in Orgo II, probably around a B) but I underestimated Genetics and will probably get a B.

So it is around registration time for next semester, and it is looking like I will take Vertebrate Physiology, Organic Lab, Comparative Vertebrate Anatomy, and Botany. Now, I was wondering with my mediocre GPA, should I take some Upper Division Biology courses that are relatively easier than the above courses, or try to stick with the tougher courses and get average grades in them?

In the upcoming semesters I would have something along the lines of Physics, Histology, Biochem, etc.

Thank you very much!

both options are good.... but ULTIMATELY what gets people into dental school is numbers (as silly as it sounds).

I would take upper level biology courses (to increase the more important science GPA) and be sure to obtain 3.5+ in these courses.

 

[slm266]

both options are good.... but ULTIMATELY what gets people into dental school is numbers (as silly as it sounds).

I would take upper level biology courses (to increase the more important science GPA) and be sure to obtain 3.5+ in these courses.

*what gets you the interview is numbers/LORs

 

[BobbyBeavis]

*what gets you the interview is numbers/LORs

Yes, I still need to work on my LoRs. I think I have one professor in mind, and I'm 95% sure my family dentist that I shadowed will write one.

I literally go to class, go home, study. Then whenever there is a meeting, I attend those with the clubs I am involved in. I don't party, cut out video games Freshman year... basically school is my life, like it should be. The only time I watch television is when football is on. I always see people say they don't want to see a bookworm, but it's what I need to do to attempt to get good grades. My people skills are already superb, so the interview I am not worried about... just getting there.

What hinders my academics most, besides financial problems, is certainly my chronic migraines. I wake up with them, and they go through the whole day. I keep some pain pills in my backpack just in case I get one, and actually I just had to take some before my Statistics test. Yeah... just an excuse I suppose, but it really is hard to focus with a pulsating headache. I used to have Topamax, but my neurologist won't prescribe it again without going all the way back home and seeing her again, which would need another referral, etc.

But I feel like you all know best, so I will continue on with the tough schedule as was planned. Botany is one of the upper division electives/labs that have to be fulfilled for my Biology major.

If I recall correctly, my Fall semester next year will consist of Biochem, Prokaryotic Lecture Lab, and some other Biology Elective of my choice 😱 that's 12 hours I believe with just those 3 courses, so hopefully I can do it.

 

[slm266]

Just do what you feel like you can handle. Your GPA is ok, I'd say take a load that you feel you can handle maintaining around 3.5, do well on the DAT and you should be fine. Don't worry if you have to take out some small loans for cost of living, and I might consider seeing a Dr in your current location about getting back on migraine meds.