Re: APPIC hours

[Phipps]

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So, I was wondering how important assessment hours are if I apply for internships? I am interested in applying to hospitals but don't want to focus on assessment in my work. Can anybody give me a realistic estimate of hours that would be an okay number for a non-assessment hospital site, from his/her experience maybe? Thx

 

[paramour]

So, I was wondering how important assessment hours are if I apply for internships? I am interested in applying to hospitals but don't want to focus on assessment in my work. Can anybody give me a realistic estimate of hours that would be an okay number for a non-assessment hospital site, from his/her experience maybe? Thx

Check the sites you're interested. Many of them will provide you with a breakdown of how many therapy vs. assessment hours you're expected to have or whether they merely give you an overall count. Many of the sites have a pretty damned low number (unless you get to sites where assessment will be considered a large part of your duties).

Ooor, I can sell you my hours. I'm not going to need them after all. 😉

 

[erg923]

Are you withdrawing from your program?

 

[Phipps]

Are you withdrawing from your program?

No. I am not withdrawing from my program at all. I am trying to figure out how strongly to advocate for testing cases during my upcoming externship at a state psych hospital since I primarily am interested in therapy and research and less in testing.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

No. I am not withdrawing from my program at all. I am trying to figure out how strongly to advocate for testing cases during my upcoming externship at a state psych hospital since I primarily am interested in therapy and research and less in testing.

I think erg might've actually been asking paramour about withdrawing, although I could be mistaken.

Do you feel comfortable with the quantity and range of assessment instruments you've administered? Even if you don't plan on doing much of it after grad school, I definitely think it behooves all psychologists to have a solid understanding of psych testing.

I would say aiming for a minimum of 100-200 f2f assessment hours (very gross ballpark) could be ok, as that should allow you to give a decent array of measures a decent number of times each. That's just my take, though, so take it with a grain of salt, as I don't know what the average successful applicant to less assessment-heavy hospitals looks like.

 

[Phipps]

I think erg might've actually been asking paramour about withdrawing, although I could be mistaken.

Do you feel comfortable with the quantity and range of assessment instruments you've administered? Even if you don't plan on doing much of it after grad school, I definitely think it behooves all psychologists to have a solid understanding of psych testing.

I would say aiming for a minimum of 100-200 f2f assessment hours (very gross ballpark) could be ok, as that should allow you to give a decent array of measures a decent number of times each. That's just my take, though, so take it with a grain of salt, as I don't know what the average successful applicant to less assessment-heavy hospitals looks like.

Okay. ~ 100-200 sounds like a number I should be able to achieve, hopefully. I probably was sloppy with this so far but with two more years externship ahead of me, I can plan accordingly, I hope. The other thought I had: since the slot for assessment hours on APPIC sites id often blank, I wonder what that means: not important, any number is fine? Or why is not being disclosed? That's one reason I was asking for an estimate.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Okay. ~ 100-200 sounds like a number I should be able to achieve, hopefully. I probably was sloppy with this so far but with two more years externship ahead of me, I can plan accordingly, I hope. The other thought I had: since the slot for assessment hours on APPIC sites id often blank, I wonder what that means: not important, any number is fine? Or why is not being disclosed? That's one reason I was asking for an estimate.

If I'm thinking of the right spot, then I believe this is data the programs enter themselves. Thus, they might not have tracked it, might not have bothered including it, or might not have wanted to freak applicants out by listing averages.

It could certainly be helpful for some non-neuropsych folks to chime in here as well, given that I really don't have much of an idea as to what the "typical" non-neuro applicant has in terms of assessment hours. I still think 100-200 for a ballpark minimum sounds inherently good to me, but I could be wrong. What might be more important is that you have at least some exposure to as many areas as possible (e.g., cognitive and neuropsych, personality and psychopathology, structured and semi-structured, interviews and rating forms, etc.).

 

[cara susanna]

What I've seen for most non-assessment or neuro sites is that they tend to lump in assessment and intervention (F2F). YMMV of course.

 

[thewesternsky]

"Word of mouth" around my program is that 150-200 assessment hours is a good number to shoot for for adult mental health sites. You may need more (e.g., minimum of 200) for some child sites or neuro sites.

 

[Ollie123]

Median assessments hours were 148 for applicants in the most recent APPIC survey. This certainly suggests many people are moving on without much in the way of assessment experience. Obviously standards will differ across settings but if that is the median for applicants I'm sure at least some people in that range are going to hospital settings.

I think most places want "some" experience but I don't get the impression many places expect much in the way of assessment experience unless you are applying for neuro, forensics, etc. Truthfully I don't know how they could with those numbers - I'm closer to 250 hours and still consider myself borderline inept with regards to assessment. Yeah, I've gotten some variety and have the basics down (e.g. PAI, WAIS). I'm confident I can pick up a manual and learn to administer/score just about anything. However, there is a world of difference between that and being able to know the best battery to administer to allow you to tease out a particular nuanced aspect of cognition. Its different training, for individuals working with different disorders, operating in what is really a very different world than the one I work in. I've gotten enough exposure to (hopefully) do some basic screening and know when to refer. To me, that seems reasonable for someone not planning on a neuropsych career but we'll see if internship sites agree when i apply this fall!

 

[Phipps]

Median assessments hours were 148 for applicants in the most recent APPIC survey. This certainly suggests many people are moving on without much in the way of assessment experience. Obviously standards will differ across settings but if that is the median for applicants I'm sure at least some people in that range are going to hospital settings.

I think most places want "some" experience but I don't get the impression many places expect much in the way of assessment experience unless you are applying for neuro, forensics, etc. Truthfully I don't know how they could with those numbers - I'm closer to 250 hours and still consider myself borderline inept with regards to assessment. Yeah, I've gotten some variety and have the basics down (e.g. PAI, WAIS). I'm confident I can pick up a manual and learn to administer/score just about anything. However, there is a world of difference between that and being able to know the best battery to administer to allow you to tease out a particular nuanced aspect of cognition. Its different training, for individuals working with different disorders, operating in what is really a very different world than the one I work in. I've gotten enough exposure to (hopefully) do some basic screening and know when to refer. To me, that seems reasonable for someone not planning on a neuropsych career but we'll see if internship sites agree when i apply this fall!

This is really helpful! Thanks Ollie123 and all! It's good to know what to shoot for and since I have two more years before applying for internships...-so far I have only administered two full batteries and have some work to do here, it sounds. At least I now know what I am in for 🙂

 

[PhDToBe]

What was the median amount of intervention hours according to the most recent APPIC survey?

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Median assessments hours were 148 for applicants in the most recent APPIC survey. This certainly suggests many people are moving on without much in the way of assessment experience. Obviously standards will differ across settings but if that is the median for applicants I'm sure at least some people in that range are going to hospital settings.

I think most places want "some" experience but I don't get the impression many places expect much in the way of assessment experience unless you are applying for neuro, forensics, etc. Truthfully I don't know how they could with those numbers - I'm closer to 250 hours and still consider myself borderline inept with regards to assessment. Yeah, I've gotten some variety and have the basics down (e.g. PAI, WAIS). I'm confident I can pick up a manual and learn to administer/score just about anything. However, there is a world of difference between that and being able to know the best battery to administer to allow you to tease out a particular nuanced aspect of cognition. Its different training, for individuals working with different disorders, operating in what is really a very different world than the one I work in. I've gotten enough exposure to (hopefully) do some basic screening and know when to refer. To me, that seems reasonable for someone not planning on a neuropsych career but we'll see if internship sites agree when i apply this fall!

This is exactly the level of competence I was describing above when I mentioned that all psychologists should have adequate training in assessment. With at least the minimal level of exposure, while you might not necessarily feel comfortable administering all measures, you do pick up on general trends while also learning which measure characteristics are important to examine.

I certainly would agree that you ("you" in the general sense, not you specifically, Ollie) wouldn't be qualified or competent to administer a neuropsychological assessment after 100-200 f2f assessment hours. But as you've mentioned, it's this level of exposure that would allow you to now better appreciate the limits of your training, to perhaps better understand cases that might represent the most appropriate referrals, and to better "digest" the results of such referrals.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

What was the median amount of intervention hours according to the most recent APPIC survey?

http://www.appic.org/Match/MatchStatistics/ApplicantSurvey2011Part1.aspx

For 2011 (I couldn't find a more recent survey posted), it was 573.

 

[paramour]

Are you withdrawing from your program?

I think erg might've actually been asking paramour about withdrawing, although I could be mistaken.

Not sure if this was intended for me, but, if so, this is indeed my final semester.

 

[erg923]

Not sure if this was intended for me, but, if so, this is indeed my final semester.

Sorry. Hope you find your calling soon. 🙂

 

[thewesternsky]

Not sure if this was intended for me, but, if so, this is indeed my final semester.

I'm sorry to hear that. Your comments to me were really helpful in my early days on this forum... I was applying to clinical Ph.D. programs after doing an M.A. in experimental psych, and it was nice to hear from someone else who had already done that successfully. I can't imagine having to leave a program after so much work, but it sounds as though it's the best thing for you now.

Best wishes, and I hope you stick around SDN still.

 

[cara susanna]

I'm sorry to hear that as well, paramour. Like the others I also found your comments very helpful.

 

[PhDToBe]

http://www.appic.org/Match/MatchStatistics/ApplicantSurvey2011Part1.aspx

For 2011 (I couldn't find a more recent survey posted), it was 573.

Thanks!