Reality Check - Future in Ortho?

[Playmakur42]

Hello Everyone,

I am trying to be as pragmatic as possible and am in search of some informed opinions. I appreciate brutal honesty over subtlety.

I am 27 and have decided to take the MCAT and pursue a career in Ortho Surgery. My GPA is low (3.0 overall/3.1 science). I played 1-AA football which required 6 hours/day of prax/meetings/film study/lifting in season and 4 hours/day out of season. As a result, my off-season GPA was about a 3.3 and in season GPA was horrific. I regret applying myself more to sports than academics, but thats water under the bridge. I have a few things to pad my resume (Starting LB & made Academic All-Conference all 4 years, SAAC, blah blah) and a very strong work resume in an unrelated field (sales). I plan on applying myself fully to studying for the MCAT and expect an above average score - I need it!

1.) Are these numbers realistic to be accepted to an MD/DO school?
2.) If accepted, will the college GPA negatively affect my pursuit of a career in Ortho Surgery?
3.) Is there any leeway given to former athletes when trying to get into Ortho? I was informed from an Orthopod friend that the stereotype of an orthopod is a "jocky" type of guy. (I was the jock who the other jocks tried to cheat off of in Anatomy class.)
4.) Any other advice on how best to position myself to get accepted & get into Ortho would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance to all who take the time to reply.

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[iwantneurosurg]

Hello Everyone,

I am trying to be as pragmatic as possible and am in search of some informed opinions. I appreciate brutal honesty over subtlety.

I am 27 and have decided to take the MCAT and pursue a career in Ortho Surgery. My GPA is low (3.0 overall/3.1 science). I played 1-AA football which required 6 hours/day of prax/meetings/film study/lifting in season and 4 hours/day out of season. As a result, my off-season GPA was about a 3.3 and in season GPA was horrific. I regret applying myself more to sports than academics, but thats water under the bridge. I have a few things to pad my resume (Starting LB & made Academic All-Conference all 4 years, SAAC, blah blah) and a very strong work resume in an unrelated field (sales). I plan on applying myself fully to studying for the MCAT and expect an above average score - I need it!

1.) Are these numbers realistic to be accepted to an MD/DO school?
2.) If accepted, will the college GPA negatively affect my pursuit of a career in Ortho Surgery?
3.) Is there any leeway given to former athletes when trying to get into Ortho? I was informed from an Orthopod friend that the stereotype of an orthopod is a "jocky" type of guy. (I was the jock who the other jocks tried to cheat off of in Anatomy class.)
4.) Any other advice on how best to position myself to get accepted & get into Ortho would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance to all who take the time to reply.

im no expert, but after spending time on the forums, i can predict the responses:

1. realistic? possibly. great board scores and you stand a chance at maybe getting into a DO school. stellar - and maybe you got a chance at MD. go for it, you never know unless u try. and pull ur grades up now.
2. no. residencies look at your med school work mostly, not college. do well in med school.
3. not really. residencies accept on merit. of course, the interview plays a role and if ur interviewer was jocky too and likes you, hey, more power to you. but yes, ortho does have the stereotype of jocks which i'm sure would lead you in that direction; but don't expect free brownie points for it.
4. take it one step at a time. first get into a medical school. do well in medical school, do research, then look for ortho residency. try to get into MD as attaining ortho DO is more difficult.

 

[RxnMan]

1.) I am a statistical anomaly w/r/t med school admissions, but I'll tell you that you need a 3.0 GPA before folks will really start to look at your application. Beyond that, there's a lot of good info in the Non-Trad and Re-applicant forums. Try searching in there. A lot of people there are in the same situation as you.
2.) Nobody cares about ugrad GPA once you get into med school.
3.) Maybe. The prime determinants of getting into ortho (as told to me,) are USMLE scores, med school grades (clinical and pre-clinical), class rank, and letters of reccommendation from your med school. After all that, then secondary factors (having a grad degree, doing research, and being an athelete,) come into play.
4.) See my answers to 2 and 3. Get into med school first. You'll need to get some clinical exposure anyways, so take a look around - ortho happens to be one of many fields in medicine.

 

[thejesus]

im sure you've considered this already... but even if you start med school this august, you wont start making real money until you're 36 or 37. depending on your current financial circumstances (existing debt, wife, kids, etc), you may seriously want to reconsider. not only that, but going to med school isnt going to get you into ortho. its just the first step. that might really suck if you dont get what you want...

my advice to anyone who is interested in medicine, but for one reason or another, med school isnt a good fit-- go to PA school. youll get to do surgery, get to write prescriptions, make decent cash (100K$+), not near the liability, and youre done in 3 years. plus, its not all nearly that competitive.

that said, the oldest first year med student last year was 50 something... i have a friend too with very similar circumstances... with a baby girl on the way who is going into ortho. so, it can be done. but its a decision that cant be taken lightly... once you've committed the first 40K$, youre kind of stuck.

at least take the MCAT... thats a good starting point... it will at least give you some more info. if you get a 20, then the decision is pretty much made for you. if you get a good score, then you'll likely get in and also do well on step I (0.65 correlation).

 

[Playmakur42]

This isn't about money. If it was I would stay the course of what I'm doing. I enjoy the science of medicine.

Physician assistant is not for me.

 

[gawtti]

thejesus, are you saying that being 40 after an ortho residency isn't advisable? if so, why not? i'm asking this because i too am interested in a career in ortho. i'll be 32 when i graduate but because i'm an img i think i'm going into ortho research after i graduate to make some connections in the field and improve my chances of landing an ortho residnecy. since, imgs have a hard time getting into an ortho residency straight after med school. so i won't enter the match until i'm 34-35. plus 5 years of residency. that puts me at 40 before i start making some real bucks. btw, how long after residency will one be banking 200k+? because i'll have a 120k loan after i graduate from med school...hahaha. thanks in advance.

 

[allendo]

im no expert, but after spending time on the forums, i can predict the responses:

1. realistic? possibly. great board scores and you stand a chance at maybe getting into a DO school. stellar - and maybe you got a chance at MD. go for it, you never know unless u try. and pull ur grades up now.
2. no. residencies look at your med school work mostly, not college. do well in med school.
3. not really. residencies accept on merit. of course, the interview plays a role and if ur interviewer was jocky too and likes you, hey, more power to you. but yes, ortho does have the stereotype of jocks which i'm sure would lead you in that direction; but don't expect free brownie points for it.
4. take it one step at a time. first get into a medical school. do well in medical school, do research, then look for ortho residency. try to get into MD as attaining ortho DO is more difficult.

Remember there are just as many D.O. ortho residencies as M.D.

 

[Hardbody]

Remember there are just as many D.O. ortho residencies as M.D.

I really don't mean to pick on you, but your statement is false. If there were just as many D.O. Ortho residencies as M.D., then at least half of all D.O.'s would be Orthopods.

That being said, I think I know what you meant. Statistically approximately 5% of all D.O.'s are Othopods (either went through Osteo or Allo residency), the percentage of M.D.'s that are Orthopods is approximately 5% also.

 

[thejesus]

sounds like youve made up your mind already and dont really need other peoples opinions. if you know what you want, then go for it.

and dont kid yourself... if it weren't for the money, there wouldnt be ppl going into the fields they are... or for medicine at all for that matter. not that the other factors dont matter... but money is important.

my point about age is more so about willingness to sacrifice... i feel like ive already given a lot to the profession... i wouldnt be able to do it if i were older... thats just me. maybe im weaker, less motivated, or whatever... call me what you want, but everyone has a breaking point. i guess my niavete, idealism, and impetuousness evaporated prematurely... which is what i feel really qualifies me for a career in surgery--cynicism. kind of like how being a jock qualifies you for ortho (which it doesnt).

as for settling by becoming a PA... besides being somewhat condescending (which i admire), is an interesting point. what happens when you get into med school, but get only a 205 on step I? thats a deal breaker man. how are you going to reconcile the fact that you wont be doing what you longed to do then? do a g-surg residency and apply again to ortho when youre 45?

again, my advice... at the very least take the MCAT before you do anything. that might make the decision for you. too much speculation can be a bad thing.

 

[Hardbody]

I am 27 and have decided to take the MCAT and pursue a career in Ortho Surgery. My GPA is low (3.0 overall/3.1 science).

Welcome to the wannabe Ortho club. The thing about medicine is, you have to be a little open minded because even with hard work, you never know what specialties you will be competitive for. If you can handle being a primary care doctor if the ortho thing doesn't work out, or a general surgeon, you will be fine. You will end up putting too much pressure on yourself if you don't. Good luck with your pursuit in medicine!

 

[TxMed]

to the op...at this time you should forget about anything ortho and bust your a$$ to get into an allopathic medical school. once you get in find a little place in the back of your mind and put ortho there...b/c for the first 2 years the rest of your brain is going to be filled with things that have very little to do with what you will eventually do as a clinician. here's a great timeline that was given to me.

nowo anything to get into medical school
m1 & m2 year: do anything to get your desired step 1 score (at least 220 for ortho, 230 or higher will make your chances much greater)
m3: honor every rotation you can and figure out what you wanna do (this is where you can start digging ortho out of the back of your mind)
m4: get great recs from away rotations and kick some a$$ on the interview trail

other than your grades, you sound like a good guy. work hard and you will not only get into medical school, but you will land any specialty that you want.

 

[Playmakur42]

Thanks to everyone for the great advice & minimal flippancy.... it is appreciated & very helpful.

Hardbody's last post got me thinking a bit..... is it easier to get into a GS residency than Ortho? If so, Why? And why are GS's paid less than Ortho's?

It seems like GS's deal with more very ill patients and their surgeries are often in closer proximity to anatomy that, if accidentally damaged, could be catastrophic. From what I've read on this site, their lifestyles are worse also. Based on that, it seems they should be compensated accordingly. Am I misinformed? If I'm wrong here, let me know....

 

[Hardbody]

Hardbody's last post got me thinking a bit..... is it easier to get into a GS residency than Ortho? If so, Why? And why are GS's paid less than Ortho's?

It sure is easier to get a GS residency than Ortho. Orthopods are the ROCKSTARS of medicine!

A GS residency opens up doors (especially if you are good) to do fellowships afterward to specialize. If you do a fellowship (usually 2 additional years to the 5 year GS residency) you will be "in the money". If you want to get paid big in medicine it is all about sub-specializing!

 

[sscooterguy]

Thanks to everyone for the great advice & minimal flippancy.... it is appreciated & very helpful.

Hardbody's last post got me thinking a bit..... is it easier to get into a GS residency than Ortho? If so, Why? And why are GS's paid less than Ortho's?

It seems like GS's deal with more very ill patients and their surgeries are often in closer proximity to anatomy that, if accidentally damaged, could be catastrophic. From what I've read on this site, their lifestyles are worse also. Based on that, it seems they should be compensated accordingly. Am I misinformed? If I'm wrong here, let me know....

GS may be "easier" to get into because of many factors. I think it has little to do with amount of money you make or what you operate on. Its how many people want how many spots are available. Interest in ortho has exploded in the last 10-15 years. Anatomy, tools, techniques, advances in sports related medicine, salary, success stories in sports surgery have all contributed to the desireablity of the field. Whatever it is, there are about 500 residency spots (source: Iserson's Guide to Getting into Residency), and about 1500 categorical Gen Surg spots.

Now this year may or may not have been an anomaly, but after the match, there was ONLY ONE categorical gen surg spot left unmatched. Some top students at my school matched into lower tier programs this year, yes a few went to NYU, Emory, etc, but many all around excellent and academically strong students went to "strong community programs" (which at least for them was somewhat of a let down). That sounds pretty darn competative to me.

sscooterguy